WEBVTT

00:00:01.000 --> 00:00:08.320
 Alright, we should be on the air with Dr. Raymond Peat. This is Politics and Science. I am the host, John Barkhausen, and

00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:11.560
 today we're going to be talking about

00:00:11.560 --> 00:00:18.600
 human health and the physiological implications of some of the chemical processes that happen in the body,

00:00:18.600 --> 00:00:22.520
 namely

00:00:22.520 --> 00:00:26.120
 reduction and oxidation and some of the other factors.

00:00:27.180 --> 00:00:31.560
 My guest today is Dr. Raymond Peat. He has a PhD in biology and

00:00:31.560 --> 00:00:36.000
 speciality in physiology, and Ray, do you want to add anything to that?

00:00:36.000 --> 00:00:39.520
 Yeah, when I was studying

00:00:39.520 --> 00:00:43.880
 for my degree at University of Oregon, I

00:00:43.880 --> 00:00:51.040
 got interested in oxidative processes as they relate to aging and

00:00:51.040 --> 00:00:55.080
 I've

00:00:55.080 --> 00:00:57.080
 been thinking about

00:00:57.260 --> 00:01:00.480
 what oxidation means and all the ramifications

00:01:00.480 --> 00:01:03.300
 for 40 or 50 years and

00:01:03.300 --> 00:01:06.340
 still

00:01:06.340 --> 00:01:08.540
 curious how it really works.

00:01:08.540 --> 00:01:11.860
 I see, so it's an ongoing

00:01:11.860 --> 00:01:13.980
 scientific

00:01:13.980 --> 00:01:15.980
 endeavor, I suppose, understanding it.

00:01:15.980 --> 00:01:21.220
 Yeah, the idea of electrons moving around in matter,

00:01:21.220 --> 00:01:24.860
 that's one of my longest-standing

00:01:25.980 --> 00:01:30.340
 interests. I think it started when I was a little kid probably, but

00:01:30.340 --> 00:01:33.100
 I'm still not satisfied that

00:01:33.100 --> 00:01:40.460
 anyone knows what an electron is or how it works, but without knowing that you really don't understand

00:01:40.460 --> 00:01:43.860
 what's going on in oxidation, reduction, pH,

00:01:43.860 --> 00:01:50.100
 free radicals, and so on. Yeah, maybe you could give us a little sense of the history of

00:01:50.100 --> 00:01:52.860
 people trying to understand

00:01:53.820 --> 00:01:56.540
 chemistry. How did it all start, do you think?

00:01:56.540 --> 00:02:00.740
 Well,

00:02:00.740 --> 00:02:09.060
 the famous first demonstration that life processes are

00:02:09.060 --> 00:02:16.020
 material chemistry was when a guy synthesized urea and

00:02:16.020 --> 00:02:19.500
 people had believed that that was

00:02:20.340 --> 00:02:27.540
 maybe done by something special in the life process that couldn't be imitated in the real

00:02:27.540 --> 00:02:30.500
 inert world, but

00:02:30.500 --> 00:02:33.060
 just heating

00:02:33.060 --> 00:02:35.260
 things up on the end and

00:02:35.260 --> 00:02:39.860
 carbon dioxide, I don't remember the exact chemicals, but

00:02:39.860 --> 00:02:42.660
 it was demonstrated that you can make

00:02:42.660 --> 00:02:45.500
 urea

00:02:45.500 --> 00:02:47.500
 simply mechanically.

00:02:48.420 --> 00:02:50.540
 So people started thinking about

00:02:50.540 --> 00:02:58.100
 the chemical processes that make up life and

00:02:58.100 --> 00:03:00.980
 gradually getting away from the idea that

00:03:00.980 --> 00:03:09.940
 there is something unique about the life process that is distinct from chemistry.

00:03:09.940 --> 00:03:17.340
 I was just reading about, that was a Swedish person, is that correct, who figured out urea?

00:03:18.180 --> 00:03:23.860
 Yeah, and that was I think around the Revolutionary War in 1760-something,

00:03:23.860 --> 00:03:27.860
 but people must have experimented with

00:03:27.860 --> 00:03:32.260
 bodily fluids before then. Was there much research

00:03:32.260 --> 00:03:35.060
 done?

00:03:35.060 --> 00:03:38.500
 Yeah, in the 18th century people were really

00:03:38.500 --> 00:03:41.540
 figuring out a lot about how

00:03:41.540 --> 00:03:43.700
 organisms work,

00:03:43.700 --> 00:03:45.980
 but the

00:03:46.980 --> 00:03:48.980
 official science,

00:03:48.980 --> 00:03:52.660
 stuff that got published and approved of by the government,

00:03:52.660 --> 00:03:55.660
 that was a very slow

00:03:55.660 --> 00:03:59.340
 process that was

00:03:59.340 --> 00:04:05.140
 usually a hundred years behind the people on the ground who were really thinking about how things work.

00:04:05.140 --> 00:04:11.740
 I mean science for a large part, this is my understanding, was actually a private affair

00:04:12.380 --> 00:04:17.100
 done by usually wealthy people sometimes, or not always I suppose, but...

00:04:17.100 --> 00:04:19.660
 Yeah, rich

00:04:19.660 --> 00:04:22.380
 cranks.

00:04:22.380 --> 00:04:26.540
 So they often put their particular

00:04:26.540 --> 00:04:29.620
 philosophical or religious

00:04:29.620 --> 00:04:31.500
 bent

00:04:31.500 --> 00:04:33.980
 into the physical ideas and

00:04:33.980 --> 00:04:38.860
 it was because of that personal quality

00:04:38.860 --> 00:04:41.060
 science

00:04:41.060 --> 00:04:43.060
 was really

00:04:43.060 --> 00:04:48.260
 more literary and interesting and artistic

00:04:48.260 --> 00:04:52.020
 before the universities took it over and

00:04:52.020 --> 00:04:57.340
 gradually in physics, I guess the universities

00:04:57.340 --> 00:04:59.860
 took

00:04:59.860 --> 00:05:04.340
 control of it away from the cranks and rich guys

00:05:04.340 --> 00:05:07.020
 in the mid-19th century.

00:05:08.060 --> 00:05:12.540
 And that was the physics that Einstein, for example,

00:05:12.540 --> 00:05:15.940
 being

00:05:15.940 --> 00:05:17.420
 the

00:05:17.420 --> 00:05:18.620
 leading

00:05:18.620 --> 00:05:21.660
 academic physics was being done in Germany and

00:05:21.660 --> 00:05:24.540
 Einstein being Jewish

00:05:24.540 --> 00:05:27.220
 resented the

00:05:27.220 --> 00:05:30.500
 authoritarian dogma of the professors and

00:05:30.500 --> 00:05:33.300
 so he invented something that

00:05:33.300 --> 00:05:35.780
 outwitted

00:05:36.580 --> 00:05:38.580
 authoritarian physics establishment.

00:05:38.580 --> 00:05:40.700
 He sure did.

00:05:40.700 --> 00:05:42.700
 Boy, and

00:05:42.700 --> 00:05:46.300
 yeah, that sort of reminds me of what a general law of

00:05:46.300 --> 00:05:50.820
 institutionalization that I'm making up here on the spot, but it seems like it takes the

00:05:50.820 --> 00:05:55.660
 the interest out of most fields once it gets franchised like that.

00:05:55.660 --> 00:06:01.220
 I mean religion I think used to be more of a personal experience before the church took over and

00:06:01.220 --> 00:06:03.820
 it sounds like it's the same with science.

00:06:04.540 --> 00:06:07.860
 Yeah, and I think Einstein

00:06:07.860 --> 00:06:11.020
 himself succumbed somewhat to

00:06:11.020 --> 00:06:14.700
 authoritarian attitudes

00:06:14.700 --> 00:06:18.780
 in the case of saying what an electron is and

00:06:18.780 --> 00:06:22.060
 30 years later, I think he regretted

00:06:22.060 --> 00:06:24.740
 having

00:06:24.740 --> 00:06:28.340
 set things in motion in that particular direction when he

00:06:28.340 --> 00:06:31.860
 never accepted the

00:06:32.300 --> 00:06:37.820
 quantum mechanics view of reality as based on on randomness and

00:06:37.820 --> 00:06:41.740
 but he was

00:06:41.740 --> 00:06:47.740
 largely responsible for setting that in motion with his theory of the photoelectric effect

00:06:47.740 --> 00:06:51.140
 and the

00:06:51.140 --> 00:06:54.420
 idea of the electron as a discrete particle

00:06:54.420 --> 00:06:58.980
 interacting with a photon as a discrete particle

00:06:58.980 --> 00:07:01.020
 was

00:07:01.020 --> 00:07:04.340
 the key idea in that photoelectric effect

00:07:04.340 --> 00:07:09.180
 a photon of a given energy would

00:07:09.180 --> 00:07:12.060
 dislodge

00:07:12.060 --> 00:07:14.900
 an electron from the

00:07:14.900 --> 00:07:17.980
 solid state

00:07:17.980 --> 00:07:23.100
 giving it a certain voltage and so you can talk about the electron

00:07:23.100 --> 00:07:29.420
 energy or voltage of a given frequency of light and

00:07:30.580 --> 00:07:32.500
 that

00:07:32.500 --> 00:07:37.300
 particularized or atomized the idea of both light and electrons

00:07:37.300 --> 00:07:41.340
 and that's that's something that

00:07:41.340 --> 00:07:49.020
 Allowed theory to take over and cover up and

00:07:49.020 --> 00:07:52.380
 reject a lot of

00:07:52.380 --> 00:07:55.020
 empirical factual

00:07:55.020 --> 00:07:56.260
 observation

00:07:56.260 --> 00:07:58.300
 relating to light color

00:07:59.140 --> 00:08:02.340
 electrons molecules and so on and I think life

00:08:02.340 --> 00:08:04.100
 Wow

00:08:04.100 --> 00:08:10.380
 So that's interesting. Once you become an icon you have to be very careful what you say because people might take you seriously

00:08:10.380 --> 00:08:15.420
 Yeah, I don't know how conscious he was of that but

00:08:15.420 --> 00:08:18.660
 he was

00:08:18.660 --> 00:08:22.300
 Very persistent in

00:08:22.300 --> 00:08:24.460
 not

00:08:24.460 --> 00:08:30.380
 Fundamentally going along with with the drift of the quantum physics establishment

00:08:30.380 --> 00:08:35.660
 so so that that view of the electron and

00:08:35.660 --> 00:08:41.460
 Is atoms in general I imagine seeing the electron is an essential part of

00:08:41.460 --> 00:08:44.420
 atomic structure

00:08:44.420 --> 00:08:48.500
 How can you explain further how that actually set us on the wrong track?

00:08:48.500 --> 00:08:52.620
 Yeah

00:08:53.220 --> 00:08:59.100
 You know around the time of the First World War Michael Polanyi had demonstrated a

00:08:59.100 --> 00:09:02.460
 continuous potential

00:09:02.460 --> 00:09:11.260
 Description of how gases are bound or absorbed on the solid surfaces and

00:09:11.260 --> 00:09:17.900
 That that was a smooth sort of process a straight

00:09:20.220 --> 00:09:25.540
 Relationship between the pressure on the gas and the thickness of the absorbed layer and

00:09:25.540 --> 00:09:32.900
 When he went to Berlin to present his experimental work and theory

00:09:32.900 --> 00:09:36.020
 Einstein and others

00:09:36.020 --> 00:09:41.460
 that was already 10 years beyond the photoelectric theory and the

00:09:41.460 --> 00:09:44.300
 particularization of

00:09:44.300 --> 00:09:45.820
 light

00:09:45.820 --> 00:09:47.820
 electron

00:09:48.660 --> 00:09:50.660
 Energy or structure and

00:09:50.660 --> 00:09:53.460
 Einstein was one of the people that said

00:09:53.460 --> 00:09:55.580
 in

00:09:55.580 --> 00:09:58.900
 the advanced science world here in Germany

00:09:58.900 --> 00:10:02.780
 we know that that just isn't possible because

00:10:02.780 --> 00:10:07.980
 Matter is particular and you're just aren't going to get forces

00:10:07.980 --> 00:10:12.940
 Smoothly extending away from the surface

00:10:12.940 --> 00:10:15.980
 if the

00:10:15.980 --> 00:10:21.580
 Surface has an electrical property and the gas has an electrical property

00:10:21.580 --> 00:10:30.620
 the first layer of gas atoms hitting that surface is going to perfectly neutralize that so there's no

00:10:30.620 --> 00:10:33.220
 potential

00:10:33.220 --> 00:10:35.380
 extending through space but

00:10:35.380 --> 00:10:37.820
 Polanyi's results

00:10:37.820 --> 00:10:41.540
 Clearly showed that something like that was happening a continuously

00:10:41.540 --> 00:10:44.420
 thickening layer

00:10:45.020 --> 00:10:46.780
 and

00:10:46.780 --> 00:10:49.340
 So Polanyi was defeated

00:10:49.340 --> 00:10:51.700
 the

00:10:51.700 --> 00:10:53.700
 people like Irving Langmuir

00:10:53.700 --> 00:10:58.740
 15 years later got the Nobel Prize for

00:10:58.740 --> 00:11:01.420
 his idea that

00:11:01.420 --> 00:11:04.300
 gases can only condensed in a monolayer

00:11:04.300 --> 00:11:07.460
 And

00:11:07.460 --> 00:11:11.220
 Polanyi knew it was wrong, but he was a physics professor and

00:11:11.780 --> 00:11:14.660
 He had to teach the Langmuir

00:11:14.660 --> 00:11:16.980
 isotherm

00:11:16.980 --> 00:11:21.180
 but in his own experimental work Polanyi

00:11:21.180 --> 00:11:28.500
 Went along examining how molecules and crystals solid-state things

00:11:28.500 --> 00:11:31.580
 work and

00:11:31.580 --> 00:11:34.100
 in one

00:11:34.100 --> 00:11:38.180
 Area of research after another he kept seeing

00:11:39.580 --> 00:11:42.180
 Continuity things extending

00:11:42.180 --> 00:11:44.540
 for example

00:11:44.540 --> 00:11:49.180
 in the behavior of a crystal where previously he had shown that

00:11:49.180 --> 00:11:52.300
 gases on the surface of

00:11:52.300 --> 00:11:55.900
 activated charcoal for example for multi layers

00:11:55.900 --> 00:12:02.640
 Working with crystals. He found that the events on the surface of a crystal

00:12:02.640 --> 00:12:07.700
 Affected its elasticity and resistance all the way through

00:12:09.180 --> 00:12:10.860
 so

00:12:10.860 --> 00:12:12.700
 physically

00:12:12.700 --> 00:12:18.660
 The surface doesn't doesn't have the meaning that it seems to in geometry

00:12:18.660 --> 00:12:22.780
 And for example in

00:12:22.780 --> 00:12:28.340
 Working a crystal back and forth it gets weaker and weaker

00:12:28.340 --> 00:12:31.540
 as as it

00:12:31.540 --> 00:12:33.260
 accumulates

00:12:33.260 --> 00:12:36.220
 some kind of fatigue or memory and

00:12:38.740 --> 00:12:40.740
 J.C. Bose had

00:12:40.740 --> 00:12:43.180
 demonstrated that sort of thing and

00:12:43.180 --> 00:12:49.340
 found that the fatigue could be recovered from in a crystal, but

00:12:49.340 --> 00:12:52.500
 Polanyi was interested in the fact that

00:12:52.500 --> 00:12:55.420
 The

00:12:55.420 --> 00:12:56.900
 weakening

00:12:56.900 --> 00:12:58.900
 involves energy

00:12:58.900 --> 00:13:01.380
 flowing over long distances

00:13:01.380 --> 00:13:03.900
 creating

00:13:03.900 --> 00:13:05.900
 areas of

00:13:05.900 --> 00:13:07.940
 exaggerated weakness and

00:13:08.940 --> 00:13:12.700
 That was the same sort of effect that he saw

00:13:12.700 --> 00:13:17.260
 When the surface of a crystal was wet

00:13:17.260 --> 00:13:20.700
 the surface effect

00:13:20.700 --> 00:13:28.500
 Modified the resistance and elasticity properties of the depth of the crystal

