WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:08.880 transitional radio for planet Earth. You are tuned to KMUD Garberville 91.1 FM KMUE Eureka 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:18.720 88.1 FM KLAI Laytonville 90.3 FM FM translator K258BQ heard at 99.5 on your FM dial in Shelter 00:00:18.720 --> 00:00:24.000 Cove and worldwide we are everywhere on the world wide web the information super highway 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:31.200 faster than the speed of sound at KMUD.org the time is seven o'clock you are tuned to ask your 00:00:31.200 --> 00:00:35.840 herb doctor support for KMUD comes from listeners like you and from Chautauqua Natural Foods locally 00:00:35.840 --> 00:00:40.880 owned for over 25 years they specialize in local and organic produce natural groceries nutritional 00:00:40.880 --> 00:00:44.800 supplements and body care products Chautauqua Natural Foods is open Monday through Saturday 00:00:44.800 --> 00:00:51.600 from 9 to 7 Sunday from 10 to 5 just off the town square in Garberville and support for KMUD comes 00:00:51.600 --> 00:00:58.320 from Midnight Arrow Unlimited anything anywhere anytime Dave Sky A&P at Garberville Airfield the 00:00:58.320 --> 00:01:05.440 next voice you hear will be the herb doctor live from Studio B in Redway California 00:01:05.440 --> 00:01:34.540 [Music] 00:01:34.540 --> 00:01:40.740 [Music] 00:01:40.740 --> 00:01:46.220 Well good evening and welcome to this 00:01:46.220 --> 00:01:48.420 month's Ask Your Herb Doctor. My name is 00:01:48.420 --> 00:01:50.420 Andrew Murray. For those of you who 00:01:50.420 --> 00:01:52.020 perhaps have never listened to the shows 00:01:52.020 --> 00:01:54.020 which run every third Friday of the month 00:01:54.020 --> 00:01:57.020 from 7 to 8 p.m. we're both licensed 00:01:57.020 --> 00:01:58.860 medical herbalists. We trained and 00:01:58.860 --> 00:02:00.900 graduated in England with a master's 00:02:00.900 --> 00:02:02.700 degree in herbal medicine and we run a 00:02:02.700 --> 00:02:04.500 clinic in Garboville here in California 00:02:04.500 --> 00:02:06.300 that has a wide range of conditions and 00:02:06.300 --> 00:02:08.700 recommend herbal medicine and dietary 00:02:08.700 --> 00:02:11.600 advice. So you're listening to Ask Your 00:02:11.600 --> 00:02:15.640 Herb Doctor on KMUD Garboville 91.1 FM 00:02:15.640 --> 00:02:18.140 and from 7.30 until the end of the show 00:02:18.140 --> 00:02:20.140 at 8 o'clock you're invited to call in 00:02:20.140 --> 00:02:22.080 with any questions either related or 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:24.320 unrelated to this month's subject of 00:02:24.320 --> 00:02:26.860 thinking outside the box and the 00:02:26.860 --> 00:02:29.120 relevance of thinking outside the box is 00:02:29.120 --> 00:02:32.160 novel and new approaches to cancer 00:02:32.160 --> 00:02:34.460 treatment. Definitely thinking outside 00:02:34.460 --> 00:02:36.620 the box rather than a deterministic 00:02:36.620 --> 00:02:40.900 viewpoint of killing cancer cells. So 00:02:40.900 --> 00:02:43.000 number here if you live in the area is 00:02:43.000 --> 00:02:45.960 923 3911 or if you live outside the area 00:02:45.960 --> 00:02:50.200 toll free number is 1-800-KMUD-RAD. So 00:02:50.200 --> 00:02:51.500 people that listen to the show tonight 00:02:51.500 --> 00:02:55.400 who either have or know people who have 00:02:55.400 --> 00:02:58.420 diagnosis of cancer could be very 00:02:58.420 --> 00:02:59.920 relevant to those people listening and 00:02:59.920 --> 00:03:01.420 I'd encourage you to call in with any 00:03:01.420 --> 00:03:04.280 questions that you might want to put to 00:03:04.320 --> 00:03:06.560 either myself or Dr. Peat about this 00:03:06.560 --> 00:03:10.860 month's show. So cancer then has 00:03:10.860 --> 00:03:12.920 traditionally been viewed as something 00:03:12.920 --> 00:03:16.960 to destroy and to this end the mainstream 00:03:16.960 --> 00:03:19.460 of treatment is either what's known as 00:03:19.460 --> 00:03:22.340 cytotoxic cell killing drugs which 00:03:22.340 --> 00:03:25.300 poison the body or this directed focused 00:03:25.300 --> 00:03:28.340 radiation which does no better. It's all 00:03:28.340 --> 00:03:31.540 sidle that is it kills the cells 00:03:31.540 --> 00:03:34.280 directly and with also the associated 00:03:34.280 --> 00:03:36.740 collateral damage and inflammation that 00:03:36.740 --> 00:03:38.040 comes from the treatment either 00:03:38.040 --> 00:03:41.040 widespread or localized. Now the 00:03:41.040 --> 00:03:42.680 evolution of thinkers who challenge 00:03:42.680 --> 00:03:45.180 dogma has always hailed new 00:03:45.180 --> 00:03:47.960 breakthroughs in our understanding and 00:03:47.960 --> 00:03:49.760 novel approaches to cancer treatment are 00:03:49.760 --> 00:03:52.100 also making themselves known. The 00:03:52.100 --> 00:03:55.020 co-discoverer a Nobel Prize winner James 00:03:55.020 --> 00:03:57.760 Watson recently made some observations 00:03:57.760 --> 00:03:59.440 regarding cancer in its treatment and 00:03:59.440 --> 00:04:01.740 these have again been taken further and 00:04:01.740 --> 00:04:04.140 are very much outside the box theory has 00:04:04.160 --> 00:04:07.700 emerged and Dr. Peat then he joins us in 00:04:07.700 --> 00:04:09.980 a moment here will be asking him for his 00:04:09.980 --> 00:04:12.680 his viewpoint on it because he's very 00:04:12.680 --> 00:04:15.440 much an outside the box thinker as most 00:04:15.440 --> 00:04:17.120 of you perhaps have tuned into him of 00:04:17.120 --> 00:04:21.420 recognized. Now most people are under the 00:04:21.420 --> 00:04:24.960 mistaken belief and myself included that 00:04:24.960 --> 00:04:29.960 antioxidants are always good for you in 00:04:29.960 --> 00:04:33.560 the diet the more the better. So but this 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:35.340 is not true and sometimes these very 00:04:35.340 --> 00:04:38.240 antioxidants can fuel cancer metabolism. 00:04:38.240 --> 00:04:42.180 So again let's have some lateral 00:04:42.180 --> 00:04:45.080 thinking here and get our heads around 00:04:45.080 --> 00:04:46.880 some of that I know it's going to be a 00:04:46.880 --> 00:04:48.020 little bit heavy for some people 00:04:48.020 --> 00:04:49.420 perhaps if they're not really science 00:04:49.420 --> 00:04:52.380 minded but Dr. Peat will hopefully 00:04:52.380 --> 00:04:55.420 outline the questions that I put to him 00:04:55.420 --> 00:04:59.120 so far as the physiology and the 00:04:59.120 --> 00:05:02.300 chemistry of the what we call the radox 00:05:02.320 --> 00:05:04.260 system in the body the reduction 00:05:04.260 --> 00:05:06.600 oxidation processes that are so 00:05:06.600 --> 00:05:08.400 important and necessary for regular 00:05:08.400 --> 00:05:11.140 cell functioning to to occur and then 00:05:11.140 --> 00:05:14.400 once we elucidate the radox activity 00:05:14.400 --> 00:05:16.000 within the body we can also understand 00:05:16.000 --> 00:05:18.340 better some of the novel approaches to 00:05:18.340 --> 00:05:22.520 cancer treatment. So what is it what 00:05:22.520 --> 00:05:25.520 rather what it is that we thought we 00:05:25.520 --> 00:05:26.680 understood about cancer and 00:05:26.680 --> 00:05:29.060 antioxidants for example and in what 00:05:29.060 --> 00:05:30.620 context then does the latest 00:05:30.660 --> 00:05:32.460 understanding shed new light on the 00:05:32.460 --> 00:05:36.000 subject. So firstly Dr. Peat thanks so 00:05:36.000 --> 00:05:40.000 much for joining us again. Hi Dr. Peat. 00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:43.500 Hi I'm here. No problem okay so as always 00:05:43.500 --> 00:05:46.000 just to introduce yourself your 00:05:46.000 --> 00:05:48.620 professional academic background to give 00:05:48.620 --> 00:05:50.040 people who perhaps have never listened 00:05:50.040 --> 00:05:52.680 to you before an understanding of where 00:05:52.680 --> 00:05:59.060 your research merits are. Okay 1968 I 00:05:59.080 --> 00:06:02.420 had been studying more or less 00:06:02.420 --> 00:06:05.920 independently biology and a lot of 00:06:05.920 --> 00:06:10.240 related fields but 1968 I decided to go 00:06:10.240 --> 00:06:12.840 to graduate school for a PhD and 00:06:12.840 --> 00:06:18.380 graduated there in 1972 specializing in 00:06:18.380 --> 00:06:22.380 reproductive aging and oxidative changes 00:06:22.380 --> 00:06:27.780 and it was the oxidative metabolism 00:06:27.820 --> 00:06:34.260 that I saw changing with aging which was 00:06:34.260 --> 00:06:39.300 really against the grain already at that 00:06:39.300 --> 00:06:45.160 time I saw an increase of reductive 00:06:45.160 --> 00:06:48.940 activity with aging for example you can 00:06:48.940 --> 00:06:53.200 put a dye in young tissue and old tissue 00:06:53.240 --> 00:07:01.480 and reductive enzymes fueled by the 00:07:01.480 --> 00:07:04.320 energy producing system and the 00:07:04.320 --> 00:07:08.620 internal antioxidant system is part of 00:07:08.620 --> 00:07:12.360 it. The older tissue reduced the dye 00:07:12.360 --> 00:07:16.320 much more energetically looking like it 00:07:16.320 --> 00:07:19.460 was more alive for example you can test 00:07:19.500 --> 00:07:23.300 the vitality of any tissue by the 00:07:23.300 --> 00:07:27.300 intensity of staining of this 00:07:27.300 --> 00:07:34.080 tetrazoleum chemical and I found that an 00:07:34.080 --> 00:07:36.940 overdose of estrogen or deficiency of 00:07:36.940 --> 00:07:42.380 vitamin E or any serious