WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:10.400 I don't think I've ever used progesterone itself in a study in humans. Going back to 00:00:10.400 --> 00:00:17.640 the 40s when progesterone was just barely becoming available, people were using it to 00:00:17.640 --> 00:00:25.000 treat cancer in humans, but it was just on an individual basis. And there have been quite 00:00:25.000 --> 00:00:33.120 a few publications using medroxyprogesterone and stuff which is not progesterone to treat 00:00:33.120 --> 00:00:39.280 kidney cancer and breast cancer and such. And it works somewhat, but it isn't progesterone 00:00:39.280 --> 00:00:47.920 and doesn't have all of the good properties of progesterone and has some of the bad properties. 00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:57.860 So the best information is still from animal studies and even those pretty much faded out 00:00:57.860 --> 00:01:05.600 after lip shoots left the field in the 50s. 00:01:05.600 --> 00:01:09.520 I thought I remembered one with women who had cervical cancer where they were injecting 00:01:09.520 --> 00:01:10.520 progesterone. 00:01:10.520 --> 00:01:13.800 Oh yeah, that was... 00:01:13.800 --> 00:01:15.680 Was that medoxyprogesterone? 00:01:15.680 --> 00:01:22.560 It was just a few women. That was real progesterone, but it was only a few women and they were 00:01:22.560 --> 00:01:32.160 just... They had diagnosed them as being incurable and so they were willing to see what happened. 00:01:32.160 --> 00:01:42.600 They were trying to cure it. And they had people, they photographed and felt the condition 00:01:42.600 --> 00:01:51.920 of the cervix at the start and then they injected what they thought were big doses. But they 00:01:51.920 --> 00:01:56.600 never mentioned that any of the women were anesthetized which happens when you give a 00:01:56.600 --> 00:02:05.280 big dose. So we don't really know how much the women were getting because they were injecting 00:02:05.280 --> 00:02:16.040 it in vegetable oil which is an unpredictable solvent. So if they weren't getting anesthetized 00:02:16.040 --> 00:02:24.600 to any extent that anyone noticed, they were hardly getting anything more than a physiological 00:02:24.600 --> 00:02:33.720 dose but still during the course of the study, they saw a great improvement in the appearance 00:02:33.720 --> 00:02:42.800 and feeling and symptoms. The bleeding decreased, the lumpiness decreased and so on. It looked 00:02:42.800 --> 00:02:51.280 less like cancer after a few weeks of treatment. But since they didn't do the experiment intending 00:02:51.280 --> 00:02:58.480 to cure cancer, they went ahead and cut out the uteruses after a certain number of weeks 00:02:58.480 --> 00:03:08.960 had elapsed and concluded that progesterone had no promise as a treatment. The article 00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:17.240 is mostly interesting for the weird conclusion and then the article published right next 00:03:17.240 --> 00:03:26.360 to that in the same book was about treating breast cancer with estrogen and as many of 00:03:26.360 --> 00:03:33.240 the patients got worse as got better with the estrogen and they concluded that this 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:41.720 stuff has great promise. Those two articles published right against each other are most 00:03:41.720 --> 00:03:54.200 interesting for the degree of psychosis that goes unnoticed in medical science. 00:03:54.200 --> 00:03:58.280 And maybe in our society in general, it's funny, you were pointing out the dominance 00:03:58.280 --> 00:04:04.760 of the estrogen industry over the last couple of shows and I was thinking that's kind of 00:04:04.760 --> 00:04:11.960 analogous to the dominance of estrogen in the sick person without the progesterone to 00:04:11.960 --> 00:04:19.520 oppose it and it seems like the same thing is happening in our society which indicates 00:04:19.520 --> 00:04:26.720 to me that there's something wrong. Yeah, this one study I think is still going 00:04:26.720 --> 00:04:37.800 on, I think his initials are D.G. Stein was the leader of this study giving progesterone 00:04:37.800 --> 00:04:45.120 within the first 24 hours after a catastrophic head injury and finding that the people survive 00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:54.280 when they get estrogen and recover remarkably well instead of just progressing to dead. 00:04:54.280 --> 00:05:02.240 So it's very effective as you said for any kind of injury of stopping excitation? 00:05:02.240 --> 00:05:12.960 Yeah, it stops edema and excitation and deterioration of any tissue but especially noticeable in 00:05:12.960 --> 00:05:19.560 the brain because edema is deadly in the brain. 00:05:19.560 --> 00:05:26.440 And as Ray pointed out in the last few shows that it's not a money maker to put it simply, 00:05:26.440 --> 00:05:33.880 progesterone is not patentable. Perhaps you could, I mean you said they tried to alter 00:05:33.880 --> 00:05:40.200 the molecule some so they could patent it but those artificial progestins they call 00:05:40.200 --> 00:05:49.160 them actually have estrogenic effects. Yeah, either estrogenic or androgenic or in 00:05:49.160 --> 00:06:01.240 some cases glucocorticoid effects and just recently I saw an article emphasizing the 00:06:01.240 --> 00:06:07.760 difference between the real progesterone and the midroxyprogesterone that was used in the 00:06:07.760 --> 00:06:20.160 Women's Health Initiative study and this person was sort of sounding annoyed that people 00:06:20.160 --> 00:06:27.800 were making the confusion but I don't know how influential that publication will be. 00:06:27.800 --> 00:06:35.520 And the midroxyprogesterone is actually what's called a progestin if you're taking hormone 00:06:35.520 --> 00:06:40.000 replacement therapy you think you're getting progesterone but you're probably just getting 00:06:40.000 --> 00:06:43.520 progestin. Yeah, it's similar enough to progesterone 00:06:43.520 --> 00:06:50.640 that it turns off your own production of progesterone and the odd thing about real progesterone 00:06:50.640 --> 00:06:56.880 is that if you aren't producing enough of it and