00:13:28.500 --> 00:13:32.020
 So it was

00:13:32.700 --> 00:13:37.980
 Analogous probably to the the idea of conduction bands in which in metal

00:13:37.980 --> 00:13:41.740
 the electrons are delocalized and

00:13:41.740 --> 00:13:49.620
 The you can think of particulate electrons

00:13:49.620 --> 00:13:52.940
 acting this way, but

00:13:52.940 --> 00:13:56.140
 Polanyi's work suggested that maybe

00:13:56.140 --> 00:14:01.700
 That isn't the the only or necessary way to think of electrons

00:14:02.420 --> 00:14:03.940
 and

00:14:03.940 --> 00:14:05.420
 in

00:14:05.420 --> 00:14:07.420
 When I was in graduate school

00:14:07.420 --> 00:14:11.100
 1969 or 70 I was

00:14:11.100 --> 00:14:13.460
 reading

00:14:13.460 --> 00:14:16.020
 surface physics, especially

00:14:16.020 --> 00:14:20.700
 as a way to help understand oxidation

00:14:20.700 --> 00:14:25.740
 Biologically and in one of the physics journals

00:14:25.740 --> 00:14:30.260
 A man named Helmut Schwart

00:14:31.460 --> 00:14:35.140
 published a description of a funny experiment

00:14:35.140 --> 00:14:39.500
 In which laser light is shined

00:14:39.500 --> 00:14:42.620
 horizontally through a crystal

00:14:42.620 --> 00:14:45.180
 while a beam of electrons

00:14:45.180 --> 00:14:47.940
 goes through the other

00:14:47.940 --> 00:14:50.860
 dimension of the crystal through the thin

00:14:50.860 --> 00:14:54.500
 Layer

00:14:54.500 --> 00:14:59.380
 A layer about less than a micron half a micron or so thick

00:15:00.180 --> 00:15:02.180
 and the

00:15:02.180 --> 00:15:09.300
 Electrons passing through the crystal are deflected into a certain pattern

00:15:09.300 --> 00:15:15.940
 Either by the electronic property of the crystal atoms that they pass by

00:15:15.940 --> 00:15:18.940
 so you can see the

00:15:18.940 --> 00:15:24.500
 shape of the crystal reflected in the image of where the electrons hit but

00:15:24.500 --> 00:15:28.260
 Ordinarily that's done exposing

00:15:29.260 --> 00:15:31.700
 electrons passing through the crystal

00:15:31.700 --> 00:15:38.180
 Exposing a piece of photographic film to the electrons and getting a chemical

00:15:38.180 --> 00:15:43.060
 Change producing the image, but he found taking

00:15:43.060 --> 00:15:49.100
 Even a fluorescent screen away putting an aluminum oxide

00:15:49.100 --> 00:15:55.300
 Coated layer at the bottom that was very non reflective

00:15:56.900 --> 00:16:03.180
 He found that the electron spots were still there, but they had the blue tint

00:16:03.180 --> 00:16:08.140
 of the laser light going sideways through the crystal and

00:16:08.140 --> 00:16:11.700
 so the spots had to be

00:16:11.700 --> 00:16:14.740
 the supposedly discrete

00:16:14.740 --> 00:16:16.660
 particulate

00:16:16.660 --> 00:16:19.300
 electrons for them to be

00:16:19.300 --> 00:16:22.580
 deflected

00:16:22.580 --> 00:16:25.380
 To exactly the right spots

00:16:26.740 --> 00:16:28.740
 Which are used to

00:16:28.740 --> 00:16:31.380
 identify crystal structures and such

00:16:31.380 --> 00:16:38.100
 but at that spot there shouldn't have been any light, but it was

00:16:38.100 --> 00:16:41.300
 the color of the laser light

00:16:41.300 --> 00:16:48.740
 Modulating in fact the the beam of electrons and

00:16:48.740 --> 00:16:51.100
 that

00:16:51.100 --> 00:16:52.340
 when I

00:16:52.340 --> 00:16:59.020
 Tried to talk to physics professors about it. They simply said it can't happen you can't modulate

00:16:59.020 --> 00:17:00.980
 one electron

00:17:00.980 --> 00:17:05.180
 Mm-hmm, and when you say modulate you mean change color or actually yeah

00:17:05.180 --> 00:17:08.660
 Yeah, the color of an electron is supposed to be its relationship

00:17:08.660 --> 00:17:12.860
 to the atom and what it's doing is is

00:17:12.860 --> 00:17:16.100
 absorbing or

00:17:16.100 --> 00:17:18.300
 interacting with a particular

00:17:19.020 --> 00:17:22.060
 wavelength of the light so the atom is

00:17:22.060 --> 00:17:25.260
 subtracting or maybe

00:17:25.260 --> 00:17:27.940
 fluorescing a color, but it's always

00:17:27.940 --> 00:17:35.740
 Subtracting or adding something according to the way it is bound to the atom

00:17:35.740 --> 00:17:39.420
 So an electron flying through space

00:17:39.420 --> 00:17:43.900
 It just wasn't acceptable

00:17:43.900 --> 00:17:48.100
 They preferred to say that the person was simply

00:17:48.700 --> 00:17:50.700
 Hallucinating or something?

00:17:50.700 --> 00:17:53.820
 But it was it done at

00:17:53.820 --> 00:17:57.260
 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute and

00:17:57.260 --> 00:18:00.260
 They had the best equipment

00:18:00.260 --> 00:18:04.740
 of that sort in the world at the time Wow and

00:18:04.740 --> 00:18:08.540
 a lot of people immediately trying to

00:18:08.540 --> 00:18:11.220
 replicate it

00:18:11.220 --> 00:18:13.220
 Didn't have the same

00:18:13.220 --> 00:18:15.780
 degree of vacuum in their

00:18:16.420 --> 00:18:20.260
 Electron microscope or didn't have the same power of laser

00:18:20.260 --> 00:18:24.020
 Or or the same quality of crystal making and so on

00:18:24.020 --> 00:18:27.180
 great cleanliness and so on

00:18:27.180 --> 00:18:33.540
 Was part of the original experiment. So a lot of people assert like cold fusion

00:18:33.540 --> 00:18:36.060
 Mm-hmm

00:18:36.060 --> 00:18:41.260
 If it violates the theory and you don't have the same equipment exactly

00:18:41.260 --> 00:18:44.020
 It's very easy to

00:18:44.020 --> 00:18:45.940
 debunk

00:18:45.940 --> 00:18:53.860
 Something just by by doing a slightly different setup and getting different results. Yeah, that's right today's genius

00:18:53.860 --> 00:18:58.060
 Well, actually today's crackpot is possibly tomorrow's genius

00:18:58.060 --> 00:19:00.540
 in many cases

00:19:00.540 --> 00:19:02.180
 very recently

00:19:02.180 --> 00:19:04.220
 Helmut Schwarz who became

00:19:04.220 --> 00:19:07.020
 the head of Germany's

00:19:07.020 --> 00:19:09.820
 research granting

00:19:09.820 --> 00:19:11.140
 institution

00:19:11.140 --> 00:19:14.520
 the government's money dispenser for research

00:19:15.460 --> 00:19:17.460
 he said that

00:19:17.460 --> 00:19:21.180
 Outsiders are important everywhere. Not just in science

00:19:21.180 --> 00:19:26.000
 You don't get advanced unless you have people

00:19:26.000 --> 00:19:33.180
 Somewhat on the fringe. Yeah, if anybody wants to Google minority opinions in science

00:19:33.180 --> 00:19:35.620
 There's actually a huge amount of information out there

00:19:35.620 --> 00:19:39.900
 Scientists who have been sidelined for their

00:19:39.900 --> 00:19:44.620
 viable research but because it's bucking the current

00:19:45.620 --> 00:19:49.620
 Institutions or the money that's coming into those institutions. They're not getting any

00:19:49.620 --> 00:19:54.860
 Traction with any of their work and in fact a lot of the research is being taken away from them

00:19:54.860 --> 00:19:57.780
 research facilities, so

00:19:57.780 --> 00:20:00.380
 It's a it's a lot bigger

00:20:00.380 --> 00:20:05.100
 Faction of science than anybody hears about because of course they don't get any press either

00:20:05.100 --> 00:20:10.380
 And I've been noticing that

00:20:11.940 --> 00:20:13.940
 Institutions like the Wikipedia

00:20:13.940 --> 00:20:19.220
 Supposedly the Internet should be an opportunity to

00:20:19.220 --> 00:20:23.900
 Disseminate

00:20:23.900 --> 00:20:26.020
 Dissenting ideas, but

00:20:26.020 --> 00:20:27.980
 the

00:20:27.980 --> 00:20:29.780
 culture of

00:20:29.780 --> 00:20:32.920
 Authoritarian science is so strong that you see it

00:20:32.920 --> 00:20:37.460
 affecting the way Wikipedia works, it's sort of like a

00:20:37.460 --> 00:20:40.180
 sounding board for the

00:20:41.220 --> 00:20:43.220
 most authoritarian

00:20:43.220 --> 00:20:45.980
 Viewpoints in science

00:20:45.980 --> 00:20:52.460
 Yeah, and that makes sense because if you have the money of an institution behind you you have the money to pay a staff member

00:20:52.460 --> 00:20:55.440
 to keep updating Wikipedia and editing anybody's

00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:57.820
 other

00:20:57.820 --> 00:20:59.300
 input

00:20:59.300 --> 00:21:03.300
 So it's it's kind of like he who has the most resources wins

00:21:03.300 --> 00:21:09.860
 Yeah the argument so I was a little confused about the particulate

00:21:10.860 --> 00:21:17.300
 Electrons versus the is it a wave theory is the alternative or one of the alternatives to that?

00:21:17.300 --> 00:21:19.660
 What's wrong with the particles?

00:21:19.660 --> 00:21:22.220
 well you

00:21:22.220 --> 00:21:24.740
 Since you can't explain

00:21:24.740 --> 00:21:28.460
 Many events in terms of particles

00:21:28.460 --> 00:21:37.360
 It becomes a sort of mathematical magic to try to make up

00:21:38.620 --> 00:21:40.620
 theories to explain

00:21:40.620 --> 00:21:44.580
 results like Polanyi or Schwart's and

00:21:44.580 --> 00:21:49.500
 Albert Szent-Gyorgyi used

00:21:49.500 --> 00:21:52.700
 conventional

00:21:52.700 --> 00:21:57.020
 Quantum thinking about electrons and

00:21:57.020 --> 00:22:02.500
 went went a long way towards explaining as some of the

00:22:02.500 --> 00:22:06.700
 Biological phenomena that people hadn't been able to

00:22:07.860 --> 00:22:09.860
 even perceive

00:22:09.860 --> 00:22:17.140
 But that doesn't mean that that it necessarily validates the the particulate

00:22:17.140 --> 00:22:22.740
 Electron just because you you can explain some

00:22:22.740 --> 00:22:27.740
 important phenomena and so I think it should mean that

00:22:27.740 --> 00:22:31.620
 The whole idea of

00:22:31.620 --> 00:22:34.100
 What matter is how an electron?

00:22:34.100 --> 00:22:36.260
 works whether

00:22:36.620 --> 00:22:38.620
 It might be that

00:22:38.620 --> 00:22:40.740
 There is an electrical

00:22:40.740 --> 00:22:46.140
 Ether like material which breaks up in different ways

00:22:46.140 --> 00:22:49.560
 Into

00:22:49.560 --> 00:22:52.300
 Apparently discrete electrons, but

00:22:52.300 --> 00:23:00.580
 That rather than being an eternally discrete particle like a proton is supposed to be

00:23:00.580 --> 00:23:03.740
 The electron might be sort of an ad hoc

00:23:05.940 --> 00:23:07.700
 Interpretation

00:23:07.700 --> 00:23:09.700
 which the

00:23:09.700 --> 00:23:12.100
 wave interpretation

00:23:12.100 --> 00:23:14.820
 Is approaching that idea?

00:23:14.820 --> 00:23:17.220
 that the

00:23:17.220 --> 00:23:19.140
 and some of the

00:23:19.140 --> 00:23:21.020
 subatomic

00:23:21.020 --> 00:23:24.740
 Thinkers are saying that maybe this great variety of

00:23:24.740 --> 00:23:30.020
 Subatomic particles being seen with high energy research maybe

00:23:30.020 --> 00:23:32.780
 These are just sort of an ad hoc

00:23:32.780 --> 00:23:35.380
 response of

00:23:35.700 --> 00:23:37.700
 Matter to a particular

00:23:37.700 --> 00:23:41.820
 context or environment or or stimulation. Mm-hmm

00:23:41.820 --> 00:23:49.380
 So it might just be an aspect you're seeing depending on the the medium you're using to see it with. Yeah, exactly

00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:51.220
 see

00:23:51.220 --> 00:23:53.220
 and that would say that

00:23:53.220 --> 00:24:00.740
 In a different solar system or a different galaxy the atoms are not necessarily

00:24:00.740 --> 00:24:03.900
 Going to be the same

00:24:04.220 --> 00:24:05.700
 exact

00:24:05.700 --> 00:24:07.700
 have the same functionality and

00:24:07.700 --> 00:24:12.940
 That is an implication of Halton Arp's

00:24:12.940 --> 00:24:17.820
 Comments on his galaxy photographs

00:24:17.820 --> 00:24:23.380
 Okay, now that you brought that up you better explain what that means again

00:24:23.380 --> 00:24:28.100
 the he showed that

00:24:28.100 --> 00:24:32.340
 What appeared to be

00:24:33.820 --> 00:24:36.180
 Continuously connected

00:24:36.180 --> 00:24:40.100
 Groups of stars

00:24:40.100 --> 00:24:43.020
 One of the parts

00:24:43.020 --> 00:24:45.540
 Of what seems to be a continuous?

00:24:45.540 --> 00:24:49.580
 Stream of stars one of the parts will have

00:24:49.580 --> 00:24:55.880
 an extreme redshift difference from the other one meaning that they should be

00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:58.900
 very remote in space, but

00:24:58.900 --> 00:25:01.740
 his pictures show

00:25:01.980 --> 00:25:08.180
 Connections like one is being shot out of the other and he suggests that the one being shot out is

00:25:08.180 --> 00:25:11.580
 newly created and the new matter

00:25:11.580 --> 00:25:15.260
 Has a different way of vibrating

00:25:15.260 --> 00:25:19.660
 Which shows up as a redshift in other words?

00:25:19.660 --> 00:25:23.500
 The atoms are different when when they're fresh I

00:25:23.500 --> 00:25:28.980
 See and and you said I think last time or that another time we talked that a redshift

00:25:29.140 --> 00:25:32.380
 It means something's moving away from you is that in space?