injury such as 00:07:42.380 --> 00:07:46.380 x-rays will increase the ability of the 00:07:46.420 --> 00:07:51.820 tissue to stain this dye so aging and 00:07:51.820 --> 00:07:56.820 these various injuries all increased the 00:07:56.820 --> 00:08:01.200 reductive activity of the tissue which 00:08:01.200 --> 00:08:04.460 involves what are called the 00:08:04.460 --> 00:08:09.040 anti-oxidative enzyme defense systems 00:08:09.040 --> 00:08:12.840 and that was what got me interested in 00:08:12.880 --> 00:08:16.780 the fact that cancer is very rich in 00:08:16.780 --> 00:08:22.220 anti-oxidative defenses not only the 00:08:22.220 --> 00:08:26.120 enzymes with a lot of specific chemicals 00:08:26.120 --> 00:08:30.520 that will act as antioxidants at that 00:08:30.520 --> 00:08:33.200 time people were trying to identify the 00:08:33.200 --> 00:08:37.000 specific chemicals that cancers used to 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:40.440 defend themselves against oxidative 00:08:40.460 --> 00:08:44.340 poisons the chemotherapy and and 00:08:44.340 --> 00:08:48.740 radiation oxidative damage but over the 00:08:48.740 --> 00:08:54.240 last 40 years it has developed that it 00:08:54.240 --> 00:08:56.680 isn't just a simple chemical that they 00:08:56.680 --> 00:09:01.220 produce defensively but the very basic 00:09:01.220 --> 00:09:04.260 life processes are shifted in that 00:09:04.260 --> 00:09:09.200 direction which increases the reductive 00:09:09.220 --> 00:09:12.760 or anti-oxidative staining of this 00:09:12.760 --> 00:09:16.300 tetrazoleum and dye just as an indicator 00:09:16.300 --> 00:09:20.940 that's easy to see. Okay so what caught 00:09:20.940 --> 00:09:22.680 my attention reading some of these 00:09:22.680 --> 00:09:25.880 articles recently was that there there's 00:09:25.880 --> 00:09:28.780 definitely a new new novel way of 00:09:28.780 --> 00:09:30.980 looking at cells I know you've mentioned 00:09:30.980 --> 00:09:34.320 this in the past prior to doing this 00:09:34.320 --> 00:09:36.720 show which is kind of more based on the 00:09:36.760 --> 00:09:40.620 new findings in the the extracellular 00:09:40.620 --> 00:09:42.600 matrix as they call it and the fluidity 00:09:42.600 --> 00:09:45.700 within which cells are mobile and 00:09:45.700 --> 00:09:48.160 constantly in motion I think it was 00:09:48.160 --> 00:09:51.640 always posited before that everything 00:09:51.640 --> 00:09:53.640 was fairly fixed and once some a cell 00:09:53.640 --> 00:09:55.840 had differentiated it couldn't do 00:09:55.840 --> 00:09:58.420 anything more its fate was sealed but 00:09:58.420 --> 00:10:00.340 actually the new start new theories and 00:10:00.340 --> 00:10:02.520 new studies are finding that there's 00:10:02.520 --> 00:10:05.220 much more of a kind of quantum quantum 00:10:05.260 --> 00:10:06.920 state going on where things are very 00:10:06.920 --> 00:10:09.760 fluid and cells very much communicate in 00:10:09.760 --> 00:10:12.600 two directions and are subject to and 00:10:12.600 --> 00:10:16.000 give instructions to other components 00:10:16.000 --> 00:10:19.800 in the body so in terms of in terms of 00:10:19.800 --> 00:10:21.900 what they call this extracellular matrix 00:10:21.900 --> 00:10:24.480 in which this in which the cells kind of 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:27.540 reside what it what implications does 00:10:27.540 --> 00:10:29.620 this has for understanding an approach 00:10:29.620 --> 00:10:32.840 to cancer treatment for example. Well 00:10:32.880 --> 00:10:36.980 the the rigid doctrine of the organism 00:10:36.980 --> 00:10:42.220 that governs current cancer therapy it 00:10:42.220 --> 00:10:46.920 really was imposed on a more basic 00:10:46.920 --> 00:10:50.660 biological view with it started around 00:10:50.660 --> 00:10:53.760 1830 with Johannes Muller in Germany 00:10:53.760 --> 00:10:58.540 who described tumors as a problem of 00:10:58.540 --> 00:11:01.940 organization not of defective cells and 00:11:01.980 --> 00:11:07.140 that approach as it continued through 00:11:07.140 --> 00:11:11.660 embryology right through the 1930s and 00:11:11.660 --> 00:11:17.220 1940s in which people could dissociate 00:11:17.220 --> 00:11:21.660 an embryo or a primitive organism and 00:11:21.660 --> 00:11:24.260 show that the cells themselves could 00:11:24.260 --> 00:11:26.860 reconstruct the organism after they had 00:11:26.900 --> 00:11:33.100 been entirely separated so the the 00:11:33.100 --> 00:11:35.940 environment that they live in is 00:11:35.940 --> 00:11:40.380 constantly being constructed to meet 00:11:40.380 --> 00:11:45.120 their needs the cells have particular 00:11:45.120 --> 00:11:48.380 needs and they will change the 00:11:48.380 --> 00:11:51.280 environment to meet those needs if they 00:11:51.280 --> 00:11:55.160 have the energy and the resources. If 00:11:55.180 --> 00:11:59.320 for some reason a cell or an organ 00:11:59.320 --> 00:12:05.440 becomes idle it loses its sense of 00:12:05.440 --> 00:12:09.000 direction if there's no stimulation and 00:12:09.000 --> 00:12:11.100 no energy flowing through the system 00:12:11.100 --> 00:12:15.240 the cell doesn't have any particular 00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:18.920 occupation or knowledge of what it 00:12:18.920 --> 00:12:21.680 should be doing but ordinary cells 00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:26.860 everything else being ideal will if 00:12:26.860 --> 00:12:29.400 they see a defect in their environment 00:12:29.400 --> 00:12:33.260 they will reach out and correct the 00:12:33.260 --> 00:12:38.300 defect the extracellular matrix the 00:12:38.300 --> 00:12:41.940 main components are collagen for 00:12:41.940 --> 00:12:47.620 stiffness rigid linear molecules that 00:12:47.640 --> 00:12:51.780 surround each other and in between 00:12:51.780 --> 00:12:55.480 those stiff collagen molecules there 00:12:55.480 --> 00:12:59.120 are carbohydrate chains polysaccharides 00:12:59.120 --> 00:13:03.360 and some with with proteins attached 00:13:03.360 --> 00:13:07.360 with some just simple polysaccharides 00:13:07.360 --> 00:13:11.440 with amino groups on them that retain 00:13:11.460 --> 00:13:18.000 water and create an elastic or springy 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:21.240 environment against the pure hard 00:13:21.240 --> 00:13:25.140 environment of the pure collagen system 00:13:25.140 --> 00:13:30.720 and cells prefer a certain rigidity of 00:13:30.720 --> 00:13:33.360 environment when you take an isolated 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:38.560 cell and put it on a surface that 00:13:38.560 --> 00:13:40.960 varies in stiffness the cells will 00:13:41.000 --> 00:13:45.160 creep towards the stiffer firmer 00:13:45.160 --> 00:13:48.340 footing they don't like squishy things 00:13:48.340 --> 00:13:54.940 to sit on and if you inject broken down 00:13:54.940 --> 00:14:00.640 collagen fibers into an organism or a 00:14:00.640 --> 00:14:04.420 developing embryo the cells will 00:14:04.420 --> 00:14:07.420 rearrange the disorganized 00:14:07.460 --> 00:14:11.060 collagen that you have given them 00:14:11.060 --> 00:14:14.200 they're sort of like bricklayers 00:14:14.200 --> 00:14:17.600 align it in the direction they want 00:14:17.600 --> 00:14:21.500 and tug on it and communicate partly 00:14:21.500 --> 00:14:24.140 just by the way they tug and the other 00:14:24.140 --> 00:14:27.300 cells sense the tugging and pull back 00:14:27.300 --> 00:14:30.300 and because they have an inherent 00:14:30.300 --> 00:14:32.440 knowledge of the structure in which 00:14:32.440 --> 00:14:35.480 they should be in yeah and they like a 00:14:35.520 --> 00:14:41.280 fairly solid but they can create more 00:14:41.280 --> 00:14:43.920 of the polysaccharide so that it holds 00:14:43.920 --> 00:14:48.160 more water and is open and able to 00:14:48.160 --> 00:14:52.300 diffuse things to feed them so it has 00:14:52.300 --> 00:14:56.800 to be just right and there are various 00:14:56.800 --> 00:15:00.940 specific proteins that they secrete to 00:15:00.940 --> 00:15:05.080 attach themselves to do that pulling 00:15:05.100 --> 00:15:11.320 and pushing but there are some proteins 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:13.680 at the surface which happen to be 00:15:13.680 --> 00:15:18.620 chemically connected and interactive 00:15:18.620 --> 00:15:21.800 with the very structure of the cell all 00:15:21.800 --> 00:15:25.900 the way through in a very coherent 00:15:25.900 --> 00:15:31.040 unifying way of the sulfur and 00:15:31.040 --> 00:15:34.200 sulfhydryl system of the cell is what 00:15:34.240 --> 00:15:39.680 gives it much of its toughness and it 00:15:39.680 --> 00:15:44.220 has to be constantly broken down and 00:15:44.220 --> 00:15:47.280 reformed because the cell inside is 00:15:47.280 --> 00:15:49.420 constantly in motion. You're saying 00:15:49.420 --> 00:15:52.060 there's a constant connection of 00:15:52.060 --> 00:15:54.160 sulfhydryl from the outside of the cell 00:15:54.160 --> 00:15:57.220 to the center of the cell? Yeah and about 00:15:57.220 --> 00:15:59.860 40 years ago some experimenters found 00:15:59.860 --> 00:16:01.840 that if they blocked those surface 00:16:01.860 --> 00:16:07.400 sulfur groups the cell couldn't stick 00:16:07.400 --> 00:16:12.700 to its environment so the degree of 00:16:12.700 --> 00:16:16.280 reduction and oxidation of the surface 00:16:16.280 --> 00:16:20.580 sulfur groups is a very big part of how 00:16:20.580 --> 00:16:23.620 it sticks to its environment and gets 00:16:23.620 --> 00:16:27.020 where it has to be and helps to shape 00:16:27.020 --> 00:16:29.720 its environment and that degree of 00:16:29.760 --> 00:16:35.860 oxidation is governed by what has been 00:16:35.860 --> 00:16:38.540 called the antioxidant defense system. 