you take some, you produce more of 00:06:56.880 --> 00:07:05.480 it. It reinforces the system for its own production, just exactly the opposite of what these systems 00:07:05.480 --> 00:07:16.240 synthetic progestins do. I see. On the same subject of cancer, somebody 00:07:16.240 --> 00:07:24.360 brought up the point that Craig B. Thompson, President and CEO of Memorial Sloan Kettering 00:07:24.360 --> 00:07:30.080 Cancer Center has something on YouTube where he discusses new ways to think about cancer 00:07:30.080 --> 00:07:37.560 and how cancer arises in humans and I'm going to accept this call here. He concludes that 00:07:37.560 --> 00:07:43.200 at the end that if you overfeed someone with fat you do not increase their rise of cancer 00:07:43.200 --> 00:07:51.000 at all. If you overfeed someone with carbohydrates you dramatically increase the cancer rate 00:07:51.000 --> 00:07:55.560 and protein is halfway in between and this person would like to hear your response to 00:07:55.560 --> 00:08:02.320 that. Oh, I haven't read it but I've seen a couple 00:08:02.320 --> 00:08:11.680 of other things that I think are equally crazy. Gary Tobes or Tobs has an article in Science 00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:20.320 about a year ago saying basically the same thing which I think he got his idea from Dr. 00:08:20.320 --> 00:08:37.040 Lustig's video. But I have read lots of studies on the subject and going back almost 00:08:37.040 --> 00:08:47.920 100, well 90 years anyway, I think the evidence is very clear that fat is the main, unsaturated 00:08:47.920 --> 00:08:57.840 fat is if not the only, it's at least by far the largest promoter of cancer not just 00:08:57.840 --> 00:09:07.440 in humans but everywhere they look. And the interesting thing about carbohydrate is that 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:15.960 the fats that we make out of carbohydrate when we eat an excess of it are anti-growth 00:09:15.960 --> 00:09:28.880 of cancer. They lower the amount of unsaturated fats circulating in our blood and they have 00:09:28.880 --> 00:09:37.800 a shift effect on the metabolism of cancer cells. They tend to restore oxidative metabolism 00:09:37.800 --> 00:09:47.280 and suppress aerobic glycolysis which is a characteristic cancer metabolism. So this 00:09:47.280 --> 00:09:57.080 guy, he might have some bit of evidence in mind but if he doesn't mention the 99% of 00:09:57.080 --> 00:10:04.040 the overwhelmingly opposing evidence there's something wrong with his presentation. 00:10:04.040 --> 00:10:10.120 He doesn't distinguish between fats, he just says fat and or carbohydrate. 00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:16.800 One of the ways they trick the experiment so it looks like they can improve their sales 00:10:16.800 --> 00:10:27.960 of fish fat or whatever is to give the most toxic fat as to the control animals and their 00:10:27.960 --> 00:10:36.160 test substance such as fish fat to the other animals and the fish fat happens to oxidize 00:10:36.160 --> 00:10:44.920 so quickly that it doesn't reach the cells in quantity as great as the seed oil does. 00:10:44.920 --> 00:10:52.920 And if they're feeding a comparison between fat and sugar for example, they'll make sure 00:10:52.920 --> 00:11:04.040 to add the carcinogenic required amount of linoleic acid to the diet so that then the 00:11:04.040 --> 00:11:12.120 sugar all goes in the storage but the animal is still being exposed to the crucial carcinogenic 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:22.800 amount of linoleic acid. I've looked at probably 150 articles that claim to have results of 00:11:22.800 --> 00:11:30.960 that sort and they're all, it's hard to imagine that they weren't designing it just to get 00:11:30.960 --> 00:11:33.960 the results they want. 00:11:33.960 --> 00:11:39.240 Well we should probably get back to that. In a minute we have a caller on the line. 00:11:39.240 --> 00:11:40.240 Gene are you there? 00:11:40.240 --> 00:11:49.840 Oh yes, yes. Sorry I shiggled, I didn't listen before I called in. Hi, a couple of questions 00:11:49.840 --> 00:11:58.600 if it's okay. One I tried, I haven't eaten dairy food, much dairy food for many years 00:11:58.600 --> 00:12:07.600 and I've been trying your diet and I started drinking milk, whole raw milk and my sinuses 00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:13.280 got stuffed up again. Is there any? 00:12:13.280 --> 00:12:14.720 What happened? 00:12:14.720 --> 00:12:19.600 My sinuses got clogged up. 00:12:19.600 --> 00:12:20.600 Well I've 00:12:20.600 --> 00:12:25.440 I've always had that problem. 00:12:25.440 --> 00:12:32.520 I wouldn't necessarily recommend whole milk or raw milk unless you're familiar with the 00:12:32.520 --> 00:12:42.040 particular cows and if you get a bad result from one dairy or one cow then try another 00:12:42.040 --> 00:12:51.280 one that feeds the cows something different. I've felt the difference myself just between 00:12:51.280 --> 00:12:58.240 local dairies and in a supermarket. There was one brand of milk that was always cheaper 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:05.480 and tasted a little funny and I always got sick when I drank it and there are so many 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:14.360 things that can go wrong. All milk except whole milk and maybe even that now but the 00:13:14.360 --> 00:13:21.920 government requires the addition of vitamin A and D to all of the commercial milk supplies 00:13:21.920 --> 00:13:32.640 and those dairies don't like to tell how they add those vitamins but generally there is 00:13:32.640 --> 00:13:42.440 some diluent that the vitamins are carried in probably an emulsifier so that they don't 00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:49.960 stick to the sides of the vessels or float to the top. 00:13:49.960 --> 00:13:56.880 This milk was from a local organic raw dairy, raw milk, you know with the cream mixed in 00:13:56.880 --> 00:14:02.720 and I've had the same problem drinking or eating dairy from many different sources for 00:14:02.720 --> 00:14:10.360 many years. I seem to have the same response whether it's from store bought or right from 00:14:10.360 --> 00:14:14.040 the cow or whatever. 