00:25:32.380 --> 00:25:37.860
 I said that's the standard mechanical physics connection like the Doppler effect fun

00:25:37.860 --> 00:25:41.940
 Passes the frequency drops I

00:25:41.940 --> 00:25:45.780
 See so but you're saying it also could have other implications

00:25:45.780 --> 00:25:52.020
 Yeah, for example light passing close to a star

00:25:52.020 --> 00:25:56.060
 Has a frequency shift and

00:25:57.260 --> 00:25:59.260
 an Israeli

00:25:59.260 --> 00:26:05.140
 physicist astronomer named Dror Sadeh was working in the US and

00:26:05.140 --> 00:26:08.820
 He was

00:26:08.820 --> 00:26:14.940
 Studying at different times the light of of a star passing close to the Sun and

00:26:14.940 --> 00:26:18.060
 of a

00:26:18.060 --> 00:26:23.260
 Beeping quasar pulsar that sends out a certain frequency

00:26:24.500 --> 00:26:27.180
 passing close to the Sun and he

00:26:27.180 --> 00:26:30.220
 kept seeing what seemed to be a

00:26:30.220 --> 00:26:33.540
 time change or a frequency change

00:26:33.540 --> 00:26:38.220
 Depending on how close the beam came to the Sun and

00:26:38.220 --> 00:26:40.980
 he

00:26:40.980 --> 00:26:42.140
 got

00:26:42.140 --> 00:26:47.300
 an atomic clock at the US Bureau of Standards and

00:26:47.300 --> 00:26:51.420
 mounted another one on the track and

00:26:52.220 --> 00:26:56.500
 connected them by radio as so that they could be synchronized and

00:26:56.500 --> 00:27:04.140
 Then drove up the coast. I think he went up towards Maine and

00:27:04.140 --> 00:27:08.220
 Meanwhile recorded the

00:27:08.220 --> 00:27:15.060
 Relationship between these two clocks as he went and saw that

00:27:15.060 --> 00:27:18.180
 every morning at sunrise

00:27:19.540 --> 00:27:25.020
 Washington DC seemed to be redshifted away from his truck

00:27:25.020 --> 00:27:33.220
 And and his argument was that something about the

00:27:33.220 --> 00:27:39.460
 Field of the Sun coming on the scene was

00:27:39.460 --> 00:27:43.700
 Shifting the radio

00:27:43.700 --> 00:27:48.180
 Waves that were connecting the the two clocks

00:27:49.180 --> 00:27:53.500
 Otherwise, it would have looked like you had an expanding

00:27:53.500 --> 00:27:57.020
 universe to a ridiculous extent in which

00:27:57.020 --> 00:28:00.340
 Washington was moving

00:28:00.340 --> 00:28:03.340
 Million miles an hour away from Maine

00:28:03.340 --> 00:28:06.820
 Well, I think it may be

00:28:06.820 --> 00:28:10.020
 They seem remarkably out of touch

00:28:10.020 --> 00:28:12.580
 with

00:28:12.580 --> 00:28:14.580
 real life anyway

00:28:17.220 --> 00:28:19.300
 Well, that's fascinating right and

00:28:19.300 --> 00:28:25.580
 and so we're talking about the nature of the universe and ourselves and

00:28:25.580 --> 00:28:28.780
 particularly electrons I guess and electrical

00:28:28.780 --> 00:28:31.460
 feel so you're saying that the

00:28:31.460 --> 00:28:33.500
 that the

00:28:33.500 --> 00:28:35.500
 the Sun's

00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:42.580
 Electrical field when it or maybe it isn't even electrical but the wave from the Sun of radiation is

00:28:42.580 --> 00:28:44.900
 possibly

00:28:44.900 --> 00:28:46.900
 altering time slightly

00:28:47.900 --> 00:28:49.900
 He I

00:28:49.900 --> 00:28:52.740
 Think he was thinking in terms of

00:28:52.740 --> 00:29:01.300
 Gravitational field. Oh, but I don't know exactly what sunrise would mean. Okay

00:29:01.300 --> 00:29:08.820
 It's in terms of his thinking. How do you spell his name Ray so we could go look up on the internet?

00:29:08.820 --> 00:29:12.940
 What he's up to first name D. R. O. R. Okay

00:29:13.940 --> 00:29:20.420
 Sadeh S a d e h. Okay. Okay. He was killed in

00:29:20.420 --> 00:29:23.780
 radiation poisoning

00:29:23.780 --> 00:29:25.900
 in the

00:29:25.900 --> 00:29:28.660
 Non-atomic bomb laboratories in Israel. Oh

00:29:28.660 --> 00:29:35.620
 Right the non-atomic bomb laboratories making the bombs. They don't have yeah. Yeah

00:29:35.620 --> 00:29:38.900
 That's terrible

00:29:42.940 --> 00:29:44.700
 So

00:29:44.700 --> 00:29:47.060
 Obviously it makes a difference how you think about

00:29:47.060 --> 00:29:53.900
 electrons and if you're trying to figure out how these molecular processes are happening and

00:29:53.900 --> 00:29:56.500
 This show was going to be about physiology

00:29:56.500 --> 00:30:03.500
 But I guess it makes a real difference of what your general theory of atomic structure is

00:30:03.500 --> 00:30:06.460
 you know the

00:30:06.460 --> 00:30:08.820
 idea of

00:30:08.820 --> 00:30:11.540
 Particular nature of matter

00:30:12.700 --> 00:30:18.660
 Sort of spread or diffused into the thinking process so that

00:30:18.660 --> 00:30:21.220
 atoms

00:30:21.220 --> 00:30:23.220
 the same way Einstein

00:30:23.220 --> 00:30:25.260
 Couldn't tolerate

00:30:25.260 --> 00:30:27.860
 multi-layer adsorption in 1915

00:30:27.860 --> 00:30:33.300
 Biochemists can't tolerate long-range

00:30:33.300 --> 00:30:37.860
 processes in biochemistry and

00:30:37.860 --> 00:30:41.500
 One of the

00:30:42.460 --> 00:30:45.260
 Thing things in chemistry that resembled

00:30:45.260 --> 00:30:51.100
 What Polanyi was seeing in in crystals and his other?

00:30:51.100 --> 00:30:53.620
 experiments

00:30:53.620 --> 00:30:56.340
 the inductive effect is

00:30:56.340 --> 00:30:59.660
 at the basis of

00:30:59.660 --> 00:31:05.100
 Really fundamental biological thinking about

00:31:05.100 --> 00:31:09.660
 Coasservate for example

00:31:10.220 --> 00:31:12.220
 Bungenberg de Jong

00:31:12.220 --> 00:31:15.420
 founded a

00:31:15.420 --> 00:31:17.780
 line of thinking that

00:31:17.780 --> 00:31:21.660
 Eventually led to a Gilbert Ling's

00:31:21.660 --> 00:31:24.540
 way of seeing the

00:31:24.540 --> 00:31:28.940
 the cell as a special state of matter and

00:31:28.940 --> 00:31:32.620
 One of the

00:31:32.620 --> 00:31:36.540
 basic and simple chemical physical principles

00:31:38.180 --> 00:31:40.180
 Necessary to think this way is

00:31:40.180 --> 00:31:42.980
 called

00:31:42.980 --> 00:31:46.260
 electronic induction in the molecule and

00:31:46.260 --> 00:31:48.980
 when you have

00:31:48.980 --> 00:31:50.980
 atoms that are

00:31:50.980 --> 00:31:59.460
 Electron withdrawing or they have an affinity for electrons you put them in the molecule and

00:31:59.460 --> 00:32:02.900
 the

00:32:02.900 --> 00:32:07.420
 Charge or the intensity of the electrons effect

00:32:08.420 --> 00:32:12.420
 Shifts down the molecular chain towards that

00:32:12.420 --> 00:32:16.140
 electron withdrawing atom or group

00:32:16.140 --> 00:32:20.700
 So it's it's like a partial electron and

00:32:20.700 --> 00:32:29.460
 That that's an essential part now of organic chemistry that you have partial charges, but

00:32:29.460 --> 00:32:32.500
 when you

00:32:32.500 --> 00:32:35.900
 really take that seriously and see that

00:32:37.100 --> 00:32:39.100
 this effect

00:32:39.100 --> 00:32:43.580
 Exists everywhere in every molecule in the cell

00:32:43.580 --> 00:32:47.860
 it goes to another level which is

00:32:47.860 --> 00:32:51.060
 the

00:32:51.060 --> 00:32:54.300
 Coordinated or coherent

00:32:54.300 --> 00:32:57.580
 Effects of

00:32:57.580 --> 00:33:00.780
 The

00:33:00.780 --> 00:33:03.420
 Electron

00:33:03.420 --> 00:33:06.060
 Inducing

00:33:06.220 --> 00:33:08.460
 groups, so you you have a

00:33:08.460 --> 00:33:11.460
 collective kind of reaction

00:33:11.460 --> 00:33:18.700
 And in which you pass a threshold sort of the way liquid water passes to solid water

00:33:18.700 --> 00:33:21.980
 They can be at the same temperature, but

00:33:21.980 --> 00:33:27.660
 someone has to start the process and and then it can go like a

00:33:27.660 --> 00:33:30.860
 cascade all at once the

00:33:31.980 --> 00:33:35.740
 Atoms will fall into place. Hmm. You change the state so

00:33:35.740 --> 00:33:38.500
 You can have a solid

00:33:38.500 --> 00:33:40.420
 water

00:33:40.420 --> 00:33:47.420
 at somewhat above the melting temperature or liquid water well below the freezing temperature

00:33:47.420 --> 00:33:50.660
 if you don't have this

00:33:50.660 --> 00:33:53.380
 cooperativity of

00:33:53.380 --> 00:33:56.060
 molecules and atoms and

00:33:56.060 --> 00:33:59.300
 when you combine these added

00:34:00.300 --> 00:34:02.300
 these ideas of

00:34:02.300 --> 00:34:04.540
 cooperativity and

00:34:04.540 --> 00:34:06.900
 induction

00:34:06.900 --> 00:34:09.140
 You get

00:34:09.140 --> 00:34:13.780
 These group effects where you have a change of state in effect

00:34:13.780 --> 00:34:19.100
 Which will pass through the bulk of the material

00:34:19.100 --> 00:34:25.100
 So that you can start thinking about how it works with

00:34:26.860 --> 00:34:30.740
 Looking at the effects of pH on a protein

00:34:30.740 --> 00:34:34.020
 okay, but

00:34:34.020 --> 00:34:36.780
 That's the simplest

00:34:36.780 --> 00:34:39.660
 effect of the

00:34:39.660 --> 00:34:44.540
 pH although the same all the way through a solution and the protein

00:34:44.540 --> 00:34:47.820
 With its

00:34:47.820 --> 00:34:49.820
 various charged groups

00:34:49.820 --> 00:34:51.620
 responding to that pH

00:34:51.620 --> 00:34:53.700
 so that the internal fields

00:34:53.700 --> 00:34:55.860
 are

00:34:55.860 --> 00:35:01.220
 Intensified or decreased according to the pH so you can have a protein

00:35:01.220 --> 00:35:04.220
 expanding or collapsing according to the

00:35:04.220 --> 00:35:07.620
 pH of its surroundings, but

00:35:07.620 --> 00:35:11.180
 Then when you add

00:35:11.180 --> 00:35:16.700
 Other molecules binding or associating with that protein and

00:35:16.700 --> 00:35:22.700
 Those have electron withdrawing or donating properties

00:35:23.900 --> 00:35:28.420
 Then the way that protein responds to a certain pH is different. I

00:35:28.420 --> 00:35:31.460
 see and

00:35:31.460 --> 00:35:38.060
 These electron withdrawing molecules are in a sense a partial

00:35:38.060 --> 00:35:40.700
 oxidation

00:35:40.700 --> 00:35:44.340
 Oxidation being taking away of electrons. Mm-hmm

00:35:44.340 --> 00:35:49.020
 So the

00:35:49.020 --> 00:35:51.180
 degree of

00:35:51.180 --> 00:35:53.180
 oxidation in a molecule

00:35:53.540 --> 00:35:57.220
 defines how electron withdrawing it is and

00:35:57.220 --> 00:35:59.580
 the

00:35:59.580 --> 00:36:01.180
 totality of

00:36:01.180 --> 00:36:05.140
 molecules with that quality in the system such as a

00:36:05.140 --> 00:36:09.620
 protein or a group of proteins in the solvent

00:36:09.620 --> 00:36:12.620
 that will

00:36:12.620 --> 00:36:18.460
 affect the the global degree of oxidation of the system and

00:36:20.580 --> 00:36:24.700
 When it reaches a certain point instead of just one protein

00:36:24.700 --> 00:36:30.340
 Collapsing or expanding you get the same

00:36:30.340 --> 00:36:32.460
 freeze melt

00:36:32.460 --> 00:36:38.180
 Transition in which one protein triggers another one and so on. I see

00:36:38.180 --> 00:36:41.340
 So you get coherent cooperative

00:36:41.340 --> 00:36:44.620
 types of changes throughout the system

00:36:44.620 --> 00:36:49.820
 That that's where the

00:36:50.540 --> 00:36:56.620
 Tending to think discreetly has been so strongly affected by the

00:36:56.620 --> 00:36:59.740
 the

00:36:59.740 --> 00:37:04.860
 particulate electron particulate proton particulate photon

00:37:04.860 --> 00:37:07.340
 type of thinking

00:37:07.340 --> 00:37:09.340
 so that people don't like to

00:37:09.340 --> 00:37:12.140
 get involved in those

00:37:12.140 --> 00:37:14.820
 cooperative global effects I

00:37:14.820 --> 00:37:17.380
 see, so I

00:37:17.620 --> 00:37:24.700
 Don't know if I'm gonna probably got this confused, but it sounds like there's several things that affect how quickly a chemical change happens

00:37:24.700 --> 00:37:30.300
 In the body or elsewhere and that one of them is the environment. So the pH surrounding

00:37:30.300 --> 00:37:35.380
 The substance where the change might happen is key. And then the other

00:37:35.380 --> 00:37:37.500
 part is

00:37:37.500 --> 00:37:40.620
 The materials that are attached to that substance

00:37:40.620 --> 00:37:47.500
 so if you're telling protein and then the protein might have other molecules attached to it that actually enhance or

00:37:47.660 --> 00:37:49.660
 deter the change happening

00:37:49.660 --> 00:37:51.820
 yeah, and that's

00:37:51.820 --> 00:37:54.540
 one of the complexities of

00:37:54.540 --> 00:37:57.100
 the living stages that

00:37:57.100 --> 00:37:59.460
 It if you kill it

00:37:59.460 --> 00:38:01.820
 It doesn't work the same

00:38:01.820 --> 00:38:05.460
 So you have to think of it always in a certain environment

00:38:05.460 --> 00:38:08.620
 hmm

00:38:08.620 --> 00:38:15.860
 That you have to really think of it as a flow from from the environment

00:38:16.660 --> 00:38:18.460
 in and out

00:38:18.460 --> 00:38:22.260
 And the rate of flow and intensity of flow and so on

00:38:22.260 --> 00:38:31.700
 The the way people think about antioxidants even tends to

00:38:31.700 --> 00:38:39.180
 Turn into a static description rather than a flowing process

00:38:39.180 --> 00:38:42.620
 L is is always when it's alive

00:38:44.100 --> 00:38:50.020
 Maintaining a delicate balance between oxidation and and reduction and so

00:38:50.020 --> 00:38:57.420
 Antioxidants are a dynamic process in which they're also oxidants

00:38:57.420 --> 00:39:02.060
 if they're if you push towards a

00:39:02.060 --> 00:39:08.460
 Dominance of reduction then you kill the cell in in a different way

00:39:09.660 --> 00:39:17.460
 Ray can you back up a little bit and just explain the origin of the word oxidant and and and what it means?

00:39:17.460 --> 00:39:20.220
 um

00:39:20.220 --> 00:39:25.420
 In the 18th century when they were thinking of phlogiston

00:39:25.420 --> 00:39:30.180
 That you had to deflogisticate

00:39:30.180 --> 00:39:33.700
 Something what does that mean?