00:16:38.540 --> 00:16:41.800 Okay, all right. You're listening to 00:16:41.800 --> 00:16:44.880 Ask Your Ob Doctor on KMED Galbraith 91.1 FM 00:16:44.880 --> 00:16:46.640 and from 7.30 until the end of the show 00:16:46.640 --> 00:16:49.140 people are invited to call in with any 00:16:49.140 --> 00:16:51.340 questions they may have regarding this 00:16:51.340 --> 00:16:54.020 month's subject of thinking outside the 00:16:54.020 --> 00:16:56.820 box for cancer therapy and Dr. Peat 00:16:56.820 --> 00:16:58.820 here in a bit here will get into the 00:16:58.860 --> 00:17:02.060 specifics of how reduction oxidation 00:17:02.060 --> 00:17:04.760 works in cells and how the new 00:17:04.760 --> 00:17:07.100 findings are showing that actually the 00:17:07.100 --> 00:17:08.940 concept of antioxidants are not 00:17:08.940 --> 00:17:11.600 necessarily positive and how perhaps we 00:17:11.600 --> 00:17:14.840 can influence that system to be more 00:17:14.840 --> 00:17:17.140 beneficial towards resolving cancers. 00:17:17.140 --> 00:17:19.580 Also going to be bringing up a article, 00:17:19.580 --> 00:17:21.780 a very interesting article that everyone 00:17:21.780 --> 00:17:23.820 can go to the internet and take a look 00:17:23.820 --> 00:17:27.180 at written by Mina Bissell on the 00:17:27.220 --> 00:17:30.520 programs called TED Talks. Basically 00:17:30.520 --> 00:17:32.560 there's a 15-minute talk on the 00:17:32.560 --> 00:17:34.660 architecture and context the form and 00:17:34.660 --> 00:17:37.360 function of the organization of the cell 00:17:37.360 --> 00:17:40.020 and how cancers are viewed in a 00:17:40.020 --> 00:17:41.300 different light now and she has some 00:17:41.300 --> 00:17:43.660 pretty exciting pretty exciting results. 00:17:43.660 --> 00:17:47.040 So Dr. Peat in terms of the we've 00:17:47.040 --> 00:17:49.180 mentioned very briefly the reduction 00:17:49.180 --> 00:17:52.780 and oxidation of cells or components of 00:17:52.780 --> 00:17:55.220 cells or molecules that are part of say 00:17:55.240 --> 00:17:58.380 electron transport chain or modifying 00:17:58.380 --> 00:18:01.240 chemicals. Can you can you want to 00:18:01.240 --> 00:18:04.380 describe this how this potential works 00:18:04.380 --> 00:18:08.180 in the matrix and how this can determine 00:18:08.180 --> 00:18:11.620 the outcome of disease and health? I 00:18:11.620 --> 00:18:13.720 guess from making the simplistic 00:18:13.720 --> 00:18:16.220 consumption of antioxidants for example 00:18:16.220 --> 00:18:18.460 a bad choice perhaps for cancer strategy. 00:18:18.460 --> 00:18:22.300 If you look at the balance between 00:18:22.340 --> 00:18:26.900 oxidants and antioxidants or reductants 00:18:26.900 --> 00:18:30.780 in the cell many people think of it as a 00:18:30.780 --> 00:18:33.380 reducing environment or an 00:18:33.380 --> 00:18:35.920 antioxidative environment but when you 00:18:35.920 --> 00:18:39.020 look at specific components such as the 00:18:39.020 --> 00:18:42.920 the molecule that transfers electrons 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:46.220 from glucose for example to the 00:18:46.220 --> 00:18:51.460 mitochondrion to be oxidized. NAD is the 00:18:51.500 --> 00:18:56.300 coenzyme and it becomes reduced to NADH 00:18:56.300 --> 00:19:00.880 which is the source of the antioxidant 00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:04.980 electrons and if you look at the healthy 00:19:04.980 --> 00:19:09.220 cell the ratio of the oxidized form is 00:19:09.220 --> 00:19:14.680 hundreds of times the reduced form is 00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:24.960 about 500 or more times the oxidized 00:19:24.960 --> 00:19:27.960 form is 500 times greater than the 00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:32.840 reduced form and so that that's the 00:19:32.840 --> 00:19:37.280 governing antioxidant. Is the oxidized 00:19:37.280 --> 00:19:42.280 form. A highly oxidized state and that is 00:19:42.320 --> 00:19:46.520 in balance with ascorbic acid and 00:19:46.520 --> 00:19:52.320 coenzyme Q10 and vitamin E and the 00:19:52.320 --> 00:19:56.860 sulfur system glutathione and 00:19:56.860 --> 00:20:00.960 glutathione disulfide. These are all 00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:05.340 energized by the electron from NADH 00:20:05.340 --> 00:20:11.680 which comes from glucose normally and so 00:20:11.700 --> 00:20:14.840 the cell normally is in this really 00:20:14.840 --> 00:20:18.080 highly oxidized state as determined by 00:20:18.080 --> 00:20:23.580 the ratio of NAD to NADH and if the 00:20:23.580 --> 00:20:26.820 cell is sick for example a cancer cell 00:20:26.820 --> 00:20:30.960 the ratio approaches one to one. 00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:35.460 It's almost 50% in the reduced 00:20:35.460 --> 00:20:39.700 antioxidant state and if you injure a 00:20:39.740 --> 00:20:45.240 cell you turn on this signaling system 00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:50.080 that James Watson talked about as one of 00:20:50.080 --> 00:20:53.680 the problems that he says people are 00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:56.880 looking for some way to turn that off so 00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:59.660 you don't keep pushing the cell in the 00:20:59.660 --> 00:21:03.300 direction of too much reduction but in 00:21:03.300 --> 00:21:07.600 fact anything that irritates the cell is 00:21:07.620 --> 00:21:10.760 likely to turn on more of the reducing 00:21:10.760 --> 00:21:12.840 system and push it in that direction of 00:21:12.840 --> 00:21:15.500 stress or cancer with a higher ratio of 00:21:15.500 --> 00:21:19.000 NADH to NAD approaching one to one. 00:21:19.000 --> 00:21:21.040 You're saying that you want it in a 00:21:21.040 --> 00:21:23.540 oxidized form you want the cell not to 00:21:23.540 --> 00:21:25.880 have access to antioxidant activity. 00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:29.480 Yeah the healthy active cell has about 00:21:29.480 --> 00:21:32.720 500 times more oxidized NAD. 00:21:32.760 --> 00:21:41.740 When the people who are selling their 00:21:41.740 --> 00:21:45.480 very powerful antioxidants a lot of the 00:21:45.480 --> 00:21:48.540 advertisements say it's many times more 00:21:48.540 --> 00:21:52.480 powerful than vitamin C or than vitamin E 00:21:52.480 --> 00:21:56.280 but what they're doing is testing the 00:21:56.280 --> 00:22:00.760 antioxidants in vitro in a test tube and 00:22:00.800 --> 00:22:05.160 they will attack and destroy the 00:22:05.160 --> 00:22:12.340 oxidizing fragments free radicals but it 00:22:12.340 --> 00:22:17.380 happens that just like the NAD, NADH 00:22:17.380 --> 00:22:21.220 couple which is highly oxidized the 00:22:21.220 --> 00:22:24.220 things in balance with that ascorbic 00:22:24.220 --> 00:22:27.280 acid and vitamin E for example inside 00:22:27.320 --> 00:22:30.860 the cell they become oxidized. 00:22:30.860 --> 00:22:36.360 The dehydroascorbic acid is an oxidant 00:22:36.360 --> 00:22:39.300 and it's eight times more concentrated 00:22:39.300 --> 00:22:41.900 in the cell than outside. 00:22:41.900 --> 00:22:44.900 It's relatively hydrophobic and it goes 00:22:44.900 --> 00:22:47.940 to the oily parts of the cell. 00:22:47.940 --> 00:22:49.540 So that will itself break down an 00:22:49.540 --> 00:22:52.180 antioxidant from on the outside of the 00:22:52.220 --> 00:22:57.220 cell. 00:22:57.220 --> 00:23:00.120 Irritating the cell and turning on the 00:23:00.120 --> 00:23:04.860 defensive antioxidant reductive systems 00:23:04.860 --> 00:23:10.600 and producing a lot of the fragments 00:23:10.600 --> 00:23:13.140 that reduce glutathione, one of the 00:23:13.140 --> 00:23:18.180 sulfur molecules that exchanges 00:23:18.180 --> 00:23:19.880 throughout the system. 00:23:19.920 --> 00:23:23.420 When the cell is irritated that and 00:23:23.420 --> 00:23:27.360 the associated ascorbic acid which 00:23:27.360 --> 00:23:29.520 becomes reduced and the vitamin E which 00:23:29.520 --> 00:23:33.860 becomes reduced these will sop up the 00:23:33.860 --> 00:23:38.000 toxic fragments but the trouble is that 00:23:38.000 --> 00:23:42.000 the system which normally should be 00:23:42.000 --> 00:23:44.000 oxidized all the way through the 00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:49.440 ascorbic acid, the vitamin C, vitamin E 00:23:49.480 --> 00:23:52.280 coenzyme Q10 and so on. 00:23:52.280 --> 00:23:56.120 The whole system gets stuck in an 00:23:56.120 --> 00:24:01.320 over reduced, over electrified or not 00:24:01.320 --> 00:24:04.220 enough oxidation going on to pull it 00:24:04.220 --> 00:24:05.660 back where it should be. 00:24:05.660 --> 00:24:09.960 Since the 1930s people have seen that 00:24:09.960 --> 00:24:14.140 any cell which is dividing goes into 00:24:14.140 --> 00:24:16.980 this highly reduced state in which 00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:20.880 everything shifts to the sulfhydryl 00:24:20.880 --> 00:24:23.340 rather than the disulfide form. 00:24:23.340 --> 00:24:25.140 Okay and this includes the cancer cells 00:24:25.140 --> 00:24:25.980 then? 00:24:25.980 --> 00:24:29.140 Yeah and normal cells go into this 00:24:29.140 --> 00:24:33.020 phase very quickly, divide and then 00:24:33.020 --> 00:24:37.160 return to their oxidized state and the 00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:41.460 vitamin E and vitamin C go back to 00:24:41.460 --> 00:24:44.260 becoming oxidants and keeping the 00:24:44.300 --> 00:24:47.340 system tightened up, helping to squeeze 00:24:47.340 --> 00:24:51.340 water out of the system and the balance 00:24:51.340 --> 00:24:57.220 where the membrane potential of a cell 00:24:57.220 --> 00:25:00.020 is normally around 100 millivolts 00:25:00.020 --> 00:25:02.580 difference when you measure it with an 00:25:02.580 --> 00:25:04.920 electrode stuck into it. 00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:11.460 The redox difference is in a range of 00:25:11.500 --> 00:25:15.200 about 15 millivolts, a very small 00:25:15.200 --> 00:25:20.240 fraction of the energy which is 00:25:20.240 --> 00:25:22.240 available for induction. 