00:14:14.040 --> 00:14:17.240 You get that from cottage cheese or cheese? 00:14:17.240 --> 00:14:18.640 Yes. 00:14:18.640 --> 00:14:20.480 Or from goat milk? 00:14:20.480 --> 00:14:29.400 I don't like goat milk. I don't like the taste of that. 00:14:29.400 --> 00:14:37.680 It's undoubtedly some kind of digestive problem but it's just a matter of experimenting. Different 00:14:37.680 --> 00:14:45.360 kinds of cheese, have you noticed an effect on your sinus symptoms? 00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:54.240 Yeah, usually once in a while it doesn't bother me but most of the time it does. I don't have 00:14:54.240 --> 00:15:02.280 any digestive problems, just sinus and my lungs get, I get mucus in my lungs as well 00:15:02.280 --> 00:15:06.640 or cough up mucus. 00:15:06.640 --> 00:15:14.080 How the mucus gets there is that your intestine is being irritated and the irritation is either 00:15:14.080 --> 00:15:24.160 that you have bacteria growing on the food or the food itself contains allergens. And 00:15:24.160 --> 00:15:32.320 very often just by changing the dairy or the type of cheese or cooking it rather than eating 00:15:32.320 --> 00:15:40.440 it raw, you can find which things cause the mucus reaction but it isn't that the milk 00:15:40.440 --> 00:15:48.760 gets into your blood and causes mucus production in your head or lungs, it's a reaction from 00:15:48.760 --> 00:15:49.760 your intestine. 00:15:49.760 --> 00:15:50.760 Oh, okay. 00:15:50.760 --> 00:15:56.760 Hey Gene, could you stand back from your microphone or talk a little softer? You're a little too 00:15:56.760 --> 00:15:57.760 loud. 00:15:57.760 --> 00:16:04.440 Okay, sure. I've been working with Lita Lee and she suggests that I drink cream instead 00:16:04.440 --> 00:16:07.640 of milk to solve the problem. 00:16:07.640 --> 00:16:09.280 Drink what kind? 00:16:09.280 --> 00:16:13.040 Cream rather than milk. 00:16:13.040 --> 00:16:21.680 I've never heard of anyone trying that but I would say try some homemade skimmed milk 00:16:21.680 --> 00:16:24.120 cottage cheese first. 00:16:24.120 --> 00:16:31.840 Okay. All right. Is that better, John? 00:16:31.840 --> 00:16:35.120 That's a little better. You can even back up more because you're coming, I think because 00:16:35.120 --> 00:16:37.520 you're so close it's very loud. 00:16:37.520 --> 00:16:45.080 Okay. Well, thank you. My second question is I have a relative who's been diagnosed 00:16:45.080 --> 00:16:57.880 with chronic superficial gastritis and also inflamed duodenum. What would you suggest 00:16:57.880 --> 00:16:58.880 there? 00:16:58.880 --> 00:17:08.760 Have they been checked with an endoscopy for bacteria or exactly what the condition 00:17:08.760 --> 00:17:09.760 is? 00:17:09.760 --> 00:17:20.240 Yes, through a colonoscopy and also through the throat. 00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:28.480 And did they find that they had any bacterial problem growing up in the duodenum or stomach? 00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:40.280 I believe so but I'm not positive. He's had severe stomach pain for two or three years. 00:17:40.280 --> 00:17:45.200 It's been getting worse and lots of diarrhea. 00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:54.320 It's good to check things like the thyroid but also to consider an elimination diet. 00:17:54.320 --> 00:18:03.400 There are so many foods, even natural fresh foods. You can rank them according to their 00:18:03.400 --> 00:18:12.240 likelihood to support bacterial growth. And then there are lots of food additives that 00:18:12.240 --> 00:18:21.360 are definitely anything with carrageenan, for example. It's causing a lot of cases of 00:18:21.360 --> 00:18:29.360 inflammation of the stomach, bowel, diarrhea, constipation. And carrageenan is showing up 00:18:29.360 --> 00:18:39.960 in an incredible number of foods, everything from organic whipping cream to squid patties. 00:18:39.960 --> 00:18:55.240 Okay, we'll check and work on that. 00:18:55.240 --> 00:18:56.240 Anything else Gene? 00:18:56.240 --> 00:19:01.240 Not at the moment. 00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:09.960 All right, Ray, hang on just a sec, Gene. Is there any use in sneaking up on the milk 00:19:09.960 --> 00:19:14.920 consumption, just doing a little bit at a time? 00:19:14.920 --> 00:19:25.080 If a person thinks they might have a problem digesting the lactose or any food that's chemically 00:19:25.080 --> 00:19:37.040 different than if you drink two or three ounces at a meal, that exposes the intestine to the 00:19:37.040 --> 00:19:46.320 new chemical. And in a week or two or at most a month or two, the enzymes usually will express 00:19:46.320 --> 00:19:52.680 themselves even though they might have been gone for years. You can usually induce them 00:19:52.680 --> 00:20:00.560 in a few weeks by these small samples, just a half a glass at a time. So there's not enough 00:20:00.560 --> 00:20:10.680 to feed the bacteria significantly, but enough to sort of tickle the enzyme system into getting 00:20:10.680 --> 00:20:11.680 active. 00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:21.800 I actually started with just a couple of ounces a day. And as soon as I did, I had that response. 00:20:21.800 --> 00:20:31.080 All right. And what about, were you going to ask about the enzymes, Gene? We talked 00:20:31.080 --> 00:20:33.520 about that on Monday. Was that something? 00:20:33.520 --> 00:20:40.600 Oh, yeah. As I said, I've been working with Lita Lee. I guess you know her, Ray? 00:20:40.600 --> 00:20:41.600 Yes. 00:20:41.600 --> 00:20:51.360 And she has recommended I take a number of enzyme supplements. Are you familiar with 00:20:51.360 --> 00:20:52.360 those? 00:20:52.360 --> 00:21:01.160 Yeah, but I'm very cautious with any kind of a pill-shaped supplement. 