00:39:33.700 --> 00:39:36.540
 the it was

00:39:36.540 --> 00:39:39.300
 something that left

00:39:39.940 --> 00:39:41.460
 a

00:39:41.460 --> 00:39:43.460
 burning substance and

00:39:43.460 --> 00:39:46.700
 It meant the exhaustion

00:39:46.700 --> 00:39:49.420
 when when

00:39:49.420 --> 00:39:51.220
 phlogiston had

00:39:51.220 --> 00:39:55.940
 Filled up the space you couldn't burn anything more in it

00:39:55.940 --> 00:39:58.340
 and

00:39:58.340 --> 00:40:05.140
 It made it very hard to understand chemical reactions, but then Priestley and

00:40:05.140 --> 00:40:07.780
 I

00:40:07.780 --> 00:40:10.260
 Guess Lavoisier was another one

00:40:10.260 --> 00:40:14.340
 Two or three people around the same time were we're seeing

00:40:14.340 --> 00:40:18.620
 That there was something

00:40:18.620 --> 00:40:28.100
 Being consumed from the air in the process of burning rather than added to it and

00:40:28.100 --> 00:40:31.140
 the

00:40:31.140 --> 00:40:32.620
 when they

00:40:32.620 --> 00:40:38.980
 started studying what was being consumed in the air as they saw that it generally made an

00:40:38.980 --> 00:40:42.020
 acid form

00:40:42.020 --> 00:40:44.060
 and so the

00:40:44.060 --> 00:40:47.980
 I think was Priestley who named it the

00:40:47.980 --> 00:40:54.260
 the substance that makes burning possible in the air he called the

00:40:54.260 --> 00:40:57.660
 acid former or the oxygen

00:40:57.660 --> 00:41:01.620
 Oxygen

00:41:02.260 --> 00:41:04.460
 Root for acid or sour

00:41:04.460 --> 00:41:07.460
 mm-hmm

00:41:07.460 --> 00:41:15.700
 So so many acids were formed by oxygen that got its name as the source of acid

00:41:15.700 --> 00:41:18.700
 and

00:41:18.700 --> 00:41:26.420
 It isn't an absolute there are acids without oxygen and and that

00:41:26.420 --> 00:41:31.420
 leads into the the whole issue of pH but

00:41:32.420 --> 00:41:39.500
 Thinking of oxygen in relation to its ability to form acids

00:41:39.500 --> 00:41:48.180
 That's a very important to integrate with your thinking of what a cell is doing

00:41:48.180 --> 00:41:51.220
 and

00:41:51.220 --> 00:41:53.300
 People tend to have

00:41:53.300 --> 00:41:58.300
 Begun thinking of carbon dioxide is simply a waste product

00:41:59.100 --> 00:42:02.980
 but if you think of the electronic

00:42:02.980 --> 00:42:06.660
 Balance

00:42:06.660 --> 00:42:08.660
 between oxidation and reduction

00:42:08.660 --> 00:42:11.460
 holding the proteins and

00:42:11.460 --> 00:42:15.940
 other things of the cell in a certain very specific

00:42:15.940 --> 00:42:18.940
 state or confirmation

00:42:18.940 --> 00:42:23.780
 Changing the pH is

00:42:23.780 --> 00:42:26.820
 crucial and

00:42:26.820 --> 00:42:28.980
 this partial

00:42:28.980 --> 00:42:30.980
 oxidation that you get

00:42:30.980 --> 00:42:33.260
 at a lower pH

00:42:33.260 --> 00:42:35.620
 which

00:42:35.620 --> 00:42:39.500
 governs the arrangement of the protein and other substances

00:42:39.500 --> 00:42:42.300
 carbon dioxide

00:42:42.300 --> 00:42:44.300
 turns out to be a

00:42:44.300 --> 00:42:47.300
 universal

00:42:47.300 --> 00:42:52.740
 Balancing factor or a adjuster of the

00:42:52.740 --> 00:42:56.060
 acidic properties of the protein

00:42:56.860 --> 00:43:03.140
 So the the acid formed by oxygen in this case carbon dioxide

00:43:03.140 --> 00:43:12.740
 It's in itself it's an acid as defined by Gilbert Lewis

00:43:12.740 --> 00:43:17.140
 and it doesn't have the protons so you

00:43:17.140 --> 00:43:19.380
 you need

00:43:19.380 --> 00:43:22.620
 talk about the pH really because it's

00:43:23.220 --> 00:43:28.460
 It's a non protic acid just two oxygens in the carbon

00:43:28.460 --> 00:43:35.060
 but this arrangement an oxygen doubly bonded to a carbon

00:43:35.060 --> 00:43:39.700
 Creates that

00:43:39.700 --> 00:43:43.900
 electron withdrawing property the intrinsic partial

00:43:43.900 --> 00:43:51.100
 oxidizing property of that molecule which when it attaches to a protein it

00:43:51.900 --> 00:43:53.900
 increases the acidity of the protein

00:43:53.900 --> 00:44:01.380
 Making it slightly partially more oxidized more city and

00:44:01.380 --> 00:44:04.620
 that changes its affinity for

00:44:04.620 --> 00:44:10.180
 other things according to how negatively charged its groups are and

00:44:10.180 --> 00:44:14.580
 This this is

00:44:14.580 --> 00:44:17.180
 the kind of thinking that

00:44:17.180 --> 00:44:19.860
 up to the

00:44:19.980 --> 00:44:21.980
 the Gilbert Ling

00:44:21.980 --> 00:44:23.980
 orientation

00:44:23.980 --> 00:44:31.900
 Accounting for cells and their metabolism without the hypothetical membrane and its pumps

00:44:31.900 --> 00:44:34.860
 the

00:44:34.860 --> 00:44:36.860
 pH and the

00:44:36.860 --> 00:44:39.860
 acid property of the protein system

00:44:39.860 --> 00:44:42.180
 maintains by

00:44:42.180 --> 00:44:44.180
 the carbon dioxide produced by

00:44:44.180 --> 00:44:47.020
 oxidation

00:44:47.140 --> 00:44:50.220
 This is the central thing in

00:44:50.220 --> 00:44:55.900
 Explaining why cells can discriminate

00:44:55.900 --> 00:44:59.060
 between

00:44:59.060 --> 00:45:01.060
 sodium and potassium and

00:45:01.060 --> 00:45:06.380
 calcium and magnesium and all of the discriminations that cells make

00:45:06.380 --> 00:45:10.180
 You don't need a little magic pump

00:45:10.180 --> 00:45:13.020
 moving things in and out

00:45:13.020 --> 00:45:15.020
 that would

00:45:15.020 --> 00:45:17.180
 Consume more energy than the cell has

00:45:17.180 --> 00:45:21.060
 The energy of the cell is really being produced

00:45:21.060 --> 00:45:25.500
 To form

00:45:25.500 --> 00:45:33.420
 Carbon dioxide and the carbon dioxide is changing the and maintaining the properties

00:45:33.420 --> 00:45:37.060
 Preventing excess

00:45:37.060 --> 00:45:40.340
 Electron accumulation

00:45:40.340 --> 00:45:43.500
 And

00:45:44.020 --> 00:45:48.740
 It since it's a continuing streaming process you have

00:45:48.740 --> 00:45:53.540
 oxygen streaming in and carbon dioxide streaming out and

00:45:53.540 --> 00:45:56.660
 the carbon dioxide

00:45:56.660 --> 00:45:59.180
 Reacting as an acid with water

00:45:59.180 --> 00:46:06.420
 Shifts the the property of the the water atom

00:46:06.420 --> 00:46:12.420
 So the the water joins with the carbon dioxide forming carbonic acid

00:46:12.860 --> 00:46:14.860
 which ionizes

00:46:14.860 --> 00:46:20.380
 You now have a negative charge on the carbon dioxide

00:46:20.380 --> 00:46:24.420
 streaming out of the cell it takes

00:46:24.420 --> 00:46:28.460
 Positive charges out with it

00:46:28.460 --> 00:46:31.780
 otherwise the cell would

00:46:31.780 --> 00:46:36.300
 quickly become highly electrically charged so the

00:46:36.300 --> 00:46:40.420
 movement of oxygen in carbon dioxide out is

00:46:41.460 --> 00:46:43.460
 taking out

00:46:43.460 --> 00:46:46.460
 the sodium and calcium

00:46:46.460 --> 00:46:53.900
 As a streaming continuous maintenance process

00:46:53.900 --> 00:46:57.380
 Wow

00:46:57.380 --> 00:46:59.380
 so this is the

00:46:59.380 --> 00:47:04.780
 Most people have heard of the membrane theory of cells that they're basically bags

00:47:05.860 --> 00:47:13.860
 Holding this cytoplasm in and this is in case you didn't get this. This is an alternative theory that it's actually being regulated

00:47:13.860 --> 00:47:22.060
 By the products of the mitochondria is that right right so the mitochondria is producing the co2

00:47:22.060 --> 00:47:25.700
 When it makes the ATP

00:47:25.700 --> 00:47:32.780
 The energy we all use the ATP and so the co2 starts off as an electron acceptor, but then it becomes

00:47:32.780 --> 00:47:35.340
 negatively charged and

00:47:35.500 --> 00:47:37.500
 that bonds with the

00:47:37.500 --> 00:47:39.900
 positive

00:47:39.900 --> 00:47:42.060
 Metal ions the magnesium and calcium

00:47:42.060 --> 00:47:49.500
 Yeah, it doesn't necessarily bond with them, but in leaving they tend to get dragged out, too

00:47:49.500 --> 00:47:52.260
 I see and why is the co2 leaving?

00:47:52.260 --> 00:48:00.860
 Just because it's being constantly formed inside and it just diffuses out down the gradient

00:48:00.860 --> 00:48:03.300
 So that's like an osmotic pressure

00:48:03.900 --> 00:48:05.660
 um

00:48:05.660 --> 00:48:07.660
 No, yeah, well

00:48:07.660 --> 00:48:09.980
 But the diffusion pressure

00:48:09.980 --> 00:48:12.380
 It's it's going down the gradient

00:48:12.380 --> 00:48:15.260
 like if you

00:48:15.260 --> 00:48:17.420
 put alcohol

00:48:17.420 --> 00:48:19.860
 against water

00:48:19.860 --> 00:48:26.780
 Tend to mix the alcohol will move into the water and the water into the alcohol

00:48:26.780 --> 00:48:30.620
 Until they're more or less even and

00:48:31.620 --> 00:48:35.740
 When you have a high concentration of co2 in the cell

00:48:35.740 --> 00:48:39.020
 at a certain point it starts

00:48:39.020 --> 00:48:46.780
 Being more at ease outside of the cell I see so it's a diffusion process

00:48:46.780 --> 00:48:53.780
 yeah, and that accounts for taking it out into the extracellular space and the blood and

00:48:53.780 --> 00:48:56.820
 When it gets into the blood

00:48:56.820 --> 00:48:59.660
 it having

00:48:59.940 --> 00:49:01.940
 taken the

00:49:01.940 --> 00:49:06.820
 Sodium and some other things with it

00:49:06.820 --> 00:49:10.820
 It circulates to the lungs and

00:49:10.820 --> 00:49:13.900
 Changes

00:49:13.900 --> 00:49:16.620
 back to carbon dioxide, which is

00:49:16.620 --> 00:49:18.580
 again

00:49:18.580 --> 00:49:24.500
 Going down its gradient from a high concentration in your blood to a lower

00:49:24.900 --> 00:49:31.940
 Concentration in the fresh air you breathe so the the carbon dioxide is leaving the blood and it leaves behind

00:49:31.940 --> 00:49:34.060
 the

00:49:34.060 --> 00:49:36.700
 Molecules or ions that it took out of the cells

00:49:36.700 --> 00:49:39.980
 and so the

00:49:39.980 --> 00:49:47.460
 Absence of the acidic carbon dioxide in the blood leaves the blood now with a higher pH

00:49:47.460 --> 00:49:50.580
 because of the

00:49:50.580 --> 00:49:52.220
 movement of

00:49:52.220 --> 00:49:55.140
 Sodium and such out of the cell hmm

00:49:55.140 --> 00:49:58.580
 I see

00:49:58.580 --> 00:50:04.860
 So the normal situation is is for a healthy cell to be

00:50:04.860 --> 00:50:08.060
 just faintly under

00:50:08.060 --> 00:50:10.300
 neutrality

00:50:10.300 --> 00:50:11.940
 and

00:50:11.940 --> 00:50:13.940
 for the blood to be

00:50:13.940 --> 00:50:19.660
 definitely over neutrality and like inside the cell 6.9 pH and

00:50:19.660 --> 00:50:22.180
 in the blood

00:50:22.340 --> 00:50:24.340
 7.4 roughly

00:50:24.340 --> 00:50:26.580
 Okay

00:50:26.580 --> 00:50:33.380
 7.4 I see so that's a little bit higher than the cell is low. Yeah

00:50:33.380 --> 00:50:36.820
 Yeah, go on

00:50:36.820 --> 00:50:40.100
 The

00:50:40.100 --> 00:50:43.580
 Lot of people have

00:50:43.580 --> 00:50:48.620
 Seen a disease as caused by a

00:50:50.060 --> 00:50:52.620
 low pH or too much acidity and

00:50:52.620 --> 00:50:56.260
 In the case of stress and

00:50:56.260 --> 00:50:59.340
 Cancer a tumor will

00:50:59.340 --> 00:51:02.140
 become very acidic

00:51:02.140 --> 00:51:07.020
 so that traditional idea has as a basis that

00:51:07.020 --> 00:51:11.540
 An infection or a tumor

00:51:11.540 --> 00:51:14.300
 the inflammation

00:51:14.300 --> 00:51:18.460
 produces high concentration of lactic acid and

00:51:18.820 --> 00:51:21.300
 And a very low pH in that area

00:51:21.300 --> 00:51:24.260
 which does have

00:51:24.260 --> 00:51:30.260
 disruptive toxic effects on that area and so the body is

00:51:30.260 --> 00:51:34.220
 Able generally to correct that and

00:51:34.220 --> 00:51:41.140
 Reduce the inflammation and stop the production of lactic acid, but the

00:51:41.140 --> 00:51:46.980
 When lactic acid is formed it

00:51:48.220 --> 00:51:52.860
 If the conversion from pyruvic acid to lactic acid

00:51:52.860 --> 00:52:01.420
 Is drawing an extra proton out of the NADH

00:52:01.420 --> 00:52:08.140
 Catalyst that causes the conversion and

00:52:08.140 --> 00:52:16.780
 In taking away this extra proton as as it leaves it

00:52:17.780 --> 00:52:20.780
 In its formation it

00:52:20.780 --> 00:52:24.620
 Raises the pH inside the cell

00:52:24.620 --> 00:52:30.420
 so even though a tumor or an infection is

00:52:30.420 --> 00:52:34.260
 Locally you see

00:52:34.260 --> 00:52:37.220
 excess acid

00:52:37.220 --> 00:52:41.220
 Hydro lactic acid inside the cell that's doing that

00:52:41.980 --> 00:52:45.780
 It's the reverse process you get an increase in the pH

00:52:45.780 --> 00:52:48.420
 inside the cell and

00:52:48.420 --> 00:52:53.740
 So the cell which is stuck if it gets stuck in producing

00:52:53.740 --> 00:52:56.260
 Lactic acid because it can't produce

00:52:56.260 --> 00:53:03.100
 co2 and that means it also tends to get stuck at a higher pH and

00:53:03.100 --> 00:53:05.940
 this higher pH

00:53:05.940 --> 00:53:07.980
 Changes the whole system

00:53:07.980 --> 00:53:10.740
 And

00:53:10.740 --> 00:53:15.900
 That's that's where you tend to get a self replicating tumor

00:53:15.900 --> 00:53:23.260
 Because the normal acidic conditions maintained by the co2

00:53:23.260 --> 00:53:27.180
 Are lost I see

00:53:27.180 --> 00:53:30.620
 Okay, that's that's

00:53:30.620 --> 00:53:35.020
 Good to know and maybe you could explain for us. I don't think you have to go through the entire

00:53:35.020 --> 00:53:37.780
 Cycle, but you're talking about

00:53:38.260 --> 00:53:42.300
 Cellular respiration and I don't think people generally know that pyruvic

00:53:42.300 --> 00:53:46.580
 when you're talking about that you're talking about the products or the process of

00:53:46.580 --> 00:53:52.860
 Making the energy that we all use and could could you just give us a little cliff note version of that?