00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:27.340 If you measure the voltage between 00:25:27.340 --> 00:25:31.040 glucose and oxygen it's over a volt so 00:25:31.040 --> 00:25:34.480 it's about 100 times more than the 00:25:34.480 --> 00:25:38.080 difference of 15 millivolts which 00:25:38.080 --> 00:25:41.020 governs practically all of the reactions 00:25:41.060 --> 00:25:42.060 in the cell. 00:25:42.060 --> 00:25:45.860 The enzymes which produce energy, 00:25:45.860 --> 00:25:51.100 synthesized protein which govern the 00:25:51.100 --> 00:25:54.640 economy of the cell, these are sensitive 00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:59.640 to being reduced or oxidized and so 00:25:59.640 --> 00:26:03.180 this 15 millivolt difference can shift 00:26:03.180 --> 00:26:05.420 the whole economy of the cell. 00:26:05.420 --> 00:26:07.220 That's a pretty tight range within 00:26:07.220 --> 00:26:09.120 which normality exists. 00:26:09.160 --> 00:26:13.860 When you measure the products such as 00:26:13.860 --> 00:26:17.400 pyruvic acid versus lactic acid, 00:26:17.400 --> 00:26:21.700 these are an excreted or easily 00:26:21.700 --> 00:26:25.440 extracted index of the oxidative or 00:26:25.440 --> 00:26:27.740 reductive state of the cell. 00:26:27.740 --> 00:26:31.240 So when the cell is in trouble it turns 00:26:31.240 --> 00:26:33.440 pyruvic acid into lactic acid by 00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:35.480 reducing it. 00:26:35.480 --> 00:26:38.360 So that's a reflection of the highly 00:26:38.380 --> 00:26:41.060 reduced antioxidant state when the cell 00:26:41.060 --> 00:26:44.700 is distressed and making lactic acid. 00:26:44.700 --> 00:26:48.560 When oxygen is working properly it's 00:26:48.560 --> 00:26:50.260 not producing lactic acid, 00:26:50.260 --> 00:26:53.840 it's using, consuming the pyruvic acid, 00:26:53.840 --> 00:26:56.400 turning it into carbon dioxide. 00:26:56.400 --> 00:26:59.180 So the ratio between not only pyruvic 00:26:59.180 --> 00:27:02.640 acid and lactic acid but overall it 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:05.080 would be between lactic acid versus 00:27:05.080 --> 00:27:07.120 carbon dioxide. 00:27:07.140 --> 00:27:12.680 Carbon dioxide is an acid and so in a 00:27:12.680 --> 00:27:15.220 sense it's an oxidant. 00:27:15.220 --> 00:27:18.160 It causes retraction of electrons. 00:27:18.160 --> 00:27:20.660 Because the fundamental here is 00:27:20.660 --> 00:27:22.560 basically mopping up electrons. 00:27:22.560 --> 00:27:23.560 Yeah. 00:27:23.560 --> 00:27:24.560 Yeah. 00:27:24.560 --> 00:27:26.760 So, okay, so let me ask you this. 00:27:26.760 --> 00:27:31.780 The reactive oxygen species, okay, 00:27:31.780 --> 00:27:35.780 so a group of molecules governed 00:27:35.800 --> 00:27:41.340 electrically, the antioxidant system 00:27:41.340 --> 00:27:44.120 versus the reactive oxygen species 00:27:44.120 --> 00:27:47.320 system, in terms of inflammation and 00:27:47.320 --> 00:27:49.620 what free radicals, I think as I've 00:27:49.620 --> 00:27:52.660 understood free radical damage to be a 00:27:52.660 --> 00:27:55.860 result of free radical liberation that 00:27:55.860 --> 00:27:59.960 isn't mopped up by antioxidants, is it 00:27:59.960 --> 00:28:02.560 almost that free radicals are almost, I 00:28:02.560 --> 00:28:04.640 can almost think of free radicals now as 00:28:04.680 --> 00:28:07.340 being a little more beneficial than the 00:28:07.340 --> 00:28:10.980 antioxidants because they... 00:28:10.980 --> 00:28:15.420 That's Watson's interpretation but I 00:28:15.420 --> 00:28:19.460 think that's his 50 years as a 00:28:19.460 --> 00:28:24.460 reductionist when he comes out of the 00:28:24.460 --> 00:28:29.000 static mechanical view of genetics and 00:28:29.000 --> 00:28:32.160 looks at the metabolism of the cell, he 00:28:32.200 --> 00:28:39.240 tends to over concretize and the 00:28:39.240 --> 00:28:45.040 antioxidant system is doing good stuff 00:28:45.040 --> 00:28:47.980 defending against toxic free radicals 00:28:47.980 --> 00:28:52.780 but the oxidative normal functions 00:28:52.780 --> 00:28:56.920 involving ascorbic acid or dehydroascorbate 00:28:56.920 --> 00:29:01.860 and vitamin E and the sulfhydryl 00:29:01.880 --> 00:29:06.920 balancing system, those are able to 00:29:06.920 --> 00:29:11.560 control the system that he suggests the 00:29:11.560 --> 00:29:15.000 toxic free radicals would be doing. 00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:21.380 So you can get both the good defensive 00:29:21.380 --> 00:29:26.320 process against free radicals and the 00:29:26.320 --> 00:29:29.620 limiting of the production of more free 00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:32.140 radicals without resorting to one of 00:29:32.140 --> 00:29:34.280 the toxic chemicals that he's suggesting. 00:29:34.280 --> 00:29:37.480 Because you're advocating and I know 00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:39.160 you have not just further subject in 00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:42.360 hand but in general as a good health 00:29:42.360 --> 00:29:45.160 practice from advocating plenty of fruit 00:29:45.160 --> 00:29:47.460 consumption for example, you advocate 00:29:47.460 --> 00:29:52.000 vitamin C and vitamin E as very safe and 00:29:52.000 --> 00:29:53.800 gentle, relatively gentle in their 00:29:53.800 --> 00:29:56.340 antioxidant capacity to some of the 00:29:56.340 --> 00:29:58.680 products I know that have been mentioned. 00:29:58.700 --> 00:30:00.680 You talk about the super antioxidants 00:30:00.680 --> 00:30:02.480 that are touted on the supplement market 00:30:02.480 --> 00:30:05.740 that people may have consumed or may 00:30:05.740 --> 00:30:07.520 have thought were a good thing but in 00:30:07.520 --> 00:30:09.280 general vitamin C and vitamin E are very 00:30:09.280 --> 00:30:10.560 safe and they do the work very 00:30:10.560 --> 00:30:11.560 effectively. 00:30:11.560 --> 00:30:14.220 That's because they are electrically 00:30:14.220 --> 00:30:18.020 tuned to exactly a certain role or group 00:30:18.020 --> 00:30:22.000 of roles in the cell and if you put in 00:30:22.040 --> 00:30:29.820 dynamite instead of alcohol you can have 00:30:29.820 --> 00:30:33.760 the same overall energy expense but it 00:30:33.760 --> 00:30:36.800 isn't under control and some of the 00:30:36.800 --> 00:30:39.000 antioxidants that they're selling are 00:30:39.000 --> 00:30:42.840 more like dynamite, don't fit into the 00:30:42.840 --> 00:30:45.840 system and so they aren't helpful at all. 00:30:45.840 --> 00:30:50.840 And when the good antioxidants are 00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:55.880 working properly the system can run as 00:30:55.880 --> 00:30:59.320 fast as it once practically oxidizing 00:30:59.320 --> 00:31:05.160 at full speed and there are examples of 00:31:05.160 --> 00:31:10.660 experiments in which as you add thyroid 00:31:10.660 --> 00:31:14.400 hormone or a chemical that uncouples the 00:31:14.400 --> 00:31:17.480 production of ATP from simply the 00:31:17.500 --> 00:31:22.040 burning of oxygen and fuel as you rev up 00:31:22.040 --> 00:31:26.940 the oxidizing process you get fewer and 00:31:26.940 --> 00:31:29.040 fewer free radical productions. 00:31:29.040 --> 00:31:33.240 So, because you normally associate free 00:31:33.240 --> 00:31:34.640 radical production with that. 00:31:34.640 --> 00:31:38.320 Yeah and so the good antioxidants are 00:31:38.320 --> 00:31:42.820 working with the mitochondria and the 00:31:42.820 --> 00:31:45.760 faster that system runs the fewer 00:31:45.780 --> 00:31:47.660 electrons get away to cause the 00:31:47.660 --> 00:31:49.760 dangerous free radicals. 00:31:49.760 --> 00:31:51.760 So, this is a bit like the aerobic versus 00:31:51.760 --> 00:31:55.200 anaerobic glycolysis and its effects. 00:31:55.200 --> 00:32:01.100 Yeah, when the cell gets out of control 00:32:01.100 --> 00:32:07.980 oxygen is no longer able to suck up the 00:32:07.980 --> 00:32:11.180 electrons and so the cell has to expel 00:32:11.180 --> 00:32:13.780 the electrons in the form of lactic acid 00:32:13.820 --> 00:32:17.320 and that's a survival mechanism but it 00:32:17.320 --> 00:32:23.500 happens that when you do that desperate 00:32:23.500 --> 00:32:26.500 production of lactic acid to draw off 00:32:26.500 --> 00:32:30.100 excess electrons it happens to raise the 00:32:30.100 --> 00:32:33.840 pH inside the cell and lower the pH 00:32:33.840 --> 00:32:38.840 outside the cell and I think it was the 00:32:38.840 --> 00:32:41.280 embryologist Holtfrater who demonstrated 00:32:41.280 --> 00:32:43.760 that if you put an embryo in a slightly 00:32:43.780 --> 00:32:47.420 acidified solution the cells simply 00:32:47.420 --> 00:32:50.320 leave the embryo and float off and do 00:32:50.320 --> 00:32:51.720 their own thing. 