00:21:01.160 --> 00:21:03.320 Me too. 00:21:03.320 --> 00:21:12.440 In the process, there are so many allergens that can enter. So anything that especially 00:21:12.440 --> 00:21:19.720 involves microorganisms, you want to be very cautious. A couple of people have told me 00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:29.880 that when they took the pure pre-amino acids that they got incredibly sick. And you have 00:21:29.880 --> 00:21:37.840 to be really cautious and maybe take a half a tablet as a trial and wait three days or 00:21:37.840 --> 00:21:40.600 so just to make sure you handle it. 00:21:40.600 --> 00:21:49.040 The same with any supplement. Vitamin C supplements can cause terrible problems for people. I've 00:21:49.040 --> 00:21:57.760 seen people who had terrible sinus symptoms for years and years. And when I just suggested 00:21:57.760 --> 00:22:03.600 they lay off their vitamin supplements for a week, they didn't ever have a runny nose 00:22:03.600 --> 00:22:04.600 again. 00:22:04.600 --> 00:22:10.320 Not too much of a testimonial for vitamins. 00:22:10.320 --> 00:22:21.760 Yeah, for a while, I was counseling at an alternative health place in Eugene where allergies 00:22:21.760 --> 00:22:27.880 in the summer because of the grass fields around Eugene, allergies were a big problem. 00:22:27.880 --> 00:22:35.480 And for a couple of years, I had a reputation for curing everyone's allergies by getting 00:22:35.480 --> 00:22:37.720 them to stop their vitamins. 00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:47.120 Are you familiar with Lyme disease and any connection with that and thyroid? 00:22:47.120 --> 00:22:55.520 Yeah, hypothyroidism is often misdiagnosed as Lyme disease. Candida is the other thing 00:22:55.520 --> 00:23:04.280 that is commonly, if you can't find the cause, then Lyme disease and Candida are the 00:23:04.280 --> 00:23:10.000 first suspects, but usually it's just hypothyroidism. 00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:14.600 What if you test positive for Lyme? 00:23:14.600 --> 00:23:23.960 Well lots of people do. There's some overlap with other, we all tend to be exposed to spirochetes 00:23:23.960 --> 00:23:32.160 and there's overlap with other spirochetes. And a course of antibiotics for a week or 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:43.400 two is a way to eliminate it. Lyme disease can be eradicated just as syphilis would be 00:23:43.400 --> 00:23:54.080 for example. But by avoiding looking for other causes such as hypothyroidism, some doctors 00:23:54.080 --> 00:23:59.560 make a good business out of the Lyme treatments for sure. 00:23:59.560 --> 00:24:09.080 I've been working with a naturopathic doctor who recommends antibiotics for the initial 00:24:09.080 --> 00:24:18.520 onset of Lyme, but then mostly herbs. And what he says, I guess a number of people say, 00:24:18.520 --> 00:24:29.440 is that the antibiotics force the spirochete to create a hard shell around themselves and 00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:35.880 they go into the shell which is why the symptoms desist after antibiotics. But then over time 00:24:35.880 --> 00:24:42.320 the spirochetes break out of the shell and migrate around your body, especially in joints 00:24:42.320 --> 00:24:56.600 and stuff which is why people experience joint pain years after the initial onset of Lyme. 00:24:56.600 --> 00:25:08.760 Well if they haven't eliminated an endocrine problem, what I see is that the hypothyroid 00:25:08.760 --> 00:25:16.200 people with low immune function also get the whole range of symptoms that are blamed on 00:25:16.200 --> 00:25:25.440 that such as arthritis. And if you can cure the disease by correcting the thyroid, it's 00:25:25.440 --> 00:25:35.800 a lot easier. About 40 or 45 years ago a friend of mine had an accident working on his house 00:25:35.800 --> 00:25:44.480 and the stress of it apparently brought on severe arthritis and he went to his doctor 00:25:44.480 --> 00:25:55.960 who examined him and didn't prescribe cortisone for his arthritis, he prescribed thyroid, 00:25:55.960 --> 00:26:02.960 armor thyroid supplement because he saw he was hypothyroid. And my friend was really 00:26:02.960 --> 00:26:12.520 annoyed, went home grumbling. The doctor had fixed something that he thought wasn't broke 00:26:12.520 --> 00:26:21.480 and in a week or two of taking the thyroid his arthritis disappeared and never came back. 00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:33.800 But not many doctors are aware of connections such as injury, stress, arthritis, hypothyroidism 00:26:33.800 --> 00:26:45.080 and most doctors would prescribe at best cortisone to treat the symptoms. But I think a lot of 00:26:45.080 --> 00:26:52.160 the Lyme doctors are doing a similar thing, making a simple problem complex. 00:26:52.160 --> 00:27:04.280 Ray, is it possible that the bite from the tick triggers some anti-thyroid response? 00:27:04.280 --> 00:27:11.960 Well probably low thyroid people have a bigger inflammatory response and probably are more 00:27:11.960 --> 00:27:23.720 likely to fail to throw off the infection. So if you have the diagnosis it's good to 00:27:23.720 --> 00:27:33.040 take recourse of antibiotics but antibiotics, a good combination of antibiotics is well 00:27:33.040 --> 00:27:37.000 established as a cure. 00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:43.400 I see. You have another question Gene? 00:27:43.400 --> 00:27:45.560 You're starting to break up again. 00:27:45.560 --> 00:27:48.040 Oh, how is it now? Is it still terrible? 00:27:48.040 --> 00:27:49.040 It's hurtly. 00:27:49.040 --> 00:27:54.920 Okay, let's see if it corrects itself in a minute. Gene, whenever you move around there's 00:27:54.920 --> 00:27:57.680 a huge amount of noise too on the radio. 00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:01.880 I can't understand what you're saying. 