00:53:52.860 --> 00:53:55.820
 yeah, the

00:53:55.820 --> 00:54:00.120
 Looking at us in our environment. We're really sort of

00:54:00.120 --> 00:54:05.820
 sandwiched between the sugar energy we get from plants and

00:54:06.700 --> 00:54:14.340
 The carbon dioxide that we make as the final product of the energy from the sugar

00:54:14.340 --> 00:54:17.260
 and the

00:54:17.260 --> 00:54:21.980
 Series of

00:54:21.980 --> 00:54:25.180
 Changes in the sugar molecule

00:54:25.180 --> 00:54:28.540
 each

00:54:28.540 --> 00:54:31.860
 Oxidation of that molecule

00:54:32.780 --> 00:54:39.100
 Adds a little chemical energy to the cell that the cells can use to make proteins

00:54:39.100 --> 00:54:42.340
 As it degrades the sugar it builds up

00:54:42.340 --> 00:54:46.260
 amino acids and proteins and fats and

00:54:46.260 --> 00:54:51.220
 When you're unable to

00:54:51.220 --> 00:54:57.980
 Oxidize the sugar all the way down to carbon dioxide and

00:54:57.980 --> 00:55:01.220
 produce

00:55:01.660 --> 00:55:08.900
 Amylactic acids instead halfway you're losing the greatest part of the energy stored in the glucose molecule

00:55:08.900 --> 00:55:11.820
 and that lack of energy

00:55:11.820 --> 00:55:15.300
 Has its repercussions but

00:55:15.300 --> 00:55:18.140
 when there's really a

00:55:18.140 --> 00:55:22.460
 lack of oxygen to continue the

00:55:22.460 --> 00:55:26.160
 oxidation that NADH which

00:55:27.060 --> 00:55:30.740
 Allowed pyruvic acid to take this shortcut off

00:55:30.740 --> 00:55:34.180
 into the semi toxic lactic acid

00:55:34.180 --> 00:55:41.820
 That has to be renewed before you can even make another lactic acid

00:55:41.820 --> 00:55:44.580
 So without oxygen

00:55:44.580 --> 00:55:48.500
 You need some kind of oxidant

00:55:48.500 --> 00:55:51.180
 to even continue

00:55:51.180 --> 00:55:55.820
 producing that kind of low energy from sugar to

00:55:56.820 --> 00:56:00.620
 Pyruvic and lactic acid and to do that cells

00:56:00.620 --> 00:56:03.740
 can

00:56:03.740 --> 00:56:05.740
 produce fat

00:56:05.740 --> 00:56:11.980
 And get rid of their electrons by building them in the fat

00:56:11.980 --> 00:56:19.420
 So building fat in a way is an alternative very bad one to

00:56:19.420 --> 00:56:23.260
 Using up oxygen and making co2

00:56:24.900 --> 00:56:31.820
 So interestingly cancers which get stuck in the

00:56:31.820 --> 00:56:38.940
 Exclusive use of converting glucose or amino acids to

00:56:38.940 --> 00:56:45.660
 Lactic acid as their energy supply. They also get stuck making

00:56:45.660 --> 00:56:47.980
 fat

00:56:47.980 --> 00:56:50.500
 That becomes their oxygen in effect

00:56:52.940 --> 00:56:55.460
 And then when they

00:56:55.460 --> 00:56:59.260
 Still have mitochondrial function

00:56:59.260 --> 00:57:01.940
 the

00:57:01.940 --> 00:57:07.100
 cell burns fat as it's energy source

00:57:07.100 --> 00:57:10.460
 so it's a

00:57:10.460 --> 00:57:13.180
 Really a deranged and crazy

00:57:13.180 --> 00:57:15.860
 kind of metabolism to

00:57:15.860 --> 00:57:17.500
 produce

00:57:17.500 --> 00:57:20.100
 an irritant lactic acid

00:57:20.100 --> 00:57:22.580
 to

00:57:22.580 --> 00:57:27.860
 And to do that it has to make fat which is then used as fuel

00:57:27.860 --> 00:57:30.540
 with with its own

00:57:30.540 --> 00:57:34.740
 Consequences

00:57:34.740 --> 00:57:37.500
 And is that that's called

00:57:37.500 --> 00:57:39.980
 glycolysis

00:57:39.980 --> 00:57:44.860
 Yeah, it's aerobic glycolysis when you make lactic acid

00:57:44.860 --> 00:57:47.620
 in the presence of oxygen

00:57:47.620 --> 00:57:50.140
 and

00:57:50.140 --> 00:57:51.900
 ordinary

00:57:51.900 --> 00:57:53.380
 anaerobic

00:57:53.380 --> 00:57:55.540
 Glycolysis is what happens when you

00:57:55.540 --> 00:57:58.900
 Exercise too hard

00:57:58.900 --> 00:58:02.180
 You're you can build up lactic acid

00:58:02.180 --> 00:58:06.140
 In getting out of breath

00:58:06.140 --> 00:58:09.500
 The the blood lactate

00:58:09.500 --> 00:58:15.420
 increases if you exercise faster than your breathing and

00:58:16.060 --> 00:58:24.060
 That's normal. You can a little later consume and oxidize the lactic acid and that's okay

00:58:24.060 --> 00:58:27.300
 when when you

00:58:27.300 --> 00:58:33.420
 Start producing lactic acid even in the presence of oxygen as in the case of cancer

00:58:33.420 --> 00:58:36.060
 or

00:58:36.060 --> 00:58:42.060
 Extreme trauma or shock same thing happens something turns the the trigger

00:58:43.020 --> 00:58:47.660
 So that even though oxygen is is present in shock

00:58:47.660 --> 00:58:50.020
 you will

00:58:50.020 --> 00:58:53.660
 Waste waste your sugar and make lactic acid. I

00:58:53.660 --> 00:59:00.260
 See so oxygen is there and but it's not you're unable to use it

00:59:00.260 --> 00:59:04.580
 Yeah, and the nervous system is

00:59:04.580 --> 00:59:10.940
 In the case of shock at least the nervous system is involved in making that

00:59:11.660 --> 00:59:13.660
 aerobic glycolysis and

00:59:13.660 --> 00:59:18.260
 So there are quite a few people who have

00:59:18.260 --> 00:59:27.020
 Suggested that the nervous system is involved in in the cancer transition doing the same thing that shock and trauma

00:59:27.020 --> 00:59:29.860
 Can do acutely?

00:59:29.860 --> 00:59:31.460
 hmm

00:59:31.460 --> 00:59:37.660
 Wow, I have to take a short break here and say that you're listening to WM rw lp1 and

00:59:38.940 --> 00:59:45.100
 We're streaming live at WM rw.org or 95 1 FM and you're listening to politics and science

00:59:45.100 --> 00:59:47.780
 I'm John Barkas and the host and my guest today is

00:59:47.780 --> 00:59:54.500
 Dr. Raymond Peat. He said has a PhD in biology and a speciality in physiology and

00:59:54.500 --> 00:59:57.340
 we're talking around the subject of

00:59:57.340 --> 01:00:05.780
 Oxidation and health and what role oxidation plays in maintaining that health

01:00:06.780 --> 01:00:08.780
 There's

01:00:08.780 --> 01:00:12.140
 More I want to ask you about the

01:00:12.140 --> 01:00:16.300
 The not being able to

01:00:16.300 --> 01:00:20.460
 use the oxygen that's present and

01:00:20.460 --> 01:00:26.460
 Anaerobic it's anaerobic glycolysis, even though there's oxygen there

01:00:26.460 --> 01:00:30.300
 And how aerobic oh

01:00:30.300 --> 01:00:34.980
 and then it's called aerobic like hell is this I see and I

01:00:35.620 --> 01:00:40.460
 How does the mitochondria make do with burning a fat? How is that even possible?

01:00:40.460 --> 01:00:43.500
 um

01:00:43.500 --> 01:00:45.020
 it's

01:00:45.020 --> 01:00:47.940
 And what what are the problems with that? Oh

01:00:47.940 --> 01:00:58.340
 It produces less carbon dioxide for example, I think that's the main problem

01:00:58.340 --> 01:01:03.140
 The

01:01:04.780 --> 01:01:06.780
 If you develop

01:01:06.780 --> 01:01:08.940
 fat stores you get

01:01:08.940 --> 01:01:16.140
 particles of fat accumulating in the cytoplasm and maybe in the nucleus that

01:01:16.140 --> 01:01:25.180
 Probably have a disruptive effect when you're heavily shifted over to a fat economy

01:01:25.180 --> 01:01:29.620
 I see if the

01:01:29.620 --> 01:01:33.600
 The tumor makes saturated fat

01:01:34.460 --> 01:01:35.620
 as

01:01:35.620 --> 01:01:36.820
 its

01:01:36.820 --> 01:01:39.060
 first product in in converting

01:01:39.060 --> 01:01:41.980
 sugar to saturated fat

01:01:41.980 --> 01:01:45.220
 But

01:01:45.220 --> 01:01:47.220
 when it's shifting

01:01:47.220 --> 01:01:53.060
 in in the presence of stress when it shifts to burning fat

01:01:53.060 --> 01:01:57.860
 Usually that will go through your fat stores

01:01:59.500 --> 01:02:03.060
 Burning up your your subcutaneous fat

01:02:03.060 --> 01:02:09.860
 quickly, so when the person is very sick with cancer, for example, they get a

01:02:09.860 --> 01:02:13.020
 gaunt initiated look as as their

01:02:13.020 --> 01:02:18.980
 Superficial fat stores are are used up and at the same time

01:02:18.980 --> 01:02:25.620
 They convert amino acids to energy

01:02:26.860 --> 01:02:29.100
 Converting some of it to sugar and some to fat

01:02:29.100 --> 01:02:35.220
 So it starts a wasting process but our stores

01:02:35.220 --> 01:02:43.740
 the older person gets generally the higher the amount of polyunsaturated fat in their stores and

01:02:43.740 --> 01:02:50.420
 When you're oxidizing polyunsaturated fats that produces more

01:02:50.420 --> 01:02:53.980
 oxidative damage to the mitochondria

01:02:56.620 --> 01:02:58.620
 So it tends to

01:02:58.620 --> 01:03:04.860
 lower the oxidative a part of metabolism and and slow things down in general I

01:03:04.860 --> 01:03:09.860
 See and then people end up feeling a lot less energy levels

01:03:09.860 --> 01:03:14.380
 Generally get run down

01:03:14.380 --> 01:03:16.860
 Yeah

01:03:16.860 --> 01:03:18.780
 that happens

01:03:18.780 --> 01:03:21.660
 in midlife to lots of people that

01:03:22.220 --> 01:03:27.660
 It resembles the cancer metabolism, but it just shows up as fatigue

01:03:27.660 --> 01:03:31.820
 low energy use in general

01:03:31.820 --> 01:03:35.220
 some people or where

01:03:35.220 --> 01:03:41.980
 Textbooks used to say that you would always lose weight if you ate less than 1700 calories per day

01:03:41.980 --> 01:03:49.620
 Lots of people can maintain their weight on 700 calories a day

01:03:50.620 --> 01:03:52.620
 And

01:03:52.620 --> 01:03:58.420
 That requires turning off of the thyroid function to a great extent and

01:03:58.420 --> 01:04:02.540
 So you're

01:04:02.540 --> 01:04:06.780
 Being wasteful even though you're not using

01:04:06.780 --> 01:04:10.500
 Very much energy at all what you are using

01:04:10.500 --> 01:04:14.220
 Tends to be poorly used and destructive

01:04:14.220 --> 01:04:17.380
 so you tend to

01:04:18.020 --> 01:04:20.020
 reduce your

01:04:20.020 --> 01:04:22.620
 Connective tissue and muscle and and

01:04:22.620 --> 01:04:25.780
 digestive system and so on

01:04:25.780 --> 01:04:27.660
 rather than

01:04:27.660 --> 01:04:31.180
 Just living on on what you're eating or stored fat

01:04:31.180 --> 01:04:35.580
 Well, so basically basically you're hibernating

01:04:35.580 --> 01:04:39.100
 You got fuzzy I couldn't tell

01:04:39.100 --> 01:04:45.100
 It's very girdly, okay

01:04:45.100 --> 01:04:50.140
 I'm gonna call you back. You back. We'll resume resume. Okay. Okay. Okay. Bye

01:04:50.140 --> 01:04:54.420
 Hello you're on the air, can you hear me?

01:04:54.420 --> 01:04:57.580
 Yeah, you're still a little still gargling

01:04:57.580 --> 01:05:03.900
 Not as bad as it was. Okay, we're you're coming through fine. So if you if you can

01:05:03.900 --> 01:05:07.480
 Put up with it. We can we're good to go. Okay

01:05:11.620 --> 01:05:17.660
 So our fats always the part of the process of respiration oxidizing fats or is that only when you're ill

01:05:17.660 --> 01:05:23.780
 Yeah, it's only under stress generally and

01:05:23.780 --> 01:05:28.500
 Starvation. Mm-hmm or or diabetes or

01:05:28.500 --> 01:05:30.660
 or a

01:05:30.660 --> 01:05:34.780
 High high level of stress. I see a lot of people are on those

01:05:34.780 --> 01:05:36.820
 ketosis

01:05:36.820 --> 01:05:38.820
 diets where they don't eat any

01:05:38.820 --> 01:05:40.860
 carbohydrates and

01:05:40.860 --> 01:05:42.860
 Does that cause you to burn fats?

01:05:42.860 --> 01:05:46.380
 And protein and protein, right?

01:05:46.380 --> 01:05:53.820
 Yeah, your brain and some other tissues the intestine and red blood cells and

01:05:53.820 --> 01:05:56.860
 various

01:05:56.860 --> 01:05:58.060
 little

01:05:58.060 --> 01:06:02.300
 little areas, but especially the brain and have an absolute

01:06:02.300 --> 01:06:06.380
 requirement for some sugar some glucose and

01:06:07.540 --> 01:06:09.740
 They all get it by breaking down

01:06:09.740 --> 01:06:15.420
 Amino acids and they get that from eating your tissues if you aren't

01:06:15.420 --> 01:06:18.260
 eating

01:06:18.260 --> 01:06:19.620
 enough

01:06:19.620 --> 01:06:22.300
 amino acids, but if you

01:06:22.300 --> 01:06:26.060
 are eating amino acids as your

01:06:26.060 --> 01:06:31.380
 Energy source fats and amino acids

01:06:31.380 --> 01:06:34.700
 you

01:06:34.700 --> 01:06:37.660
 Turn on the machinery for turning

01:06:37.660 --> 01:06:42.580
 Amino acids into glucose and fat and

01:06:42.580 --> 01:06:45.700
 running that

01:06:45.700 --> 01:06:51.380
 machinery involves turning on stress hormones a whole range of

01:06:51.380 --> 01:06:53.980
 hormones adjust to it and

01:06:53.980 --> 01:06:56.100
 I

01:06:56.100 --> 01:06:59.460
 Think those have chronic harmful effects. I

01:07:01.100 --> 01:07:04.900
 See so I know when people do it they're usually in a very controlled

01:07:04.900 --> 01:07:13.340
 Setting they go in for regular checkups and I think that I don't actually know but I think they take blood and urine samples and

01:07:13.340 --> 01:07:17.300
 You know, they're trying to make sure you're not actually endangering yourself

01:07:17.300 --> 01:07:23.420
 Most of the proteins that are are being eaten under those systems

01:07:23.420 --> 01:07:27.100
 most of them are too high in phosphate and

01:07:29.180 --> 01:07:31.780
 Usually too high in in this ionine

01:07:31.780 --> 01:07:34.860
 cysteine and tryptophan and

01:07:34.860 --> 01:07:40.420
 cysteine is an excited toxic amino acid and

01:07:40.420 --> 01:07:43.780
 Methionine

01:07:43.780 --> 01:07:49.820
 is involved in in stress and aging when in proportion to its excess so that

01:07:49.820 --> 01:07:55.140
 one of the most effective life extending

01:07:55.900 --> 01:08:01.660
 Diets is simply to reduce the amount of methionine in the diet drastically

01:08:01.660 --> 01:08:07.900
 So the sulfur amino acids and tryptophan are

01:08:07.900 --> 01:08:11.260
 stress and aging promoters

01:08:11.260 --> 01:08:15.660
 Especially excited toxic damage to the nerves

01:08:15.660 --> 01:08:18.980
 And

01:08:18.980 --> 01:08:23.540
 And the high phosphate for most of the popular proteins

01:08:25.100 --> 01:08:27.100
 The high phosphate is

01:08:27.100 --> 01:08:29.940
 has a lot of

01:08:29.940 --> 01:08:32.100
 excitatory harmful effects

01:08:32.100 --> 01:08:34.580
 the

01:08:34.580 --> 01:08:35.980
 cloth

01:08:35.980 --> 01:08:41.260
 Oh gene and protein that is deficient in

01:08:41.260 --> 01:08:47.420
 Animals that have a very quick aging process

01:08:47.420 --> 01:08:50.620
 that's

01:08:50.620 --> 01:08:53.380
 Largely a phosphate handling

01:08:54.300 --> 01:08:56.300
 protein and

01:08:56.300 --> 01:09:00.860
 The rapid aging produced by lacking that protein and gene

01:09:00.860 --> 01:09:04.140
 is

01:09:04.140 --> 01:09:06.980
 involves accumulating excess phosphate

01:09:06.980 --> 01:09:12.100
 And that in phosphate you get from eating meat primarily or

01:09:12.100 --> 01:09:15.060
 meat is

01:09:15.060 --> 01:09:18.500
 one of the highest ratios of phosphate to

01:09:18.500 --> 01:09:21.100
 the other minerals

01:09:21.100 --> 01:09:24.700
 But several of the very high quality proteins

01:09:24.700 --> 01:09:30.620
 Even mushrooms have a pretty high ratio of phosphate to calcium