00:32:51.720 --> 00:32:55.660 So, the cancer or the stress metabolism 00:32:55.660 --> 00:33:00.600 acidifying outside the cell is tending 00:33:00.600 --> 00:33:04.300 to destroy the cell's connection to its 00:33:04.300 --> 00:33:07.740 environment and at the same time raising 00:33:07.740 --> 00:33:11.680 the pH inside the cell makes it swell up, 00:33:11.720 --> 00:33:16.280 water and shifts the self-hydro balance 00:33:16.280 --> 00:33:20.020 into the reduced state and tends to turn 00:33:20.020 --> 00:33:22.460 on constant cell diffusion. 00:33:22.460 --> 00:33:25.460 Okay, well I guess before we get into the 00:33:25.460 --> 00:33:30.000 Danopoulos previous experiments and 00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:32.240 research with urea for the treatment of 00:33:32.240 --> 00:33:35.880 cancers including liver cancer, I know 00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:39.300 that from an oxidant versus antioxidant 00:33:39.340 --> 00:33:42.480 perspective that exercise in its own 00:33:42.480 --> 00:33:44.780 right then generates sufficient 00:33:44.780 --> 00:33:47.720 biological oxidants which could be 00:33:47.720 --> 00:33:49.680 perhaps used as a valid approach to 00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:52.080 diabetes, cardiovascular disease and 00:33:52.080 --> 00:33:53.520 some cancers and I've seen that there is 00:33:53.520 --> 00:33:55.560 some research to support that they 00:33:55.560 --> 00:33:59.500 exercise especially for diabetes but in 00:33:59.500 --> 00:34:01.060 some instances for cardiovascular 00:34:01.060 --> 00:34:02.460 disease and cancer is actually fairly 00:34:02.460 --> 00:34:03.460 pertinent. 00:34:03.460 --> 00:34:08.840 Exercise will cause cells to take up 00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:14.140 glucose in the absence of insulin and 00:34:14.140 --> 00:34:19.280 will make them operate effectively but 00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:22.960 just like the uncoupling protein or the 00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:27.160 increased thyroid, these are the cells 00:34:27.160 --> 00:34:33.660 equivalent of exercise so that when 00:34:33.660 --> 00:34:36.160 everything is working in an organized 00:34:36.200 --> 00:34:41.400 way the cells are exercising by simply 00:34:41.400 --> 00:34:44.400 burning oxygen and fuel and warming 00:34:44.400 --> 00:34:50.840 themselves up so exercise should keep 00:34:50.840 --> 00:34:53.740 everything active but when it doesn't 00:34:53.740 --> 00:34:56.680 the organism can defend itself and 00:34:56.680 --> 00:35:00.160 imitate exercise by running things at a 00:35:00.160 --> 00:35:01.160 higher speed. 00:35:01.160 --> 00:35:03.460 Okay, all right you're listening to 00:35:03.480 --> 00:35:06.140 Ask Your Ob Doctor on KMED Gallup 91.1 FM 00:35:06.140 --> 00:35:07.940 from now until the end of the show at 00:35:07.940 --> 00:35:10.380 8 o'clock callers are invited to call 00:35:10.380 --> 00:35:11.820 in with any questions they have 00:35:11.820 --> 00:35:14.180 hopefully surrounding tonight's subject 00:35:14.180 --> 00:35:17.660 of novel approaches to cancer so like I 00:35:17.660 --> 00:35:19.120 said at the beginning of the show we're 00:35:19.120 --> 00:35:20.820 hopefully going to get into a little bit 00:35:20.820 --> 00:35:23.720 later on about liver cancer and some of 00:35:23.720 --> 00:35:25.920 the work done by a pioneering doctor 00:35:25.920 --> 00:35:27.800 back in the 80s which is still relevant 00:35:27.800 --> 00:35:30.160 today concerning urea therapy. 00:35:30.160 --> 00:35:32.000 The number if you live in the area is 00:35:32.040 --> 00:35:35.480 923 3911 or if you live outside the area 00:35:35.480 --> 00:35:39.040 there's an 800 number which is 1-800-KMUD-RAD. 00:35:39.040 --> 00:35:40.780 Okay so... 00:35:40.780 --> 00:35:42.520 Doc, can I just get in there quickly we 00:35:42.520 --> 00:35:43.980 got a call since the top of the hour 00:35:43.980 --> 00:35:45.980 someone called to say there are two 00:35:45.980 --> 00:35:49.280 loose friendly brown and white pitbulls 00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:51.180 running loose on Branscom Road between 00:35:51.180 --> 00:35:53.220 number 2015 and Laytonville and this 00:35:53.220 --> 00:35:54.860 phone call just came in so if those 00:35:54.860 --> 00:35:56.460 might be your dogs running loose on 00:35:56.460 --> 00:35:58.220 Branscom Road two brown and white 00:35:58.220 --> 00:36:01.200 pitbulls folks want you to know they're 00:36:01.240 --> 00:36:04.600 out running loose. Thanks. 00:36:04.600 --> 00:36:07.400 So Dr. Peat I looked earlier on at that 00:36:07.400 --> 00:36:11.280 15-minute, well it wasn't a podcast but 00:36:11.280 --> 00:36:13.140 it was a video basically the TED talks that 00:36:13.140 --> 00:36:16.380 Meena Bissel presented. It's a very 00:36:16.380 --> 00:36:18.780 interesting work that she was doing and 00:36:18.780 --> 00:36:21.960 quite amazing where she had shown 00:36:21.960 --> 00:36:24.520 that the context and the architecture 00:36:24.520 --> 00:36:26.760 of the cell was very much the governing 00:36:26.760 --> 00:36:28.520 force behind whether or not cancers 00:36:28.560 --> 00:36:31.660 were present and I know from your what 00:36:31.660 --> 00:36:32.960 you're mentioning earlier on about the 00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:37.100 extracellular matrix of the whole 00:36:37.100 --> 00:36:38.800 solution around the cell within the 00:36:38.800 --> 00:36:41.140 cells all very fluid the cytoskeleton 00:36:41.140 --> 00:36:43.040 this all starts from the outside and 00:36:43.040 --> 00:36:45.400 works its way in its constant and the 00:36:45.400 --> 00:36:47.640 energy that should be present within a 00:36:47.640 --> 00:36:51.220 healthy cell gives the potential to 00:36:51.220 --> 00:36:54.480 signal and allow changes to happen so 00:36:54.480 --> 00:36:57.620 that everything's ordered. Now what she 00:36:57.660 --> 00:37:00.260 was what she was bringing up was I think 00:37:00.260 --> 00:37:02.100 she was specializing in breast cancer 00:37:02.100 --> 00:37:06.100 and she'd showed that clip during the 00:37:06.100 --> 00:37:08.240 15-minute speech that she gave about the 00:37:08.240 --> 00:37:12.640 the duct cell one of the duct cells 00:37:12.640 --> 00:37:16.640 that secretes milk with a 00:37:16.640 --> 00:37:19.240 pre-cancerous stage and then the cancerous 00:37:19.240 --> 00:37:21.720 stage and then she basically proved that 00:37:21.720 --> 00:37:23.420 it could be the cancerous cell could get 00:37:23.420 --> 00:37:26.320 turned back to its normal state not by 00:37:26.340 --> 00:37:28.720 poisoning it or radiating it but by 00:37:28.720 --> 00:37:30.620 allowing the extracellular matrix in 00:37:30.620 --> 00:37:33.960 which it was growing to be normalized 00:37:33.960 --> 00:37:36.500 and I know this is an approach that 00:37:36.500 --> 00:37:39.420 you're positing now as a novel way of 00:37:39.420 --> 00:37:41.660 approaching a disease in general and 00:37:41.660 --> 00:37:43.940 not just cancers but other diseases so 00:37:43.940 --> 00:37:46.740 that it's more of a functional 00:37:46.740 --> 00:37:49.480 disorganization of the environment in 00:37:49.480 --> 00:37:51.280 which the cells operate that is the 00:37:51.280 --> 00:37:52.640 cause rather than the cells themselves 00:37:52.640 --> 00:37:54.840 becoming mutant or aberrant or just 00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:57.740 losing their program or whatever is 00:37:57.740 --> 00:38:01.960 popular vogue theory for health. The 00:38:01.960 --> 00:38:05.920 exercise idea is very relevant to a 00:38:05.920 --> 00:38:09.120 breast cancer you've probably heard the 00:38:09.120 --> 00:38:13.000 statistics that women who are constantly 00:38:13.000 --> 00:38:16.160 having babies and nursing through their 00:38:16.160 --> 00:38:21.400 whole fertile years have a very low 00:38:21.440 --> 00:38:24.980 risk of breast cancer and so what is 00:38:24.980 --> 00:38:28.640 working keeps working and the cells 00:38:28.640 --> 00:38:32.480 which are have a load and a job to do 00:38:32.480 --> 00:38:35.980 are keeping their extracellular matrix 00:38:35.980 --> 00:38:38.660 organized to support what they're 00:38:38.660 --> 00:38:41.460 doing. We do have a call in I want to 00:38:41.460 --> 00:38:42.920 get this call in very quickly but I do 00:38:42.920 --> 00:38:45.320 also want to ask you whether or not how 00:38:45.320 --> 00:38:47.700 much credence do you think the high 00:38:47.700 --> 00:38:49.660 exposure to progesterone during 00:38:49.700 --> 00:38:53.240 pregnancy has on the fact that they 00:38:53.240 --> 00:38:55.100 have very low incidence of breast cancer 00:38:55.100 --> 00:38:56.900 to do how much of that part do you 00:38:56.900 --> 00:38:59.980 think it plays? I think that's the main 00:38:59.980 --> 00:39:05.080 thing it erases for example looking at 00:39:05.080 --> 00:39:06.940 the connective tissue like like the 00:39:06.940 --> 00:39:10.120 tendons which are almost pure 00:39:10.120 --> 00:39:15.620 connective tissue if you expose a 00:39:15.660 --> 00:39:19.460 rabbit for example to estrogen the 00:39:19.460 --> 00:39:21.760 connective tissue such as the tendon 00:39:21.760 --> 00:39:26.040 becomes stiff and hardened and every 00:39:26.040 --> 00:39:29.100 time it becomes pregnant and the 00:39:29.100 --> 00:39:32.080 estrogen goes up you see a shift 00:39:32.080 --> 00:39:35.840 momentarily towards hardening but after 00:39:35.840 --> 00:39:39.640 each pregnancy it's less hardened than 00:39:39.640 --> 00:39:44.020 before and it's the progesterone which 00:39:44.060 --> 00:39:46.680 reverses those changes even in the 00:39:46.680 --> 00:39:48.720 connective tissue the extracellular 00:39:48.720 --> 00:39:53.900 matrix and it's also erasing the 00:39:53.900 --> 00:39:58.100 intracellular estrogen functions the 00:39:58.100 --> 00:40:02.180 synthesis of estrogen the failure to 00:40:02.180 --> 00:40:06.300 detoxify it and the tendency to bind it 00:40:06.300 --> 00:40:08.880 all of these are regulated by 00:40:08.880 --> 00:40:11.680 progesterone as an anti-estrogen. Good 00:40:11.680 --> 00:40:13.980 okay well let's get this caller then and 00:40:14.020 --> 00:40:16.380 see see where this callers questions 00:40:16.380 --> 00:40:18.180 going. Hi caller you're on the air and 00:40:18.180 --> 00:40:21.760 where you from? Hi Dr. Peat and Andrew 00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:24.160 you and I have spoken over computer 00:40:24.160 --> 00:40:28.060 stuff and my question is I was born with 00:40:28.060 --> 00:40:29.960 some interesting genetics and I've 00:40:29.960 --> 00:40:32.360 always wondered how it happened that I 00:40:32.360 --> 00:40:36.500 was born from two eggs and I have lots 00:40:36.500 --> 00:40:39.880 of things because of that both genders 00:40:39.880 --> 00:40:42.940 because of that and I I wondered how 00:40:42.980 --> 00:40:46.780 did that happen? Dr. Peat I think I 00:40:46.780 --> 00:40:49.480 think your well one moment caller I 00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:51.960 think your condition is chimerism isn't 00:40:51.960 --> 00:40:55.960 it? You are a chimera as far as I 00:40:55.960 --> 00:40:59.400 remember I don't know I think the caller 00:40:59.400 --> 00:41:01.260 might have hung up actually but Dr. Peat 00:41:01.260 --> 00:41:02.960 chimeras I think they're extremely rare 00:41:02.960 --> 00:41:05.440 in the population. You know the 00:41:05.440 --> 00:41:10.080 embryologists have made them and you can 00:41:10.100 --> 00:41:14.040 that's one of the early demonstrations 00:41:14.040 --> 00:41:18.140 that mutations aren't the cause of 00:41:18.140 --> 00:41:22.040 cancer somatic mutation theory was made 00:41:22.040 --> 00:41:25.320 defunct 40 years ago when someone took a 00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:29.720 cell from a tumor and stuck it in an 00:41:29.720 --> 00:41:33.860 early embryo the tumor came from I think 00:41:33.860 --> 00:41:37.000 it was a black hamster and they put it 00:41:37.020 --> 00:41:44.900 in the embryo from a white hamster both 00:41:44.900 --> 00:41:48.300 of its parents were white and the 00:41:48.300 --> 00:41:53.480 developing organism had four parents it 00:41:53.480 --> 00:41:56.340 was a mixture of white and black 00:41:56.340 --> 00:41:59.180 inheritance showing that what had been a 00:41:59.180 --> 00:42:03.560 cancer cell developed into an ordinary 00:42:03.560 --> 00:42:06.660 part of the organism and that's the sort 00:42:06.700 --> 00:42:12.060 of thing that on a more highly 00:42:12.060 --> 00:42:15.440 differentiated tissue that mean abyssal 00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:17.740 is demonstrating that it's the 00:42:17.740 --> 00:42:21.180 environment not the genes which make a 00:42:21.180 --> 00:42:25.220 cancer. So what do you do you have any do 00:42:25.220 --> 00:42:26.720 you have anything to say about chimeras 00:42:26.720 --> 00:42:29.940 in the human population and how how they 00:42:29.940 --> 00:42:33.780 how they come about or how how yeah how 00:42:33.780 --> 00:42:36.320 rare we know that rare. I think they're 00:42:36.360 --> 00:42:40.960 probably not as extremely rare as one 00:42:40.960 --> 00:42:46.400 would suppose because the the early 00:42:46.400 --> 00:42:51.200 embryos if they happen to get too close 00:42:51.200 --> 00:42:54.900 it's very easy for them to mix and form 00:42:54.900 --> 00:42:58.080 one one organism. Because people can have 00:42:58.080 --> 00:43:00.880 two two or more blood types their red 00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:03.820 blood cells can express the the markers 00:43:03.840 --> 00:43:06.920 for you know O positive and rhesus 00:43:06.920 --> 00:43:09.160 rhesus groups or B that could be B 00:43:09.160 --> 00:43:13.760 rhesus negative in the same person. 00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:18.800 Yeah I found that quite fascinating. 00:43:18.800 --> 00:43:25.400 Okay well let's let's move on then so 00:43:25.400 --> 00:43:27.280 oh look out I think there's another 00:43:27.280 --> 00:43:28.940 caller let's take this next caller 00:43:28.940 --> 00:43:30.580 before we move on. Hi caller you're on 00:43:30.580 --> 00:43:33.380 the air where you from? Yeah I can barely 00:43:33.420 --> 00:43:35.580 hear you for some reason. Can you hear me? 00:43:35.580 --> 00:43:37.420 Yeah yeah I can hear you fine but you 00:43:37.420 --> 00:43:39.080 know yeah I can hear you fine you're 00:43:39.080 --> 00:43:42.560 saying that you can't. Hello. Hello I can 00:43:42.560 --> 00:43:46.260 hear you but can't yeah I can hear you. 00:43:46.260 --> 00:43:49.600 Oh well maybe that caller should call 00:43:49.600 --> 00:43:52.200 back in again if they've hung up yeah 00:43:52.200 --> 00:43:54.840 okay I think this is some part of what 00:43:54.840 --> 00:43:57.240 would hopefully get resolved. We did have 00:43:57.240 --> 00:43:59.400 another caller who really wanted to ask 00:43:59.400 --> 00:44:01.300 Dr. Peat something if I could use this 00:44:01.340 --> 00:44:03.940 opportunity. He wanted to know about low 00:44:03.940 --> 00:44:07.480 carb diets the fat-burning ketone diet 00:44:07.480 --> 00:44:09.740 and specifically he said it's helped him 00:44:09.740 --> 00:44:11.240 quite a bit he wants to know what Dr. 00:44:11.240 --> 00:44:13.020 Peat thought about that the ketone diet. 00:44:13.020 --> 00:44:14.580 Yeah what do you think of that Dr. Peat? 00:44:14.580 --> 00:44:18.720 Um you don't produce the ketones unless 00:44:18.720 --> 00:44:23.060 you're raising your cortisol enough to 00:44:23.060 --> 00:44:27.020 activate the conversion of protein into 00:44:27.060 --> 00:44:32.100 the ketones to activate the conversion 00:44:32.100 --> 00:44:37.100 of protein into glucose at the same time 00:44:37.100 --> 00:44:41.060 you're turning some of the fat into 00:44:41.060 --> 00:44:44.800 ketones. So it's a pretty stressful. Yeah 00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:49.600 and I think the problem occurs over a 00:44:49.600 --> 00:44:54.040 few years of exposure to that increased 00:44:54.080 --> 00:44:59.220 breakdown of protein. The cortisol is 00:44:59.220 --> 00:45:02.620 affecting your connective tissues and 00:45:02.620 --> 00:45:07.920 the Explorer I don't remember his name 00:45:07.920 --> 00:45:11.120 at the moment but Arctic Explorer who 00:45:11.120 --> 00:45:15.500 advocated the meat diet he noticed that 00:45:15.500 --> 00:45:21.400 the Eskimos were very prematurely aged in 00:45:21.440 --> 00:45:24.340 appearance their skin became very 00:45:24.340 --> 00:45:28.780 wrinkled and I think that's what you 00:45:28.780 --> 00:45:32.420 would expect from being exposed to very 00:45:32.420 --> 00:45:35.560 high cortisol constantly. So the 00:45:35.560 --> 00:45:37.480 ketone diet is a pretty stressful way to 00:45:37.480 --> 00:45:40.320 do anything like lose weight and losing 00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:42.060 weight in general is not a very good 00:45:42.060 --> 00:45:44.960 idea unless it's done slowly especially 00:45:44.960 --> 00:45:46.600 in people that have lots of stored 00:45:46.600 --> 00:45:48.820 polyunsaturates in their fat makeup 00:45:48.820 --> 00:45:50.040 which is most people unless they're 00:45:50.060 --> 00:45:51.900 really watching what they eat and 00:45:51.900 --> 00:45:53.760 avoiding polyunsaturates and making sure 00:45:53.760 --> 00:45:55.340 they consume lots of saturated fats. 00:45:55.340 --> 00:45:57.040 Actually it's a very I want to make a 00:45:57.040 --> 00:45:58.800 very quick point here I was back in 00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:00.940 England three weeks ago for a couple of 00:46:00.940 --> 00:46:02.780 weeks and on my way out of the airport I 00:46:02.780 --> 00:46:05.340 grabbed a couple of periodicals to read 00:46:05.340 --> 00:46:07.720 while I was on the plane. I got a new 00:46:07.720 --> 00:46:09.120 scientific and I got the Daily 00:46:09.120 --> 00:46:11.660 Telegraph and on the cover of the new 00:46:11.660 --> 00:46:14.080 scientist it had a picture of a frying 00:46:14.080 --> 00:46:17.420 pan and the word FACT the C was a piece 00:46:17.460 --> 00:46:21.800 of carbonized bacon and the F and the A 00:46:21.800 --> 00:46:24.900 and the T of the word FACT was still 00:46:24.900 --> 00:46:27.160 intact and it's a what you saw was fat 00:46:27.160 --> 00:46:30.800 with a carbonized piece of bacon forming 00:46:30.800 --> 00:46:32.280 the C but it's blackened against the 00:46:32.280 --> 00:46:33.880 black background of the frying pan and 00:46:33.880 --> 00:46:36.640 it said have we really