00:28:01.880 --> 00:28:06.080 Okay, let me, I'm going to reconnect the call and we'll start over. 00:28:06.080 --> 00:28:07.080 Okay. 00:28:07.080 --> 00:28:08.080 Okay. 00:28:08.080 --> 00:28:09.080 Okay. 00:28:09.080 --> 00:28:10.080 Yep. 00:28:10.080 --> 00:28:17.640 All right, you're listening to WMRW, LP Warren. This is a special wacky fundraiser show with 00:28:17.640 --> 00:28:24.880 Dr. Raymond Peat. Ray's not wacky but the technology is I'm using Skype to try to do 00:28:24.880 --> 00:28:39.400 a call and show and it's our fundraiser so if you'd like to contribute to WMRW you can 00:28:39.400 --> 00:28:42.440 go to WMRW.org and click on the pig. 00:28:42.440 --> 00:28:43.440 Hi. 00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:45.000 Hey, we're back. 00:28:45.000 --> 00:28:46.000 Okay. 00:28:46.000 --> 00:28:55.960 Gene, are you still there? No, we lost Gene too. So the phone line is open again and I 00:28:55.960 --> 00:29:05.840 should repeat it. It's 802-526-2326, 802-526-2326. If you have a computer with Skype in it and 00:29:05.840 --> 00:29:10.880 you're sitting in front of it you can also Skype John Barkhausen and we should probably 00:29:10.880 --> 00:29:12.320 open the line up for some other people. 00:29:12.320 --> 00:29:14.960 Oh, Gene's back. Hey, Gene. 00:29:14.960 --> 00:29:15.960 Yes. 00:29:15.960 --> 00:29:19.840 Do you have another question we should probably see if somebody else wants to get into? 00:29:19.840 --> 00:29:24.400 Sure. Try someone else and if they don't I'll come back with another one. 00:29:24.400 --> 00:29:26.880 Okay. Great. Is the streaming working all right? 00:29:26.880 --> 00:29:28.880 It is now, yeah. 00:29:28.880 --> 00:29:32.920 Okay, great. All right. Well, we'll talk to you probably in a little bit. 00:29:32.920 --> 00:29:34.880 Should I stay on or? 00:29:34.880 --> 00:29:39.200 It's better for the noise level to not be on because every little noise in the background 00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:40.200 distracts. 00:29:40.200 --> 00:29:43.320 So I can listen on the radio and then call in if no one else is listening? 00:29:43.320 --> 00:29:45.000 Yeah, that'd be great. 00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:46.000 Okay, thanks. 00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:59.960 Okay, thanks. So you think Lyme Ray has an initial infection that can be affected by 00:29:59.960 --> 00:30:09.320 antibiotics but most likely it's not the cause of the tiredness and somehow it's triggered 00:30:09.320 --> 00:30:10.320 hypothyroidism. 00:30:10.320 --> 00:30:19.920 So we lost Ray again. 00:30:19.920 --> 00:30:24.920 On hold. 00:30:24.920 --> 00:30:29.720 Hello? 00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:45.920 This is WMRWLP Warren with a series of mess ups. Calling back Dr. Raymond Peat who's a 00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:49.720 PhD in biology and has done extensive research. 00:30:49.720 --> 00:30:50.720 Hi. 00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:51.720 Hey, Ray. 00:30:51.720 --> 00:30:52.720 Yeah. 00:30:52.720 --> 00:30:59.600 One more time. This could get old. So I was just asking. So you really think Lyme 00:30:59.600 --> 00:31:03.880 disease is just a thyroid problem that's triggered by the immune? 00:31:03.880 --> 00:31:11.520 Well, no, not the disease but the diagnosis. I would say 80 or 90 percent of the people 00:31:11.520 --> 00:31:18.400 that I've talked to have been the doctors who specialize in diagnosing it and treating 00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:19.400 it chronically. 00:31:19.400 --> 00:31:26.640 I see. And have you had luck treating people for Lyme? 00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:35.200 Yeah, well, no, but they get well and forget about the Lyme diagnosis. 00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:40.520 I get you. So you give them nutritional advice. 00:31:40.520 --> 00:31:41.520 Yeah. 00:31:41.520 --> 00:31:44.520 Yeah. And I think 00:31:44.520 --> 00:31:52.960 And the power of undigested food is very underestimated. 00:31:52.960 --> 00:31:56.400 Can you explain that? 00:31:56.400 --> 00:32:04.840 Well, overcooking food like people used to do 100 years ago, it's much better for the 00:32:04.840 --> 00:32:15.800 digestion because we aren't designed to eat undercooked or raw vegetable matter. Bacteria 00:32:15.800 --> 00:32:22.880 can eat it. And if someone happens to have just the right mix of bacteria, their bacteria 00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:33.200 can eat their vegetables secondarily and release some of the nutrients. But if you get the 00:32:33.200 --> 00:32:40.640 wrong bacteria, then they produce toxins rather than nutrients. 00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:45.240 And that's the endotoxin problem that you've referred to. 00:32:45.240 --> 00:32:46.640 Yeah. 00:32:46.640 --> 00:32:50.640 Which basically poisons your system and taxes your liver. 00:32:50.640 --> 00:32:59.680 Yeah. Endotoxin and many other things. Allergens released from the specific plant material 00:32:59.680 --> 00:33:01.680 as well as bacterial toxins. 00:33:01.680 --> 00:33:07.000 I don't know if we discussed this on the air before, but it's always amazed me that you 00:33:07.000 --> 00:33:11.360 talk about endotoxin all the time. If you look it up on the Internet, there's a lot 00:33:11.360 --> 00:33:16.840 of information about it. It's a real thing. It actually causes severe problems and that 00:33:16.840 --> 00:33:23.160 seems to be well recognized. But I've talked to several doctors, internists about it, smart 00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:28.480 people. They've never ever heard of it. 00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:37.280 I guess they forgot that section in medical school during a generation or two. But in 00:33:37.280 --> 00:33:48.720 the 19th century, the intestine was a big focus of Anglo-American medicine and some 00:33:48.720 --> 00:33:55.680 other European varieties, but especially the English and Americans were very interested 00:33:55.680 --> 00:34:07.200 in what the intestine does to the whole system. The brain, intestine, symptoms, interactions, 00:34:07.200 --> 00:34:17.240 and the other organs as they're influenced by the intestine. That was still pretty big 00:34:17.240 --> 00:34:29.720 up until 1920 and there was a campaign against it. Walter C. Alvarez, a newspaper enteologist, 00:34:29.720 --> 00:34:41.040 helped to suppress the intestine culture in popular medicine. For example, there was a 00:34:41.040 --> 00:34:49.000 belief that migraines or headaches in general were produced by toxins absorbed from the 00:34:49.000 --> 