01:09:30.620 --> 01:09:33.180
 milk is

01:09:33.180 --> 01:09:38.540
 Milk and cheese are about half and half which is probably safe, but

01:09:38.540 --> 01:09:41.260
 fruits and leaves

01:09:41.260 --> 01:09:49.460
 leafy green vegetables have a very safe low very low phosphate content relative to

01:09:50.100 --> 01:09:56.380
 Calcium and magnesium and potassium. I see so fruits and vegetables are

01:09:56.380 --> 01:10:01.820
 The best but you're not getting much protein in that case so

01:10:01.820 --> 01:10:05.180
 You need some milk and cheese, too

01:10:05.180 --> 01:10:11.300
 Yeah, and probably a fairly low protein diet is

01:10:11.300 --> 01:10:18.780
 Very good for the health but in the sense of living a long time but

01:10:19.780 --> 01:10:21.780
 For

01:10:21.780 --> 01:10:23.620
 Maintaining

01:10:23.620 --> 01:10:25.540
 tissue renewal

01:10:25.540 --> 01:10:29.180
 You can't go below a certain amount of tryptophan

01:10:29.180 --> 01:10:31.700
 cysteine and thiamine those are

01:10:31.700 --> 01:10:34.020
 rapid turnover

01:10:34.020 --> 01:10:36.020
 proteins

01:10:36.020 --> 01:10:38.660
 Okay

01:10:38.660 --> 01:10:41.500
 You know I think Ray I'm going to turn to some of the questions

01:10:41.500 --> 01:10:45.500
 I receive from people in preparation for the show because I know if I wait

01:10:45.900 --> 01:10:50.580
 We're gonna be short on time, and I want to make sure you have time to answer them

01:10:50.580 --> 01:10:56.980
 Last week we talked about or you mentioned Luca Turin and his research on

01:10:56.980 --> 01:11:02.580
 I think it was odors and the electrical nature of odors he had

01:11:02.580 --> 01:11:05.300
 maybe you could

01:11:05.300 --> 01:11:08.340
 when you get to answering this you could go over that a little bit, but

01:11:08.340 --> 01:11:14.340
 Somebody wanted to know what your feelings are about multiple chemical sensitivity

01:11:15.260 --> 01:11:16.700
 and that's

01:11:16.700 --> 01:11:21.940
 pretty common these days a lot of people can be made very ill by a perfume or the smell of bounce and

01:11:21.940 --> 01:11:26.940
 What do you think of is going on and does that relate to Luca Turin's work?

01:11:26.940 --> 01:11:30.020
 yeah, I think it does and

01:11:30.020 --> 01:11:33.740
 See he was

01:11:33.740 --> 01:11:36.860
 Talking specifically about

01:11:36.860 --> 01:11:40.220
 Smell and and

01:11:40.220 --> 01:11:44.860
 psychoactive like antidepressant chemicals and

01:11:45.860 --> 01:11:48.620
 there is when you look at the

01:11:48.620 --> 01:11:51.540
 what's in common between

01:11:51.540 --> 01:11:54.980
 Smelling and

01:11:54.980 --> 01:12:00.620
 Having the antidepressant effect of some chemicals

01:12:00.620 --> 01:12:03.500
 what's in common is

01:12:03.500 --> 01:12:10.020
 the resonance state or the tuning of the molecule to the

01:12:10.020 --> 01:12:13.900
 Oxidation state

01:12:14.900 --> 01:12:16.900
 Which is

01:12:16.900 --> 01:12:19.260
 in this context of

01:12:19.260 --> 01:12:22.580
 partially oxidized proteins in a

01:12:22.580 --> 01:12:25.740
 coherent cooperative system

01:12:25.740 --> 01:12:34.100
 The whole system has to be tuned to a certain level of reduction and oxidation and

01:12:34.100 --> 01:12:42.540
 The the addition of a chemical whether it's an antidepressant or a perfume molecule

01:12:42.700 --> 01:12:44.700
 and

01:12:44.700 --> 01:12:47.740
 Passes along the conductive

01:12:47.740 --> 01:12:52.460
 Pathways of the nervous system and

01:12:52.460 --> 01:12:59.860
 Cells all through the body are are involved in

01:12:59.860 --> 01:13:07.580
 The delicate nerve balances the vegetative or autonomic nervous system

01:13:07.580 --> 01:13:12.140
 Regulates the state of inflammation

01:13:12.220 --> 01:13:14.220
 of the tissues for example

01:13:14.220 --> 01:13:17.180
 There are lots of

01:13:17.180 --> 01:13:18.700
 cells

01:13:18.700 --> 01:13:20.700
 closely associated with

01:13:20.700 --> 01:13:22.940
 fibers of the nervous system

01:13:22.940 --> 01:13:28.780
 Cells called mast cells for example that can regulate

01:13:28.780 --> 01:13:31.900
 inflammation all through the body

01:13:31.900 --> 01:13:35.100
 in the brain as well as

01:13:35.100 --> 01:13:40.060
 all the other tissues and and these are are connected and

01:13:41.020 --> 01:13:47.460
 Balanced with with the nervous system. So a slight shift in your autonomic nervous system

01:13:47.460 --> 01:13:51.340
 Can

01:13:51.340 --> 01:13:55.460
 Globally change the degree of inflammation all through your body

01:13:55.460 --> 01:14:00.980
 Increasing the amount of histamine and serotonin and

01:14:00.980 --> 01:14:05.340
 the various products of the mast cells

01:14:05.340 --> 01:14:08.660
 this is

01:14:09.260 --> 01:14:15.220
 when a person is under stress chronically these inflammatory things tend to rise and

01:14:15.220 --> 01:14:19.700
 When you increase your

01:14:19.700 --> 01:14:22.540
 intensity of

01:14:22.540 --> 01:14:25.500
 mitochondrial respiration and your level of carbon dioxide

01:14:25.500 --> 01:14:28.380
 that

01:14:28.380 --> 01:14:31.100
 Stabilizes the system backs away from that excess

01:14:31.100 --> 01:14:33.860
 inflammatory

01:14:33.860 --> 01:14:35.860
 reductive impulse but

01:14:35.860 --> 01:14:38.500
 When you're right on the edge

01:14:38.940 --> 01:14:40.940
 Just balanced

01:14:40.940 --> 01:14:43.020
 not intense enough

01:14:43.020 --> 01:14:46.540
 oxidation going on then a

01:14:46.540 --> 01:14:50.260
 perfume molecule or a

01:14:50.260 --> 01:14:55.260
 Psychoactive chemical or a food molecule can

01:14:55.260 --> 01:14:59.420
 Send impulses through your system shifting you

01:14:59.420 --> 01:15:02.620
 away from the

01:15:02.620 --> 01:15:06.020
 oxidative excitatory processes towards the

01:15:07.380 --> 01:15:10.700
 Side of your nervous system that becomes dominant in shock

01:15:10.700 --> 01:15:15.820
 So I think the the chronic fatigue and

01:15:15.820 --> 01:15:20.820
 chemical sensitivity inflammatory states

01:15:20.820 --> 01:15:24.420
 Are

01:15:24.420 --> 01:15:29.180
 In effect a variation on the physiology of shock

01:15:29.180 --> 01:15:31.700
 Hmm, that's really fascinating

01:15:31.700 --> 01:15:38.100
 I mean, it's amazing that somebody can actually wear a product because they like the smell but that same product

01:15:38.100 --> 01:15:41.780
 The smell of which can make somebody else deadly ill

01:15:41.780 --> 01:15:45.140
 um, yeah, I think it's a

01:15:45.140 --> 01:15:50.780
 Depends on the way you're nervous and chemical system is is tuned up

01:15:50.780 --> 01:15:57.460
 I mean everything oxidation and reduction is involved in and all of our processes that are

01:15:57.460 --> 01:16:00.980
 Chemical. Yeah

01:16:01.220 --> 01:16:03.220
 lactic acid

01:16:03.220 --> 01:16:09.300
 Is a reductant as well as a product of of being reduced

01:16:09.300 --> 01:16:16.460
 And turning it into lactic acid from pyruvic acid

01:16:16.460 --> 01:16:20.220
 Involves an electronic

01:16:20.220 --> 01:16:24.060
 addition or reduction but it

01:16:24.060 --> 01:16:27.060
 then when it goes to a

01:16:27.060 --> 01:16:29.620
 balanced or healthy healthy cell

01:16:30.060 --> 01:16:33.300
 It shifts the balance towards reduction

01:16:33.300 --> 01:16:39.900
 And if you have oxygen in that cell, it's okay. The electrons will be consumed

01:16:39.900 --> 01:16:41.940
 but

01:16:41.940 --> 01:16:47.140
 Lactic acid itself has this potential for shifting the balance for example in

01:16:47.140 --> 01:16:50.300
 the mast cells that are

01:16:50.300 --> 01:16:53.060
 signals for more inflammation

01:16:53.060 --> 01:16:57.500
 Too much lactic acid will activate their

01:16:58.780 --> 01:17:00.780
 releases and

01:17:00.780 --> 01:17:03.300
 so systemically

01:17:03.300 --> 01:17:06.540
 letting too much lactic acid circulate is

01:17:06.540 --> 01:17:09.700
 adding to the

01:17:09.700 --> 01:17:12.180
 The inflammatory state

01:17:12.180 --> 01:17:16.300
 And I know you've told me before people might be interested in this that

01:17:16.300 --> 01:17:20.020
 you're not very fond of yogurt because of the

01:17:20.020 --> 01:17:23.060
 lactic acid so you can actually

01:17:24.060 --> 01:17:31.620
 Absorb lactic acid from your food directly. I mean, yeah, there are some kinds of yogurt that have very little

01:17:31.620 --> 01:17:33.540
 lactic acid

01:17:33.540 --> 01:17:35.020
 You can

01:17:35.020 --> 01:17:36.780
 thicken the milk

01:17:36.780 --> 01:17:38.060
 enzymically

01:17:38.060 --> 01:17:39.460
 rather than

01:17:39.460 --> 01:17:43.020
 With a lot of acid and those very mild yogurts

01:17:43.020 --> 01:17:45.700
 aren't

01:17:45.700 --> 01:17:49.100
 Especially harmful, but if they're very sour with lactic acid

01:17:49.100 --> 01:17:52.020
 and if your liver is

01:17:52.500 --> 01:17:55.740
 On edge not enough thyroid function

01:17:55.740 --> 01:17:57.780
 then

01:17:57.780 --> 01:18:01.940
 That slight shift in towards the reduction side

01:18:01.940 --> 01:18:05.540
 Can have systemic effects and can bring on

01:18:05.540 --> 01:18:09.500
 allergic reactions migraine headaches and such and

01:18:09.500 --> 01:18:15.100
 So just talking specifically about yogurt if you we have a local yogurt

01:18:15.100 --> 01:18:19.020
 Maker around here and I find if you buy it immediately

01:18:19.580 --> 01:18:24.780
 You know as soon as it comes out, there's hardly no apparent lactic acid in it

01:18:24.780 --> 01:18:27.380
 But the longer it sits the more the acids

01:18:27.380 --> 01:18:30.180
 separates from the actual

01:18:30.180 --> 01:18:35.180
 Milk product so I'm wondering is that acid

01:18:35.180 --> 01:18:39.780
 Forming as it goes or is it always in there and you just shouldn't eat it period?

01:18:39.780 --> 01:18:41.860
 No, the

01:18:41.860 --> 01:18:43.860
 Bacteria are making it. Okay

01:18:43.860 --> 01:18:47.660
 So a young a young yogurt would be fine

01:18:48.620 --> 01:18:50.620
 Yeah, I think so. Okay

01:18:50.620 --> 01:18:56.820
 Yeah, because that you can also strain your yogurt which is the same as buying Greek yogurt

01:18:56.820 --> 01:19:01.260
 And that gets rid of it and basically makes a thicker or cheesier

01:19:01.260 --> 01:19:04.820
 Thank you product. Yeah, that's the

01:19:04.820 --> 01:19:07.660
 idea of cottage cheese

01:19:07.660 --> 01:19:10.580
 They drain away

01:19:10.580 --> 01:19:14.540
 most of the fluid the way

01:19:15.740 --> 01:19:21.100
 And that takes away the almost all of the lactic acid for most cheeses

01:19:21.100 --> 01:19:28.460
 Okay. Well, that's good to know that fresh yogurt is okay. I guess got a question coming in on the same subject

01:19:28.460 --> 01:19:30.460
 We were talking about a second ago

01:19:30.460 --> 01:19:34.580
 From Duncan. I bought a perfume base from a chemical company some years ago

01:19:34.580 --> 01:19:41.380
 And it was so toxic that UPS was afraid to deliver it. I had to go pick it up myself on

01:19:41.380 --> 01:19:44.620
 the MSDS toxicity scale

01:19:45.620 --> 01:19:48.420
 Which goes from 0 to 4 this was a 6

01:19:48.420 --> 01:19:52.140
 Yep, two points over the max for chemical toxicity

01:19:52.140 --> 01:19:58.860
 Perfumes are very poisonous. He concludes. What's the MSDS? Is that the manufacturers?

01:19:58.860 --> 01:20:07.080
 Safety data sheet. Thank you. Yes. All right, and he also asked you contribute to Wikipedia

01:20:07.080 --> 01:20:11.820
 No, okay, and I'll go ahead

01:20:12.540 --> 01:20:14.540
 someone has asked me to

01:20:14.540 --> 01:20:18.620
 Comment on the

01:20:18.620 --> 01:20:21.100
 association induction hypothesis

01:20:21.100 --> 01:20:24.740
 Article a very good long article

01:20:24.740 --> 01:20:29.740
 Describing Gilbert things theory a lot of people are jumping on it

01:20:29.740 --> 01:20:32.580
 Saying that it should be

01:20:32.580 --> 01:20:36.060
 Eliminated from Wikipedia because it's wrong

01:20:37.340 --> 01:20:42.140
 Wow, well, that's surprising. I wonder if I've Gerald Pollack who also basically

01:20:42.140 --> 01:20:48.700
 Derived a lot of his work from Gilbert Lange and says so I wonder if he might be there defending him

01:20:48.700 --> 01:20:53.260
 Yeah, I I don't know how you get involved. I

01:20:53.260 --> 01:20:56.300
 When I find out I think I'll

01:20:56.300 --> 01:21:00.180
 Say keep it, please. Yeah, okay

01:21:00.180 --> 01:21:02.700
 That would be good. Um

01:21:02.900 --> 01:21:08.860
 Let's see, and I have some more questions here. I should I'm gonna find them so we get to them before the show is over

01:21:08.860 --> 01:21:11.060
 This is from Paul

01:21:11.060 --> 01:21:15.660
 He says I am a 34 year old male and since about eight months

01:21:15.660 --> 01:21:21.820
 Type one diabetic. I believe I got diabetes after x-rays from my dentist

01:21:21.820 --> 01:21:28.540
 I'm curious if you think that's possible. I take daily insulin and follow a pro metabolic diet. I

01:21:29.260 --> 01:21:33.940
 supplement aspirin vitamin a vitamin e vitamin K b1 b3 glycine

01:21:33.940 --> 01:21:36.460
 pregnenolone magnesium glycinate

01:21:36.460 --> 01:21:44.340
 I am still in a so-called honeymoon phase and I would very much like to prolong this phase or even get off all insulin

01:21:44.340 --> 01:21:52.140
 Do you have any tips or supplements? I might add to my regimen and he says thank you from the bottom of his heart

01:21:55.100 --> 01:22:00.580
 Before I was born my father had extreme diabetes went down to

01:22:00.580 --> 01:22:04.140
 Something like 90 pounds or less

01:22:04.140 --> 01:22:06.860
 couldn't

01:22:06.860 --> 01:22:08.860
 assimilate any kind of food

01:22:08.860 --> 01:22:11.860
 even pure protein

01:22:11.860 --> 01:22:19.900
 Raised his urine glucose tremendously and looking at old

01:22:19.900 --> 01:22:23.940
 Naturopathic remedies

01:22:24.420 --> 01:22:28.700
 He started eating as his only food

01:22:28.700 --> 01:22:34.060
 Brewers yeast gator, I guess two cups a day at first and

01:22:34.060 --> 01:22:37.180
 immediately stopped producing

01:22:37.180 --> 01:22:39.300
 so much

01:22:39.300 --> 01:22:44.460
 Glucose in his urine and in a few months was completely well

01:22:44.460 --> 01:22:49.740
 Every maybe five years or so after that he would

01:22:50.460 --> 01:22:56.000
 Eat some extra brewers yeast, but never had any symptom of

01:22:56.000 --> 01:22:58.940
 diabetes after that and

01:22:58.940 --> 01:23:02.980
 I think part of that effect is the

01:23:02.980 --> 01:23:06.300
 the hormones in the yeast

01:23:06.300 --> 01:23:08.540
 which

01:23:08.540 --> 01:23:10.540
 stimulate

01:23:10.540 --> 01:23:16.660
 Regeneration and high potassium content which has an insulin like action

01:23:18.260 --> 01:23:20.340
 And the high B vitamins

01:23:20.340 --> 01:23:24.500
 But

01:23:24.500 --> 01:23:28.420
 having enough glucose so that you don't

01:23:28.420 --> 01:23:31.620
 draw any

01:23:31.620 --> 01:23:36.860
 Polyunsaturated fats out of storage. Those are very toxic to the

01:23:36.860 --> 01:23:42.740
 The pen the insulin producing cells in the pancreas

01:23:42.740 --> 01:23:47.500
 They are

01:23:47.500 --> 01:23:51.780
 Normally, they're constantly turning over the beta cells are being renewed

01:23:51.780 --> 01:23:57.140
 constantly and in a diabetic they're being renewed but they die quickly and

01:23:57.140 --> 01:24:03.940
 Sugar is a factor that will prolong their lifespan

01:24:03.940 --> 01:24:10.380
 It doesn't need anything to stimulate renewal just to prevent them being killed

01:24:10.380 --> 01:24:14.900
 primarily by the polyunsaturated fats and the

01:24:16.460 --> 01:24:18.460
 Nitric oxide is

01:24:18.460 --> 01:24:21.620
 Soon after

01:24:21.620 --> 01:24:28.620
 It was discovered that the body produces its own nitric oxide in the early 90s many

01:24:28.620 --> 01:24:33.940
 articles came out demonstrating that nitric oxide is specifically

01:24:33.940 --> 01:24:37.180
 what kills the beta cells and

01:24:37.180 --> 01:24:40.260
 so you definitely don't want to

01:24:40.260 --> 01:24:43.460
 Do anything that?