got 40 years of 00:46:36.640 --> 00:46:39.080 dietary advice wrong and it was actually 00:46:39.080 --> 00:46:41.880 a good breath of fresh air another one 00:46:41.880 --> 00:46:43.540 of the breaths that hopefully wake 00:46:43.540 --> 00:46:44.920 people up enough when they get enough 00:46:44.960 --> 00:46:47.960 these fresh breaths coming in that to 00:46:47.960 --> 00:46:51.220 say that they were very much behind 00:46:51.220 --> 00:46:54.800 especially dairy saturated fat and that 00:46:54.800 --> 00:46:56.560 all saturated fat in general was very 00:46:56.560 --> 00:46:59.000 good for you and that the polyunsaturates 00:46:59.000 --> 00:47:01.200 and the margarines and the fish oils 00:47:01.200 --> 00:47:03.280 actually being shown now to turn be 00:47:03.280 --> 00:47:04.780 turned on their head and they were 00:47:04.780 --> 00:47:06.180 actually saying yep we think we've got 00:47:06.180 --> 00:47:08.440 40 years of dietary advice wrong so 00:47:08.440 --> 00:47:10.740 that was good to see and then the other 00:47:10.740 --> 00:47:12.680 sad point I did see in the Daily 00:47:12.680 --> 00:47:14.480 Telegraph was that in England they're 00:47:14.520 --> 00:47:18.320 now running GM crops and I when I left 00:47:18.320 --> 00:47:19.960 England in 2001 they were actually 00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:22.800 Europe was all GMO free so now in 00:47:22.800 --> 00:47:24.560 England they're actually making a GMO 00:47:24.560 --> 00:47:27.660 crop to express omega-3 oils so that 00:47:27.660 --> 00:47:30.200 they can feed this crop to GM salmon 00:47:30.200 --> 00:47:32.340 that are grown in the environment that 00:47:32.340 --> 00:47:35.040 doesn't allow them to pick up the 00:47:35.040 --> 00:47:37.540 polyunsaturate from the algae and the 00:47:37.540 --> 00:47:39.200 microorganisms that they eat so they're 00:47:39.200 --> 00:47:40.680 now going to feed them a GM crop 00:47:40.680 --> 00:47:43.180 expressing omega-3s I couldn't believe 00:47:43.220 --> 00:47:45.280 it so not too sure what's happening 00:47:45.280 --> 00:47:47.640 folks but I know California is still on 00:47:47.640 --> 00:47:49.520 the cutting edge I think of trying to 00:47:49.520 --> 00:47:52.160 see sideways here with our food and 00:47:52.160 --> 00:47:53.420 environment and everything else that's 00:47:53.420 --> 00:47:55.560 going on so hopefully between the West 00:47:55.560 --> 00:47:56.900 Coast and the East Coast of the States 00:47:56.900 --> 00:47:58.800 we can keep this kind of thing going and 00:47:58.800 --> 00:48:03.500 alive. So anyway Dr. Peat I wanted to bring 00:48:03.500 --> 00:48:06.800 up Dr. Danopoulos' work with 00:48:06.800 --> 00:48:09.540 urea therapy from the 80s I know I had a 00:48:09.540 --> 00:48:12.640 caller some time ago that I got 00:48:12.680 --> 00:48:15.380 personally who was looking for some 00:48:15.380 --> 00:48:17.240 help and information regarding liver 00:48:17.240 --> 00:48:19.740 cancer and I know Danopoulos had done 00:48:19.740 --> 00:48:23.220 quite a bit of work in 1980 publishing 00:48:23.220 --> 00:48:26.180 clinical oncology about an 11-year 00:48:26.180 --> 00:48:28.620 experience using oral urea treatment in 00:48:28.620 --> 00:48:31.460 liver malignancies. How much, how 00:48:31.460 --> 00:48:34.460 familiar are you with urea as a 00:48:34.460 --> 00:48:35.960 compound for the treatment of 00:48:35.960 --> 00:48:40.200 carcinomas or other cancers? In the 00:48:40.240 --> 00:48:43.400 First World War it was used as an 00:48:43.400 --> 00:48:46.940 emergency treatment to stimulate healing 00:48:46.940 --> 00:48:51.540 in wounds and hold down infections and 00:48:51.540 --> 00:48:54.880 around the time 1920s I think it was 00:48:54.880 --> 00:48:59.080 often used for inoperable cancer to 00:48:59.080 --> 00:49:03.860 pack it with urea to it actually was 00:49:03.860 --> 00:49:09.000 not only keeping down infection but I 00:49:09.020 --> 00:49:11.360 think it was actually having a healing 00:49:11.360 --> 00:49:15.940 influence and the effect of forming 00:49:15.940 --> 00:49:18.740 lactic acid that I mentioned which 00:49:18.740 --> 00:49:22.640 causes the pH of the cell to become 00:49:22.640 --> 00:49:27.120 more alkaline inside that causes 00:49:27.120 --> 00:49:30.120 swelling and swelling promotes 00:49:30.120 --> 00:49:35.620 replication proliferation and simply an 00:49:35.660 --> 00:49:40.260 osmotic environment which could be very 00:49:40.260 --> 00:49:44.800 concentrated sodium chloride or urea 00:49:44.800 --> 00:49:47.060 happens to be a very innocuous 00:49:47.060 --> 00:49:51.580 substance it doesn't exactly have an 00:49:51.580 --> 00:49:55.880 osmotic effect like sodium chloride 00:49:55.880 --> 00:49:58.680 because the sodium is kept out of the 00:49:58.680 --> 00:50:04.020 cell but the urea acts somewhat 00:50:04.060 --> 00:50:09.260 like an osmotic dehydrator it helps to 00:50:09.260 --> 00:50:12.220 prevent excess swelling and water 00:50:12.220 --> 00:50:14.100 retention. You think that is one of its 00:50:14.100 --> 00:50:15.760 main effects and that's how it's keeping 00:50:15.760 --> 00:50:18.060 swelling down? I think so. 00:50:18.060 --> 00:50:25.400 Okay. And the dehydrated cell becomes 00:50:25.400 --> 00:50:29.140 more oxidatively active and catabolic 00:50:29.140 --> 00:50:31.780 burning fuel faster where the swollen 00:50:31.820 --> 00:50:36.520 cell is anabolic and simply growing and 00:50:36.520 --> 00:50:41.960 dividing so many things can help to 00:50:41.960 --> 00:50:45.800 reduce that water retention. I think 00:50:45.800 --> 00:50:51.800 urea would work well with a good thyroid 00:50:51.800 --> 00:50:54.700 program which helps you to retain the 00:50:54.700 --> 00:50:57.240 normal amount of sodium chloride. 00:50:57.280 --> 00:51:03.880 Hypothyroid people not only produce the 00:51:03.880 --> 00:51:09.220 matrix which is over hydrated it shifts 00:51:09.220 --> 00:51:12.720 the cells so that they produce molecules 00:51:12.720 --> 00:51:17.320 that hold water outside of cells but the 00:51:17.320 --> 00:51:20.600 low thyroid function lets your kidneys 00:51:20.600 --> 00:51:27.000 lose sodium while retaining water and so 00:51:27.040 --> 00:51:29.680 any of the osmotic therapies such as 00:51:29.680 --> 00:51:33.120 urea I think would work nicely with 00:51:33.120 --> 00:51:37.380 supplementing thyroid to normalize the 00:51:37.380 --> 00:51:39.180 sodium retention. 00:51:39.180 --> 00:51:42.080 Good. I think we have a couple of callers 00:51:42.080 --> 00:51:44.560 on the air so I should start by taking 00:51:44.560 --> 00:51:46.620 one of these first caller. You're on the 00:51:46.620 --> 00:51:47.720 air caller, where are you from? 00:51:47.720 --> 00:51:50.600 This is David Back, the caller we had 00:51:50.600 --> 00:51:51.900 earlier who's having trouble. 00:51:51.900 --> 00:51:54.460 Okay. Hey David, go ahead. 00:51:54.460 --> 00:51:55.060 Hello. 00:51:55.100 --> 00:51:57.460 Hi. 00:51:57.460 --> 00:51:59.040 Hello. 00:51:59.040 --> 00:51:59.840 Hello. 00:51:59.840 --> 00:52:03.940 Look out. Engineering, what's going on? 00:52:03.940 --> 00:52:06.000 I don't understand, he can hear me when I 00:52:06.000 --> 00:52:09.440 talk to him, we can hear him. 00:52:09.440 --> 00:52:10.740 Can you hear me now? 00:52:10.740 --> 00:52:11.940 I can hear you. 00:52:11.940 --> 00:52:14.020 We can hear you fine David. 00:52:14.020 --> 00:52:18.060 Okay. So I guess I can hear you now. 00:52:18.060 --> 00:52:18.880 Hopefully. 00:52:18.880 --> 00:52:19.960 Are we okay? 00:52:19.960 --> 00:52:22.120 Can you hear me David or not? 00:52:22.120 --> 00:52:23.120 Okay, sorry about that. 00:52:23.120 --> 00:52:24.320 He can't hear me so you're going to have 00:52:24.360 --> 00:52:27.160 to say this I think. 00:52:27.160 --> 00:52:28.060 Dr. Peat? 00:52:28.060 --> 00:52:29.500 Yes. 00:52:29.500 --> 00:52:32.500 Yes, I have, you know, and this is I guess a 00:52:32.500 --> 00:52:35.640 little off topic but in a way it's not. 00:52:35.640 --> 00:52:38.200 When you're describing these processes, I 00:52:38.200 --> 00:52:43.080 mean you do it so beautifully and it 00:52:43.080 --> 00:52:44.640 seems very complicated but are you 00:52:44.640 --> 00:52:47.040 actually seeing images? 00:52:47.040 --> 00:52:49.880 Like do you actually see these processes? 00:52:49.880 --> 00:52:52.660 And I know of course a lot of this probably 00:52:52.680 --> 00:52:56.080 has not been photographed through 00:52:56.080 --> 00:52:59.220 microscopic techniques and different things. 00:52:59.220 --> 00:53:02.760 So are you just in a way integrating all this 00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:05.400 information and seeing things? 00:53:05.400 --> 00:53:08.860 I see little models. 00:53:08.860 --> 00:53:12.200 Not that I've seen anything exactly like it 00:53:12.200 --> 00:53:16.900 but I have mental models for example of the 00:53:16.900 --> 00:53:19.540 extension of the sulfhydryl groups under 00:53:19.540 --> 00:53:21.880 the surface of a cell. 00:53:21.920 --> 00:53:25.380 I have very concrete pictures of how that 00:53:25.380 --> 00:53:29.060 works and so it helps me when I'm looking for 00:53:29.060 --> 00:53:32.960 information to check against the published 00:53:32.960 --> 00:53:38.160 research facts to have a concrete mental image. 