00:34:58.360 intestine and he was of the new school that didn't want to think about the intestine so 00:34:58.360 --> 00:35:06.440 much even though he was a gastroenterologist. So he stuffed wads of cotton into his medical 00:35:06.440 --> 00:35:17.320 students' rectums and reported that the next morning a certain proportion of them had headaches 00:35:17.320 --> 00:35:24.440 caused just by the pressure in the rectum. He said, "So you see, headaches are caused 00:35:24.440 --> 00:35:32.600 by pressure, not by toxins." But he didn't put any toxins in his students' intestines 00:35:32.600 --> 00:35:41.440 so he didn't disprove the idea, but it was just a little propaganda bit. The other people, 00:35:41.440 --> 00:35:49.880 Russians for example, studied in more detail that in fact toxins, nutrition, and pressure 00:35:49.880 --> 00:35:59.360 interact very meaningfully. In an experimental animal, for example, they would put a balloon 00:35:59.360 --> 00:36:07.080 in the intestine and blow it up and nothing would happen. The animal would keep functioning, 00:36:07.080 --> 00:36:13.900 but if they gave the animal hypoglycemia and then blew up the intestine, unpredictable 00:36:13.900 --> 00:36:23.200 things would happen all through the rabbit. It would have hormonal and neurological reactions 00:36:23.200 --> 00:36:29.320 triggered just by that pressure of blowing up a balloon in the intestine. It could cause 00:36:29.320 --> 00:36:38.240 seizures or wheezing or all kinds of widespread reactions. 00:36:38.240 --> 00:36:44.720 And that's when you have low blood sugar, that's when it's particularly dangerous to 00:36:44.720 --> 00:36:45.720 have blockages? 00:36:45.720 --> 00:36:55.160 Yeah, and French and Canadian researchers, instead of using pressure, they combined allergens. 00:36:55.160 --> 00:37:04.320 They would feed a bit of walnut to an animal and it would maybe sneeze from the allergens 00:37:04.320 --> 00:37:12.080 in it. Then they would give it moderate hypoglycemia and feed it the same thing and it would die 00:37:12.080 --> 00:37:23.720 in shock. And then if they would give another bunch of animals slight hyperglycemia by infusing 00:37:23.720 --> 00:37:30.440 some glucose and feed them the same walnut or whatever, they wouldn't even sniffle. 00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:38.800 Wow, so that goes along with what you said that sugar or glucose is protective, so it's 00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:41.440 very important to keep your blood sugar up. 00:37:41.440 --> 00:37:49.760 Yeah, I think the particular researcher who did that was named Adam Kiewicz and it was 00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:59.280 published in a book by Yasmin, K-A-S-M-I-N, Kytan Yasmin. 00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:05.920 Why was Alvarez so opposed to the research that was done in the 1800s? I have a book 00:38:05.920 --> 00:38:09.000 of his and he seems like a very reasonable fellow. 00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:16.720 Yeah, he was very entertaining and intelligent, but he was just a modern that wanted to get 00:38:16.720 --> 00:38:24.800 away from the old-fashioned country doctor who cured everything with laxative. 00:38:24.800 --> 00:38:33.720 I see. As long as we're on the subject of digestion, how important is it that people 00:38:33.720 --> 00:38:38.880 have regular bowel movements? 00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:53.560 I think like the person who popularized fiber 40, 50 years ago in the U.S. was studying 00:38:53.560 --> 00:39:04.400 the African relative freedom from bowel problems, cancer, and he saw that they typically would 00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:10.960 have three bowel movements a day and that they ate lots of potatoes and that it was 00:39:10.960 --> 00:39:16.600 the fiber in the potato stimulating the intestine that seemed to protect their bowel. 00:39:16.600 --> 00:39:28.320 So he published things about the benefits of fiber and the cereal industry in the U.S. 00:39:28.320 --> 00:39:38.520 Started selling oat bran as the preventive of colon cancer, which caught on in the 70s, 00:39:38.520 --> 00:39:46.400 but then in the 80s, some Australians tested oat bran diets on animals and found that it 00:39:46.400 --> 00:39:56.040 promoted increased the incidence of bowel cancer, apparently by the nature of the breakdown 00:39:56.040 --> 00:39:57.040 product. 00:39:57.040 --> 00:40:01.360 Yeah, I don't think that knowledge has ever gotten around. 00:40:01.360 --> 00:40:12.280 Not very well. But in general, fiber does clean the intestine and keeping it moving 00:40:12.280 --> 00:40:22.440 lowers the estrogen reabsorption. The bile puts out, tries to get rid of toxic materials 00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:30.600 including estrogen and if you don't have a regular movement through the intestine, 00:40:30.600 --> 00:40:38.280 a lot of that gets recycled, reabsorbed, and raises your general exposure to toxins including 00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:39.280 estrogen. 00:40:39.280 --> 00:40:46.600 All right, well that's a good answer. I better get to some of the questions that have come 00:40:46.600 --> 00:40:52.960 in by email. I keep thinking we have so much time because it's a two hour show, but if 00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:58.320 we have any more mess ups with the phone system, it may be a short show. So let me get to these 00:40:58.320 --> 00:41:11.480 questions. There's one here from Keenan asking, "What do you think of medicinal marijuana 00:41:11.480 --> 00:41:23.720 and its relationship to cancer and AIDS? Is it efficacious?" 