01:24:43.540 --> 01:24:48.980
 Would increase your nitric oxide production. What kind of activity does that well?

01:24:48.980 --> 01:24:52.100
 supplementing

01:24:52.100 --> 01:24:54.300
 Arginine or foods high in arginine

01:24:54.300 --> 01:24:57.180
 Wouldn't probably be desirable

01:24:57.180 --> 01:25:00.340
 okay, and

01:25:00.340 --> 01:25:08.060
 I think the the effects of aspirin and the B vitamins and the vitamin E

01:25:08.060 --> 01:25:11.780
 Pregnenol and then progesterone and

01:25:12.660 --> 01:25:14.660
 DHEA

01:25:14.660 --> 01:25:16.900
 Around

01:25:16.900 --> 01:25:20.340
 1985 I think it was someone

01:25:20.340 --> 01:25:22.900
 gave rabbits

01:25:22.900 --> 01:25:29.660
 diabetes with a chemical toxin and then gave them a supplement of DHEA and

01:25:29.660 --> 01:25:35.220
 That was the only difference the ones that got the DHEA

01:25:35.220 --> 01:25:41.120
 Regenerated healthy insulin producing pancreases

01:25:41.160 --> 01:25:43.160
 Hmm

01:25:43.160 --> 01:25:48.960
 And that has to be taken in small amounts. Are you converted to estrogen? Is that right?

01:25:48.960 --> 01:25:54.400
 Yeah, 10 to 15 milligrams is probably a safe amount

01:25:54.400 --> 01:26:03.760
 All right, and and one of the things that I think everybody will be surprised by is that you're actually advocating

01:26:03.760 --> 01:26:06.600
 taking sugar or glucose

01:26:08.280 --> 01:26:13.840
 Which is a couple of articles on my website I give some of the history of that

01:26:13.840 --> 01:26:16.480
 in

01:26:16.480 --> 01:26:20.480
 The late 19th century a couple of doctors

01:26:20.480 --> 01:26:23.400
 described cases that they cured

01:26:23.400 --> 01:26:26.480
 from

01:26:26.480 --> 01:26:30.800
 really advanced terminal diabetes people losing

01:26:30.800 --> 01:26:33.280
 weight

01:26:33.280 --> 01:26:35.120
 terrific rate

01:26:35.120 --> 01:26:36.960
 they added

01:26:36.960 --> 01:26:43.520
 Something like 12 ounces per day of sugar to an otherwise good diet

01:26:43.520 --> 01:26:48.200
 regular high protein and vegetables and

01:26:48.200 --> 01:26:54.520
 Milk and so on. Hmm, but just by adding 12 ounces of

01:26:54.520 --> 01:26:57.720
 sugar to that diet

01:26:57.720 --> 01:27:01.240
 In just a few weeks people came back from near death

01:27:01.360 --> 01:27:07.640
 Hmm and I guess their logic was since they were urinating out so much of their bodily sugar

01:27:07.640 --> 01:27:11.240
 They figured maybe they were short on sugar. Yeah

01:27:11.240 --> 01:27:14.520
 exactly, they their reasoning at first was

01:27:14.520 --> 01:27:19.160
 They're dying so fast. They're putting out

01:27:19.160 --> 01:27:24.040
 The equivalent of a pound of tissue

01:27:24.040 --> 01:27:27.560
 Converted to sugar every day

01:27:27.560 --> 01:27:29.000
 and

01:27:29.000 --> 01:27:35.880
 Just to slow down their starvation process. They said them and and they crave sugar. Why not let them

01:27:35.880 --> 01:27:38.440
 eat

01:27:38.440 --> 01:27:40.440
 what they crave and

01:27:40.440 --> 01:27:43.920
 maybe slow down their death, but instead they

01:27:43.920 --> 01:27:48.280
 Stopped wasting away and came back. Hmm

01:27:48.280 --> 01:27:56.840
 And I want to go back a little bit to because I think I did the person who asked the

01:27:57.480 --> 01:28:04.080
 Multiple chemical sensitivity question a little short shrift and that I never asked you. What can somebody do?

01:28:04.080 --> 01:28:08.120
 if if they're suffering from multiple chemical sensitivity

01:28:08.120 --> 01:28:11.000
 I'm

01:28:11.000 --> 01:28:17.480
 supplementing thyroid is the usual thing, but sometimes they're very low in cholesterol and

01:28:17.480 --> 01:28:21.120
 since thyroid works partly through

01:28:21.120 --> 01:28:25.040
 Converting cholesterol to

01:28:25.880 --> 01:28:29.520
 Hormones like progesterone DHA and pregnenolone

01:28:29.520 --> 01:28:36.920
 If your cholesterol is too low thyroid alone doesn't necessarily do it so

01:28:36.920 --> 01:28:46.720
 Supplementing one or more of those will very quickly often relieve the

01:28:46.720 --> 01:28:50.320
 Exaggerated sensitivity. Hmm

01:28:50.320 --> 01:28:52.880
 Okay

01:28:52.880 --> 01:28:56.960
 And it sounds like you said that the the rabbits were given

01:28:56.960 --> 01:29:00.160
 diabetes just by being poisoned

01:29:00.160 --> 01:29:06.240
 With a toxin and it sounds like that's happened. A lot of our diseases are actually

01:29:06.240 --> 01:29:09.040
 environmentally caused it's

01:29:09.040 --> 01:29:11.360
 You know, I know

01:29:11.360 --> 01:29:16.800
 they say a lot of people have predispositions to cancer and diabetes and stuff like that, but I

01:29:16.800 --> 01:29:20.460
 personally suspect a lot of it is just environmentally from the

01:29:21.240 --> 01:29:23.240
 from the pollution that's

01:29:23.240 --> 01:29:25.480
 inevitable in our industrial society

01:29:25.480 --> 01:29:28.480
 you know when I was starting on my

01:29:28.480 --> 01:29:31.280
 dissertation project I

01:29:31.280 --> 01:29:33.360
 wondered what

01:29:33.360 --> 01:29:35.360
 What the factors were that?

01:29:35.360 --> 01:29:37.880
 slowed down

01:29:37.880 --> 01:29:40.640
 oxidative processes in aging and

01:29:40.640 --> 01:29:48.280
 As I looked around at the possibilities, I saw that the same type of deterioration

01:29:48.280 --> 01:29:51.120
 the same

01:29:51.120 --> 01:29:53.040
 biochemical

01:29:53.040 --> 01:29:56.440
 patterns of interference with mitochondrial

01:29:56.440 --> 01:30:01.860
 Respiration were produced by a great variety of stresses

01:30:01.860 --> 01:30:06.200
 radiation ionizing radiation or

01:30:06.200 --> 01:30:10.040
 even ultraviolet to excess

01:30:10.040 --> 01:30:18.080
 Had an effect similar to all of the estrogens and the

01:30:19.200 --> 01:30:21.200
 aromatic hydrocarbon

01:30:21.200 --> 01:30:25.040
 carcinogens and hydrocarbons that produce

01:30:25.040 --> 01:30:28.360
 excitation and inflammation

01:30:28.360 --> 01:30:31.000
 and

01:30:31.000 --> 01:30:33.480
 Polyunsaturated fatty acids

01:30:33.480 --> 01:30:37.400
 produce the same the same pattern of

01:30:37.400 --> 01:30:40.760
 deterioration and the vitamin E

01:30:40.760 --> 01:30:44.080
 supplement was found to

01:30:44.080 --> 01:30:47.840
 Stop the characteristic damage. They were seeing in

01:30:48.880 --> 01:30:55.080
 lab rats and industrial animals for my feeding them too much unsaturated fat and

01:30:55.080 --> 01:30:57.960
 my thesis advisor

01:30:57.960 --> 01:31:00.680
 found that

01:31:00.680 --> 01:31:02.640
 The

01:31:02.640 --> 01:31:04.640
 effects of too much estrogen

01:31:04.640 --> 01:31:09.800
 were corrected by a very large vitamin E supplement and

01:31:09.800 --> 01:31:16.960
 Others were finding that vitamin E protects even against radiation and sunburn

01:31:17.960 --> 01:31:19.560
 and

01:31:19.560 --> 01:31:21.560
 so some of the

01:31:21.560 --> 01:31:24.800
 processes like the breakdown of

01:31:24.800 --> 01:31:27.880
 polyunsaturated fats are

01:31:27.880 --> 01:31:35.480
 Increasing our susceptibility to damage from all of those stressors radiation estrogen

01:31:35.480 --> 01:31:42.720
 Toxic heavy metals and so on. Mm-hmm and Ray is referring to the the liquid oils that

01:31:42.720 --> 01:31:46.480
 Everywhere in our

01:31:46.480 --> 01:31:49.440
 food supply the canola oil I

01:31:49.440 --> 01:31:53.100
 Think you think olive oils not too bad and butter is good

01:31:53.100 --> 01:31:57.900
 But all the vegetable oils except for coconut are not a good idea

01:31:57.900 --> 01:32:02.880
 yeah, olive oil has only you know, eight or ten percent of the

01:32:02.880 --> 01:32:06.560
 Unstable polyunsaturated

01:32:06.560 --> 01:32:14.160
 butter and coconut oil have two or maybe three percent of the unstable ones

01:32:15.760 --> 01:32:17.320
 I've

01:32:17.320 --> 01:32:19.320
 recently finally

01:32:19.320 --> 01:32:21.800
 Shifted

01:32:21.800 --> 01:32:25.440
 for in accordance with something that I read

01:32:25.440 --> 01:32:29.080
 about 40 years ago on the

01:32:29.080 --> 01:32:32.940
 absence of cancer in animals that were fed

01:32:32.940 --> 01:32:40.640
 different types of oil coconut oil was safer than olive oil which was safer than

01:32:42.680 --> 01:32:47.800
 safflower oil and the polyunsaturated but the safest of them all was

01:32:47.800 --> 01:32:50.960
 hydrogenated coconut oil

01:32:50.960 --> 01:32:53.960
 Recently I found a place

01:32:53.960 --> 01:32:56.840
 to get some

01:32:56.840 --> 01:32:59.920
 Just to try it out and it has a very nice

01:32:59.920 --> 01:33:08.040
 Clean taste and texture and it's it's free of trans fatty acids as well as polyunsaturated fats. No blues

01:33:08.040 --> 01:33:10.800
 the supplier

01:33:11.240 --> 01:33:14.240
 Doesn't supply a retail only

01:33:14.240 --> 01:33:18.680
 Car lot loads. So did you get a semi is it parked out back?

01:33:18.680 --> 01:33:22.280
 Behind your house

01:33:22.280 --> 01:33:24.960
 Was a very

01:33:24.960 --> 01:33:30.640
 Involved process to get oh, yeah a few gallons of it. Well, sometimes you can

01:33:30.640 --> 01:33:35.760
 Say you're thinking of buying a semi, but you just want a sample. Yeah. Yeah

01:33:35.760 --> 01:33:39.720
 Well, that's interesting. Did some of the animals get to eat butter?

01:33:40.240 --> 01:33:41.760
 Oh

01:33:41.760 --> 01:33:42.880
 Yeah

01:33:42.880 --> 01:33:46.880
 Butter and coconut oil. Uh-huh. We're the safest natural oils

01:33:46.880 --> 01:33:53.760
 Okay, and so let's talk about this is another thing that confuses me about oxidation reduction is sometimes

01:33:53.760 --> 01:33:56.040
 They refer to it as hydrogen

01:33:56.040 --> 01:33:59.000
 hydrogenation or dehydrogenation

01:33:59.000 --> 01:34:02.840
 But they're still talking about oxidation and reduction, aren't they?