00:53:38.160 --> 00:53:39.900 And the reason I'm asking that question is you 00:53:39.900 --> 00:53:43.260 were explaining like the collagen lining up and 00:53:43.260 --> 00:53:46.580 a lot of times when I'm reading your work I find 00:53:46.580 --> 00:53:48.780 myself trying to imagine these things and then 00:53:48.780 --> 00:53:51.280 I'm thinking that's got to be an important part 00:53:51.300 --> 00:53:56.440 of your process in trying to imagine since 00:53:56.440 --> 00:53:59.680 you're a painter visual images of how this 00:53:59.680 --> 00:54:02.460 actually might look. 00:54:02.460 --> 00:54:03.460 Is that true? 00:54:03.460 --> 00:54:04.460 Oh sure. 00:54:04.460 --> 00:54:05.460 Yeah. 00:54:05.460 --> 00:54:07.620 I've always been aware of having a map of 00:54:07.620 --> 00:54:10.920 where I'm going and I was surprised in 00:54:10.920 --> 00:54:14.940 graduate school when a psychology professor was 00:54:14.940 --> 00:54:18.600 surprised at my description and I asked him 00:54:18.640 --> 00:54:22.240 how he found his way from his home to his 00:54:22.240 --> 00:54:25.240 office and he said go out the front door, turn 00:54:25.240 --> 00:54:28.520 left, turn left again, turn right. 00:54:28.520 --> 00:54:32.820 It was all a set of rules and I think some 00:54:32.820 --> 00:54:35.980 professorial types actually think in terms 00:54:35.980 --> 00:54:39.460 of words and rules. 00:54:39.460 --> 00:54:40.500 Yeah, definitely. 00:54:40.500 --> 00:54:44.560 You know and the other thing I thought about 00:54:44.560 --> 00:54:48.600 in line with you know like almost visualization 00:54:48.600 --> 00:54:52.260 of how this works is you know through the years 00:54:52.260 --> 00:54:55.740 I've heard of different healers and people that 00:54:55.740 --> 00:54:57.800 you know are more new agey kind of things where 00:54:57.800 --> 00:55:01.180 they try to get people to imagine certain things 00:55:01.180 --> 00:55:02.880 and then try to heal it but then I started 00:55:02.880 --> 00:55:06.180 thinking if you were really seeing this like 00:55:06.180 --> 00:55:10.580 you're seeing it you really could in a way be 00:55:10.580 --> 00:55:12.880 a part of the healing process in that you're 00:55:12.880 --> 00:55:14.980 seeing what's wrong and you're seeing what you 00:55:14.980 --> 00:55:17.360 need to do to fix it. 00:55:17.380 --> 00:55:21.060 Yeah, we were talking about the different 00:55:21.060 --> 00:55:23.560 theories of what a cancer is. 00:55:23.560 --> 00:55:28.240 The new theory it's called TOFT, tissue 00:55:28.240 --> 00:55:32.640 organization field theory and I think that 00:55:32.640 --> 00:55:37.980 needs another adjective, organismic. 00:55:37.980 --> 00:55:42.180 It isn't just the local tissue organization 00:55:42.180 --> 00:55:46.660 but it's also the way that tissue fits into 00:55:46.680 --> 00:55:50.620 the whole organism and how the activity of the 00:55:50.620 --> 00:55:56.000 organism keeps everything working, loading all 00:55:56.000 --> 00:56:00.460 of its parts so that they know what they're doing. 00:56:00.460 --> 00:56:03.040 It's very much the, and I don't want to make a 00:56:03.040 --> 00:56:06.980 quip here, but it's very much the holistic way 00:56:06.980 --> 00:56:09.080 of looking at it and that's what I found was 00:56:09.080 --> 00:56:11.640 so interesting with even though it may not have 00:56:11.640 --> 00:56:14.740 been totally accurate, Dr. Watson's comments 00:56:14.780 --> 00:56:17.580 that we made earlier and also this kind of novel 00:56:17.580 --> 00:56:19.580 approach to cancer treatment through the 00:56:19.580 --> 00:56:21.620 looking at the extracellular matrix as 00:56:21.620 --> 00:56:23.860 very much a holistic environment upon which 00:56:23.860 --> 00:56:25.820 every cell is in communication with every 00:56:25.820 --> 00:56:27.020 other cell. 00:56:27.020 --> 00:56:29.760 Stem cells are arising all the time and actually 00:56:29.760 --> 00:56:31.200 nothing is fixed. 00:56:31.200 --> 00:56:33.360 Everything is very fluid and dynamic and very 00:56:33.360 --> 00:56:39.600 much able to change very quickly. 00:56:39.600 --> 00:56:43.100 Individual cells, for example, pigment cells, 00:56:43.140 --> 00:56:47.480 you can sometimes see them migrating through the 00:56:47.480 --> 00:56:51.320 tissue and they move at the same rate that cells 00:56:51.320 --> 00:56:54.080 have been found to be able to crawl on a glass 00:56:54.080 --> 00:56:59.520 slide and that at body temperature that can be 00:56:59.520 --> 00:57:04.700 something like a centimeter and a half per day. 00:57:04.700 --> 00:57:08.900 A very tiny cell really zips along through the 00:57:08.900 --> 00:57:10.860 solid tissue. 00:57:10.860 --> 00:57:12.200 Far out. 00:57:12.240 --> 00:57:13.540 >> Thank you. 00:57:13.540 --> 00:57:16.040 >> I think we better wrap up. 00:57:16.040 --> 00:57:19.580 There are two callers on the air but we are not 00:57:19.580 --> 00:57:22.040 going to be able to take them unfortunately. 00:57:22.040 --> 00:57:25.220 It is three minutes to the top of the hour. 00:57:25.220 --> 00:57:27.880 Once again, we have run out of time. 00:57:27.880 --> 00:57:31.060 Let me let people know how to find out more 00:57:31.060 --> 00:57:32.660 about you, Dr. 00:57:32.660 --> 00:57:33.820 Peat. 00:57:33.820 --> 00:57:35.560 Thank you for joining. 00:57:35.560 --> 00:57:37.400 >> Thank you. 00:57:37.400 --> 00:57:39.360 >> Once again, unfortunately, sorry for 00:57:39.360 --> 00:57:41.700 those callers who perhaps wanted to ask 00:57:41.740 --> 00:57:42.740 something. 00:57:42.740 --> 00:57:44.940 I want to thank Dr. 00:57:44.940 --> 00:57:47.240 Peat for his work. 00:57:47.240 --> 00:57:49.300 His articles are available and freely 00:57:49.300 --> 00:57:51.180 shared on the Internet. 00:57:51.180 --> 00:57:52.940 His website is www.rayPeat.com. 00:57:52.940 --> 00:57:56.280 Most of his, well, all of his articles, not 00:57:56.280 --> 00:57:58.920 most, but all of his articles are referenced. 00:57:58.920 --> 00:58:02.020 So it is not just his opinion, what he has 00:58:02.020 --> 00:58:03.920 read, what he thinks. 00:58:03.920 --> 00:58:06.520 There is lots of references to the work 00:58:06.520 --> 00:58:08.620 that has been done, pioneering work by 00:58:08.620 --> 00:58:10.360 people that unfortunately we don't hear 00:58:10.400 --> 00:58:12.000 often enough that don't make the 00:58:12.000 --> 00:58:13.120 mainstream. 00:58:13.120 --> 00:58:15.100 But there are times when people like 00:58:15.100 --> 00:58:16.160 Mina Bissell 00:58:16.160 --> 00:58:18.460 and all the other people that Dr. 00:58:18.460 --> 00:58:20.360 Peat just brings to the show 00:58:20.360 --> 00:58:22.040 in terms of the pioneers 00:58:22.040 --> 00:58:23.800 that have done the work 00:58:23.800 --> 00:58:25.480 that we are talking about 00:58:25.480 --> 00:58:27.000 very much make the contributions 00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:28.000 that are thinking outside 00:58:28.000 --> 00:58:29.480 the box. 00:58:29.480 --> 00:58:31.920 It is that thinking outside the box 00:58:31.920 --> 00:58:32.820 that really fundamentally changes 00:58:32.820 --> 00:58:33.540 everything 00:58:33.540 --> 00:58:36.180 from what we do to what we eat. 00:58:36.180 --> 00:58:37.760 The whole quantum mechanics thing 00:58:37.760 --> 00:58:39.160 is also another very exciting 00:58:39.180 --> 00:58:40.560 field that is making 00:58:40.560 --> 00:58:41.520 the seemingly impossible 00:58:41.520 --> 00:58:42.320 possible. 00:58:42.320 --> 00:58:44.200 So, yeah, go take a look 00:58:44.200 --> 00:58:45.560 at his website. 00:58:45.560 --> 00:58:47.400 There are lots of articles 00:58:47.400 --> 00:58:48.360 ranging from diabetes 00:58:48.360 --> 00:58:49.500 to saturated fats 00:58:49.500 --> 00:58:50.200 versus polyunsaturated, 00:58:50.200 --> 00:58:50.900 cancer, 00:58:50.900 --> 00:58:51.460 dementia, 00:58:51.460 --> 00:58:52.040 inflammation, 00:58:52.040 --> 00:58:52.660 thyroid. 00:58:52.660 --> 00:58:53.500 His specialties 00:58:53.500 --> 00:58:54.200 are hormones, 00:58:54.200 --> 00:58:54.740 reproductive 00:58:54.740 --> 00:58:55.300 hormones, 00:58:55.300 --> 00:58:56.200 and ageing hormones. 00:58:56.200 --> 00:58:57.340 So very interesting 00:58:57.340 --> 00:58:58.240 work. 00:58:58.240 --> 00:59:00.140 Lots of it is very scientific 00:59:00.140 --> 00:59:02.240 but it is also very readable. 00:59:02.240 --> 00:59:04.280 And he has a lot of 00:59:04.280 --> 00:59:05.480 articles that are very 00:59:05.480 --> 00:59:06.180 interesting. 00:59:06.180 --> 00:59:07.720 He has a lot of 00:59:07.760 --> 00:59:09.100 articles that are very 00:59:09.100 --> 00:59:09.640 interesting. 00:59:09.640 --> 00:59:11.640 It is also very readable. 00:59:11.640 --> 00:59:14.300 For those of you who have joined us 00:59:14.300 --> 00:59:16.040 this evening, thanks so much for 00:59:16.040 --> 00:59:16.880 listening. 00:59:16.880 --> 00:59:19.040 Until the third Friday of next 00:59:19.040 --> 00:59:21.080 month, we can be reached toll-free 00:59:21.080 --> 00:59:22.880 1888 WBMERB for any questions, 00:59:22.880 --> 00:59:23.740 regular business hours, 00:59:23.740 --> 00:59:25.080 9 to 5. 00:59:25.080 --> 00:59:25.920 Until September, 00:59:25.920 --> 00:59:26.880 the third September 00:59:26.880 --> 00:59:27.920 of next month, 00:59:27.920 --> 00:59:30.960 good night. 00:59:31.900 --> 00:59:34.900 (Music plays) 00:59:34.900 --> 00:59:37.900 (Music plays) 00:59:37.900 --> 00:59:40.900 (Music plays) 00:59:40.900 --> 00:59:43.900 (Music plays) 00:59:43.900 --> 00:59:46.900 (Music plays) 00:59:46.900 --> 00:59:49.900 (Music plays) 00:59:49.900 --> 00:59:52.900 (Music plays) 00:59:52.900 --> 00:59:55.900 (Music plays) 00:59:55.900 --> 00:59:58.320 (soft music) 00:59:58.320 --> 01:00:00.320 You