00:41:23.720 --> 00:41:34.880 Well it helps with the nausea if a person is having symptoms and can control the symptoms 00:41:34.880 --> 00:41:45.920 with it. It's very effective for many people. And the tea, when I was 10, the doctor gave 00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:54.360 me a bag, didn't say what it was, but prescribed a cup of tea every day. And years later, I 00:41:54.360 --> 00:42:05.600 recognized the taste of it as marijuana. It was supposed to prevent my headaches, but 00:42:05.600 --> 00:42:15.160 it didn't do anything noticeable for me. It used to be prescribed a lot as a tea, and 00:42:15.160 --> 00:42:21.840 I think it's a lot safer that way than smoking it because the smoke itself is carcinogenic 00:42:21.840 --> 00:42:32.920 and estrogenic. And the various chemicals in the leaf are themselves slightly estrogenic 00:42:32.920 --> 00:42:41.760 or anti-androgenic. So I think that's probably the main concern for someone who's using it 00:42:41.760 --> 00:42:52.800 regularly. But I think there are other probably healthier solutions for nausea. The anti-serotonin 00:42:52.800 --> 00:43:02.000 drugs and simply increasing the blood sugar, salt and sugar, very often help with nausea. 00:43:02.000 --> 00:43:07.800 Okay, well thanks. We have another caller on the line. Roger, are you there? 00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:08.800 Yeah, hi. 00:43:08.800 --> 00:43:11.720 Hi, this is Ray Peat on the line with you. 00:43:11.720 --> 00:43:24.160 Hi, Dr. Peat. Thank you for taking my call. My question centers around omega-3 fatty acids. 00:43:24.160 --> 00:43:34.280 A couple years ago, I came across a supplement of whole fish oil, of salmon fish oil that 00:43:34.280 --> 00:43:42.280 contained omega-3s, and it was touted as being a great supplement to help arthritis and lower 00:43:42.280 --> 00:43:51.320 triglyceride levels and that kind of thing. And then I read your research which sort of 00:43:51.320 --> 00:44:00.800 contradicted all of these things that I was hoping that fish oil would do, like save my 00:44:00.800 --> 00:44:07.480 great antioxidant and reverse my aging process probably about 20 years. But I was wondering 00:44:07.480 --> 00:44:22.320 if you could elaborate on what you found and explain what you think the dangers are of 00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:28.960 taking supplements of fish oil. Because I've been seeing that these fatty acids, the omega-3s 00:44:28.960 --> 00:44:35.040 are showing up in all kinds of organic products like organic milk and baby formula. And it 00:44:35.040 --> 00:44:39.440 seems kind of dangerous to me if there is a problem with the supplement. 00:44:39.440 --> 00:44:49.440 Yeah, someone two or three years ago analyzed the baby formulas and found that the great 00:44:49.440 --> 00:45:00.440 bulk of the omega-3 that had been added to it had broken down and was probably in a toxic 00:45:00.440 --> 00:45:09.880 form. So their worst feature is that they break down and oxidize very fast. And a couple 00:45:09.880 --> 00:45:17.700 of researchers have looked for them in the blood at the time that they are having their 00:45:17.700 --> 00:45:29.000 anti-inflammatory actions and found that they had already broken down just between the mouth 00:45:29.000 --> 00:45:35.640 and the bloodstream. They broke down into completely new chemicals which were what accounted 00:45:35.640 --> 00:45:43.520 for their anti-inflammatory effect. But those same breakdown products are what in the long 00:45:43.520 --> 00:45:52.120 run suppress the whole immune system and have a lot of other toxic effects. So the short 00:45:52.120 --> 00:46:00.160 range anti-inflammatory effect I see is analogous to the anti-inflammatory treatments I used 00:46:00.160 --> 00:46:05.480 to give with x-ray or other radiation. 00:46:05.480 --> 00:46:15.760 Yeah, what would some of those other, the other effects, negative effects be other than? 00:46:15.760 --> 00:46:23.480 Well the whole immune system gets turned down so that it doesn't produce the inflammation 00:46:23.480 --> 00:46:30.040 that's bothering you. But in the long run that makes you susceptible to all kinds of 00:46:30.040 --> 00:46:40.240 infections and I think in the long run it increases the risk of cancer and all of the 00:46:40.240 --> 00:46:44.240 age-related degenerative processes. 00:46:44.240 --> 00:46:52.400 Do you think it would be important to continue to monitor people, mothers, nurses, all of 00:46:52.400 --> 00:47:00.280 us who are using these omega supplements to see if we have the effect? 00:47:00.280 --> 00:47:11.160 A few people are doing that and warning about their increased use. It seems like a very 00:47:11.160 --> 00:47:23.600 bad idea to put it in powdered baby food because the time and oxygen exposure before it's eaten 00:47:23.600 --> 00:47:30.920 it just does a terrific job of degrading those fats because they're so unstable. 00:47:30.920 --> 00:47:41.520 Yeah, what should we look for as a symptom that this is a problem? More infections, more 00:47:41.520 --> 00:47:44.920 colds? 00:47:44.920 --> 00:47:50.600 More infections would be the first thing. I've seen that in experimental animals and 00:47:50.600 --> 00:47:59.720 there have been some studies in people in which their immune systems were relatively 00:47:59.720 --> 00:48:09.480 inert against various organisms. 00:48:09.480 --> 00:48:16.760 With the anti-inflammatory x-ray treatments that they used in the 40s so enthusiastically 00:48:16.760 --> 00:48:29.600 it took from 10 to 15 years before they saw the harmful effects of them. 00:48:29.600 --> 00:48:38.120 What can we do as consumers to alert or to get other doctors such as yourself to maybe 00:48:38.120 --> 00:48:46.000 conduct additional research that supports your theories? I have called various manufacturers 00:48:46.000 --> 00:48:51.680 of the product and milk companies who are using the product and they assured me that 00:48:51.680 --> 00:48:54.320 everything was completely fine. 00:48:54.320 --> 00:49:09.400 Yeah, it's the same with the additives they're putting in so many products like the fumed 00:49:09.400 --> 00:49:20.400 silica, silicon dioxide that you see in vitamin pills and drugs and even foods and titanium 00:49:20.400 --> 00:49:29.920 dioxide and so on. These things are proven risky at best but you talk to the companies 00:49:29.920 --> 00:49:41.160 that use them and they don't want to think about it. They won't respond to sending them 00:49:41.160 --> 00:49:53.640 an article indicating that they somehow selectively misread the research incriminating the material. 00:49:53.640 --> 00:50:04.680 It's hard to counter someone's occupational commitment to something that isn't helpful. 00:50:04.680 --> 00:50:10.360 And Ray, maybe you can explain why it's come about that, I mean I don't know if there's 00:50:10.360 --> 00:50:16.760 a short answer to this, but why it's come about that most of society in scientific culture 00:50:16.760 --> 00:50:22.440 is invested in these products that actually, although they might help inflammation in the 00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:31.000 short run, cause cancer in the long run. How did we get here? 00:50:31.000 --> 00:50:40.200 The whole idea of science has been shaped by commerce and the military. The people who 00:50:40.200 --> 00:50:47.440 have something very powerful to gain from using science in a certain way, supported 00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:59.480 being used that way. The people who are trying to be objective don't have any ulterior motives 00:50:59.480 --> 00:51:05.240 and that means they don't have a source of funding. 00:51:05.240 --> 00:51:10.700 Like there are minority views in science about issues like this and my understanding is they 00:51:10.700 --> 00:51:18.720 just can't get published. 00:51:18.720 --> 00:51:24.680 Have you looked at some of the controversies in other fields of science such as Halton 00:51:24.680 --> 00:51:29.320 Arp and his quasar astronomy? 00:51:29.320 --> 00:51:31.320 No. 00:51:31.320 --> 00:51:43.660 He was successful in his career as long as he published his pictures in his atlas of 00:51:43.660 --> 00:51:52.540 odd galaxies, as long as he just said, "Here's odd stuff I've been finding." But when he 00:51:52.540 --> 00:52:02.500 pointed out some very orderly things that related the red shift of quasars to the red 00:52:02.500 --> 00:52:09.940 shift of galaxies that they were clearly part of, they said, "You can't use our telescopes 00:52:09.940 --> 00:52:18.580 anymore." Even though he was funded by taxpayers' money, they wouldn't let him use the public 00:52:18.580 --> 00:52:19.580 telescopes. 00:52:19.580 --> 00:52:24.380 I guess what I've become aware of during the show is that there are scientific dynasties 00:52:24.380 --> 00:52:30.980 just like there are dynasties in other fields in commerce and people get to the top of their 00:52:30.980 --> 00:52:38.400 career and obviously I think it's just human nature. They feel like their own reputation 00:52:38.400 --> 00:52:46.420 and status is on the line if their theory ends up being proven not to be true. 00:52:46.420 --> 00:52:56.620 Yeah, there's a little, maybe a one or two minute video, a bit of Halton Arp talking 00:52:56.620 --> 00:53:05.740 about his experiences and actually quotes some of the things that happened to him on 00:53:05.740 --> 00:53:14.460 his way out of the profession, very ridiculous things that the top people in the field said 00:53:14.460 --> 00:53:15.460 and did. 00:53:15.460 --> 00:53:21.580 This sounds like it would be ripe for the Science Channel to do a documentary on some 00:53:21.580 --> 00:53:26.860 of these contradictive things. But thank you very much. I'm going to hang up and listen 00:53:26.860 --> 00:53:27.860 to you guys on the air. 00:53:27.860 --> 00:53:30.860 Okay, thanks for calling, Raj. 00:53:30.860 --> 00:53:36.700 And I'm contemplating having dinner and then going to the bathroom after that. 00:53:36.700 --> 00:53:37.700 Thank you for telling us. 00:53:37.700 --> 00:53:38.700 Good night. 00:53:38.700 --> 00:53:39.700 Good night, Raj. 00:53:39.700 --> 00:53:53.860 All right, the phone line is open 802-526-2326, 802-526-2326, or if you have Skype on your 00:53:53.860 --> 00:53:58.780 computer you can Skype John Barkhausen, all one word. 00:53:58.780 --> 00:54:07.940 Have you ever seen the article, Ray, called, I think it's called Against the Tide and it's 00:54:07.940 --> 00:54:12.460 about minority views in science and the experience of several scientists. 00:54:12.460 --> 00:54:17.340 We have another caller coming in. I'm going to take that. 00:54:17.340 --> 00:54:20.820 All right, you're on the air. 00:54:20.820 --> 00:54:29.700 Hi, this is Justin. I was wondering if Ray could elaborate on any misconceptions you 00:54:29.700 --> 00:54:33.380 thought science might have in its view of the immune system. 00:54:33.380 --> 00:54:38.580 All right, thanks, Justin. Let me just say before you start, Ray, good night. I just 00:54:38.580 --> 00:54:43.780 got to say this is WMRWLP Warren. Okay, sorry. 00:54:43.780 --> 00:54:45.340 That was about the immune system? 00:54:45.340 --> 00:54:48.380 Yeah, any, Justin, you still there? 00:54:48.380 --> 00:54:50.060 Yes, I'm here. 00:54:50.060 --> 00:54:51.060 Can you repeat that again? 00:54:51.060 --> 00:55:00.100 Any misunderstandings you think science might have in the way it views the functions or 00:55:00.100 --> 00:55:02.660 the interactions of the immune system? 00:55:02.660 --> 00:55:13.820 Yeah, I think the best answer to that is to look at the articles by Polly Matzinger and 00:55:13.820 --> 00:55:27.940 Jamie Cunliffe, or Cunliffe, C-U-N-L-I-F-F-E, and Polly Matzinger. They, I think, are inspired 00:55:27.940 --> 00:55:44.220 by the thinking of Ilya Metchnikoff, who was contemporary with Ehrlich, the magic bullet 00:55:44.220 --> 00:55:54.140 drug person. The German view of the immune system is the one that was profitable to the 00:55:54.140 --> 00:56:02.420 chemical drug industry, looking for a magic bullet that would kill each kind of germ, 00:56:02.420 --> 00:56:10.060 and then by extension, applying it to the cancer, looking for chemicals that would kill 00:56:10.060 --> 00:56:20.300 cancer cells and not human non-cancer cells. But Metchnikoff took a totally different approach 00:56:20.300 --> 00:56:32.980 to the immune system, the developmental, nutritional, morphogenic approach, and that didn't find 00:56:32.980 --> 00:56:42.900 any commercial sponsors, and it was the French-Russian orientation that actually was the biological 00:56:42.900 --> 00:56:55.420 orientation rather than the industrial. And so the place where his ideas are well summed 00:56:55.420 --> 00:57:00.940 up, the alternative idea of the immune system, it is in the United States.