01:34:02.840 --> 01:34:05.960
 Yeah, it's just a movement of

01:34:05.960 --> 01:34:08.920
 electrons that

01:34:09.360 --> 01:34:11.360
 they're talking about the

01:34:11.360 --> 01:34:14.360
 when we

01:34:14.360 --> 01:34:16.440
 make what when we

01:34:16.440 --> 01:34:22.880
 Turn saturated fat into unsaturated fat in our own bodies

01:34:22.880 --> 01:34:25.840
 we

01:34:25.840 --> 01:34:28.080
 Dehydrogenated

01:34:28.080 --> 01:34:30.080
 And when a cow turns

01:34:30.080 --> 01:34:36.500
 Unsaturated fat from their food into saturated fat for the butter

01:34:38.280 --> 01:34:44.120
 It's bacteria in their intestine and rumen which is saturating it

01:34:44.120 --> 01:34:47.320
 hydrogenating it so

01:34:47.320 --> 01:34:51.040
 Dehydrogenation

01:34:51.040 --> 01:34:53.040
 it is

01:34:53.040 --> 01:34:55.240
 Something that we do

01:34:55.240 --> 01:35:02.240
 In our own body I see and maybe you could describe for us

01:35:03.720 --> 01:35:09.280
 What is actually happening to the molecule is it you're actually removing the hydrogen and then that's what

01:35:09.280 --> 01:35:15.880
 They're actually referring to the electron

01:35:15.880 --> 01:35:22.120
 the movement of electrons out of the bonds is what makes a difference and

01:35:22.120 --> 01:35:23.880
 the

01:35:23.880 --> 01:35:29.560
 The usual thing that you move is a hydrogen atom or two hydrogen atoms

01:35:29.560 --> 01:35:32.440
 And when you take those away

01:35:33.600 --> 01:35:35.160
 the

01:35:35.160 --> 01:35:37.160
 like if it's on

01:35:37.160 --> 01:35:38.680
 the

01:35:38.680 --> 01:35:42.800
 to a draining carbon atoms in a fat molecule

01:35:42.800 --> 01:35:50.600
 There was a bond of two electrons between the carbons you take away a hydrogen from each one

01:35:50.600 --> 01:35:53.560
 and it takes

01:35:53.560 --> 01:36:00.560
 It's the proton and one electron leave in each case and they combine

01:36:01.560 --> 01:36:03.560
 to hydrogen atoms

01:36:03.560 --> 01:36:09.480
 Turn into hydrogen gas or go to some other molecule and the left behind

01:36:09.480 --> 01:36:12.960
 Electrons

01:36:12.960 --> 01:36:20.000
 Join with each other. So you get a double bond for electrons and joining those carbon atoms and

01:36:20.000 --> 01:36:23.160
 the absence of

01:36:23.160 --> 01:36:27.120
 This space filling hydrogen

01:36:28.480 --> 01:36:32.040
 Seems to leave that range of

01:36:32.040 --> 01:36:37.080
 electrons between carbons open and more reactive

01:36:37.080 --> 01:36:40.920
 So the

01:36:40.920 --> 01:36:46.960
 when you get a lot of hydrogens removed that makes

01:36:46.960 --> 01:36:55.200
 Access of oxygen atoms to the fat molecule easier. Hmm. I

01:36:56.640 --> 01:37:03.320
 See so that's why Crisco is actually a liquid oil, but it's been had the hydrogen added to it and that

01:37:03.320 --> 01:37:06.120
 Makes it more stable

01:37:06.120 --> 01:37:10.560
 Yeah, and if they would complete the process the way they do in

01:37:10.560 --> 01:37:17.700
 Changing coconut oil from two or three percent PUFA to zero percent PUFA

01:37:17.700 --> 01:37:20.080
 you wouldn't get the

01:37:20.080 --> 01:37:22.400
 trans-fat

01:37:22.400 --> 01:37:24.160
 in it and

01:37:24.160 --> 01:37:26.160
 so you would have

01:37:26.600 --> 01:37:28.600
 totally saturated and

01:37:28.600 --> 01:37:30.320
 mostly

01:37:30.320 --> 01:37:32.120
 stearic acid

01:37:32.120 --> 01:37:34.120
 In Crisco and that would be safe

01:37:34.120 --> 01:37:39.920
 One group of researchers found that aged

01:37:39.920 --> 01:37:42.920
 defective mitochondria

01:37:42.920 --> 01:37:45.040
 That were not respiring

01:37:45.040 --> 01:37:47.000
 properly

01:37:47.000 --> 01:37:48.360
 when they

01:37:48.360 --> 01:37:50.400
 Gave them fully saturated

01:37:52.240 --> 01:37:54.240
 I think was peanut oil

01:37:54.240 --> 01:37:57.400
 Restored mitochondrial function Wow

01:37:57.400 --> 01:38:01.000
 So it's a it's a way of purifying it. Um

01:38:01.000 --> 01:38:03.760
 yeah, and and it

01:38:03.760 --> 01:38:06.800
 Eliminates the

01:38:06.800 --> 01:38:12.200
 Unstable quality that makes things susceptible to oxidation

01:38:12.200 --> 01:38:15.240
 There

01:38:15.240 --> 01:38:17.240
 Physiologically, there's something called the

01:38:18.040 --> 01:38:24.520
 saturation index you can look at a person's red blood cells and find the ratio of

01:38:24.520 --> 01:38:28.920
 stearic acid fully saturated to linoleic acid

01:38:28.920 --> 01:38:33.080
 or linoleic different degrees of

01:38:33.080 --> 01:38:36.280
 unsaturation and

01:38:36.280 --> 01:38:38.480
 and the longer

01:38:38.480 --> 01:38:45.040
 Even more unsaturated and people with cancer have a low saturation index

01:38:45.040 --> 01:38:47.040
 It's a very stabilizing thing to yeah, like like a newborn baby is highly saturated in its fats

01:38:47.040 --> 01:39:04.480
 In recent years a lot of

01:39:04.480 --> 01:39:13.360
 Nutrition oriented doctors are saying you must give babies fish oil. Oh god other highly

01:39:14.120 --> 01:39:17.640
 highly unsaturated things because most babies are born

01:39:17.640 --> 01:39:27.080
 Deficient in the essential fatty acids, but that's the normal state of a newborn. Yeah animal. That's strange because

01:39:27.080 --> 01:39:29.960
 It just shows how disconnected

01:39:29.960 --> 01:39:33.920
 The medical authorities are with nature. I

01:39:38.040 --> 01:39:45.440
 Mean if you'd ever look for anything to for an idea of what perfection is you I think you'd look at a newborn creature

01:39:45.440 --> 01:39:50.960
 Yeah, the rate of oxidation is highest

01:39:50.960 --> 01:39:55.840
 I'm not not sure how much

01:39:55.840 --> 01:40:02.040
 how you would compare the prenatal oxidative state but right at

01:40:02.040 --> 01:40:05.000
 the newborn the

01:40:06.960 --> 01:40:08.920
 Consumption of

01:40:08.920 --> 01:40:15.240
 Oxygen and the sugar per gram of tissue is higher than it will ever be later

01:40:15.240 --> 01:40:17.760
 And it decreases

01:40:17.760 --> 01:40:22.800
 Especially at puberty with the the rise of the sex hormones

01:40:22.800 --> 01:40:25.520
 the oxidation rate

01:40:25.520 --> 01:40:31.720
 decreases more sharply and mortality rate increases as the

01:40:31.720 --> 01:40:35.360
 Oxidation rate decreases

01:40:36.560 --> 01:40:38.560
 Right, so

01:40:38.560 --> 01:40:40.920
 That makes perfect sense

01:40:40.920 --> 01:40:44.840
 now I better get back to my questions here from

01:40:44.840 --> 01:40:52.520
 Interested people Martin asks about salt and these are three questions about salt and

01:40:52.520 --> 01:40:55.580
 I'll just run through them as quickly as I can

01:40:55.580 --> 01:41:00.280
 Can salt ingestion trigger migraines in

01:41:01.040 --> 01:41:07.040
 Some predisposed people example mass max gerson and what would be the cycle?

01:41:07.040 --> 01:41:10.120
 I excuse me, what would be the physiological explanation?

01:41:10.120 --> 01:41:14.240
 Shall I read them all or do you want to take them one at a time? Oh

01:41:14.240 --> 01:41:19.720
 Are they related to the salt? Yeah, they're all about salt restriction

01:41:19.720 --> 01:41:22.640
 Yeah

01:41:22.640 --> 01:41:30.120
 The others, okay. Here's number two. Here's number two. Do you believe salt restriction was useful in the University of Munich's?

01:41:30.520 --> 01:41:31.920
 1928

01:41:31.920 --> 01:41:39.040
 Tuberculosis trial with Max Gerson's diet under the supervision of Ferdinand sour brush if yes

01:41:39.040 --> 01:41:44.120
 was the beneficial effect due to a release of excess intracellular water and

01:41:44.120 --> 01:41:50.880
 three if salt restriction is useful in evacuating excess intracellular water present in

01:41:50.880 --> 01:41:56.120
 Degenerative diseases is it useful to keep restricting it once this excess?

01:41:57.000 --> 01:42:04.220
 Intercellular water has been evacuated should cancer patients keep avoiding salt after a few months of a saltless diet

01:42:04.220 --> 01:42:12.720
 Um, yeah, I read Gerson's book and he was

01:42:12.720 --> 01:42:16.760
 Very very good

01:42:16.760 --> 01:42:18.840
 thorough

01:42:18.840 --> 01:42:25.520
 Saw the effects of the diet first on migraines and then tuberculosis and then cancer

01:42:26.640 --> 01:42:28.280
 and

01:42:28.280 --> 01:42:30.400
 He tried to understand it and he

01:42:30.400 --> 01:42:36.320
 Seems to have read that just about everything in the first half of the century

01:42:36.320 --> 01:42:38.960
 on the subject

01:42:38.960 --> 01:42:41.360
 and

01:42:41.360 --> 01:42:45.500
 The the salts are extremely important the other

01:42:45.500 --> 01:42:49.880
 Contemporary of his

01:42:49.880 --> 01:42:53.920
 Cancer researcher

01:42:54.320 --> 01:42:57.520
 Had a very interesting parallel

01:42:57.520 --> 01:43:02.680
 Set of facts regarding salt

01:43:02.680 --> 01:43:10.840
 William Frederick Koch who was a chemistry professor at Michigan

01:43:10.840 --> 01:43:14.960
 Early in the century

01:43:14.960 --> 01:43:20.680
 Was studying the removal of the parathyroid glands

01:43:20.680 --> 01:43:23.680
 and a

01:43:23.920 --> 01:43:26.160
 calcium supplement was

01:43:26.160 --> 01:43:31.600
 The typical remedy for the cramping

01:43:31.600 --> 01:43:42.680
 Reaction to the removal of the parathyroid and the doctrine was developed that the parathyroid

01:43:42.680 --> 01:43:44.680
 regulates

01:43:44.680 --> 01:43:50.640
 Calcium and and so you need to replace calcium when the gland is removed but

01:43:50.640 --> 01:43:52.800
 Koch

01:43:52.800 --> 01:43:57.760
 Did the surgery on animals and found that if he gave them?

01:43:57.760 --> 01:44:00.080
 extra

01:44:00.080 --> 01:44:05.160
 Potassium or sodium or magnesium it had the same purity of effect

01:44:05.160 --> 01:44:09.080
 And

01:44:09.080 --> 01:44:11.440
 The

01:44:11.440 --> 01:44:15.080
 Essential fact was that one of these

01:44:15.080 --> 01:44:17.320
 can

01:44:17.320 --> 01:44:20.440
 make up for a deficiency of the other and

01:44:21.480 --> 01:44:25.040
 The Gerson diet was extremely high in

01:44:25.040 --> 01:44:29.600
 The other minerals especially potassium

01:44:29.600 --> 01:44:32.880
 and

01:44:32.880 --> 01:44:35.720
 There the diet always had

01:44:35.720 --> 01:44:43.320
 The amount of sodium that you would have in in juice leaves and fruits and vegetables and so on

01:44:43.320 --> 01:44:46.080
 so it was always a

01:44:46.080 --> 01:44:48.800
 physiological amount of sodium but

01:44:49.120 --> 01:44:53.520
 often a very excessive large amount of potassium and

01:44:53.520 --> 01:45:03.080
 Magnesium and I think these were the essence of Gerson's success rather than

01:45:03.080 --> 01:45:05.800
 just the

01:45:05.800 --> 01:45:07.800
 reducing sodium because

01:45:07.800 --> 01:45:11.160
 When you look at particular experiments

01:45:11.160 --> 01:45:17.440
 Sodium it can stimulate the respiration of a cell and

01:45:17.440 --> 01:45:19.400
 and

01:45:19.400 --> 01:45:21.400
 Cause it to

01:45:21.400 --> 01:45:24.240
 Unswell give up excess water

01:45:24.240 --> 01:45:26.640
 if you

01:45:26.640 --> 01:45:31.960
 Lower the the other minerals and give it too much sodium you can force it

01:45:31.960 --> 01:45:41.040
 To swell and take up water, but it's normal physiological function is to act as a stimulant

01:45:41.040 --> 01:45:45.800
 Calcium tends to do to do the same but

01:45:45.800 --> 01:45:47.800
 the

01:45:47.800 --> 01:45:51.920
 Cell normally is excluding sodium and

01:45:51.920 --> 01:46:01.360
 It perceives sodium as an irritant or stimulant and revs up its oxidative metabolism

01:46:01.360 --> 01:46:04.840
 When it

01:46:04.840 --> 01:46:11.280
 Has a little extra sodium and the increased oxidative metabolism

01:46:12.760 --> 01:46:15.720
 Produces carbon dioxide and restores the balance

01:46:15.720 --> 01:46:18.840
 So when they're in balance

01:46:18.840 --> 01:46:23.080
 The right amount of sodium is increasing

01:46:23.080 --> 01:46:28.440
 energy production and decreasing cell water content

01:46:28.440 --> 01:46:32.080
 And the

01:46:32.080 --> 01:46:36.600
 Much of this stuff

01:46:36.600 --> 01:46:38.440
 hadn't

01:46:38.440 --> 01:46:39.560
 been

01:46:39.560 --> 01:46:41.560
 specifically examined during

01:46:41.800 --> 01:46:47.360
 Gerson's lifetime, but he was definitely on to something and was curing

01:46:47.360 --> 01:46:49.640
 migraine and cancer

01:46:49.640 --> 01:46:51.640
 but he

01:46:51.640 --> 01:46:57.280
 very typically would give his patients a couple of grains of armor thyroid and

01:46:57.280 --> 01:47:05.160
 Very often coffee enemas and and they were always having a

01:47:05.160 --> 01:47:09.760
 Very high ratio of carbohydrate to

01:47:10.760 --> 01:47:16.360
 protein so they were low on the methionine and tryptophan and the

01:47:16.360 --> 01:47:19.960
 Potentially toxic amino acids

01:47:19.960 --> 01:47:23.880
 And

01:47:23.880 --> 01:47:27.520
 Generally lots of things in this program

01:47:27.520 --> 01:47:31.640
 were very well well founded but

01:47:31.640 --> 01:47:40.360
 There just wasn't enough information at that time about about how the balance of the alkaline minerals works

01:47:41.240 --> 01:47:44.920
 Yeah, and it sounds like there's so many variables going on there that it would be hard to

01:47:44.920 --> 01:47:47.640
 pin down any one

01:47:47.640 --> 01:47:49.640
 cause or

01:47:49.640 --> 01:47:51.760
 Yep, the

01:47:51.760 --> 01:47:53.240
 aldosterone

01:47:53.240 --> 01:47:56.920
 One of my first physiological experiments was on myself

01:47:56.920 --> 01:48:02.280
 When I worked in the woods our cook was cracked on the idea that

01:48:02.280 --> 01:48:08.520
 hard physical labor meant you sweated a lot and needed to replenish your salt and

01:48:09.840 --> 01:48:15.360
 That so he would put I think it was about a tablespoon of salt in everyone's porridge in the morning

01:48:15.360 --> 01:48:20.060
 if you didn't eat your porridge, you didn't get your ham and eggs on steak and

01:48:20.060 --> 01:48:24.440
 Everyone doing it and I

01:48:24.440 --> 01:48:28.720
 Within a few days of doing that. I found that

01:48:28.720 --> 01:48:35.600
 The sweat that dripped down my forehead was leaving salt crystal trails on my glasses

01:48:36.080 --> 01:48:38.720
 And my eyebrows looked like they were

01:48:38.720 --> 01:48:42.200
 coated with snow from the salt crystals and

01:48:42.200 --> 01:48:44.880
 I

01:48:44.880 --> 01:48:52.760
 Thought of the trick of saying that I had been put on a low salt diet. So I got normal porridge

01:48:52.760 --> 01:48:55.600
 here from then on and

01:48:55.600 --> 01:48:59.280
 Immediately I I could sweat distilled water

01:48:59.280 --> 01:49:01.640
 and

01:49:01.640 --> 01:49:03.080
 have I

01:49:03.080 --> 01:49:07.160
 On the high salt diet. I had to take salt salt pills

01:49:07.160 --> 01:49:09.240
 about

01:49:09.240 --> 01:49:11.240
 11 o'clock in the morning

01:49:11.240 --> 01:49:16.800
 Otherwise, I started getting faint needed to replenish the salt was pouring out so fast

01:49:16.800 --> 01:49:23.200
 But after the low salt diet, I never needed afternoon salt pills again

01:49:23.200 --> 01:49:28.360
 You mean the overdose of salt sort of stopped your body from being able to regulate it properly

01:49:28.360 --> 01:49:30.800
 yeah, and and the

01:49:30.800 --> 01:49:32.280
 when you're

01:49:32.280 --> 01:49:34.720
 Cutting back on the sodium

01:49:34.720 --> 01:49:40.040
 One of the first reactions is that your aldosterone is

01:49:40.040 --> 01:49:42.640
 increased

01:49:42.640 --> 01:49:44.640
 and aldosterone

01:49:44.640 --> 01:49:49.920
 Lets you retain the sodium, but it doesn't at the expense of

01:49:49.920 --> 01:49:52.920
 losing some potassium and magnesium

01:49:52.920 --> 01:49:57.760
 So if your diet is high in calcium and magnesium

01:49:57.760 --> 01:50:01.400
 And

01:50:02.040 --> 01:50:03.360
 Potassium

01:50:03.360 --> 01:50:06.640
 then there isn't any problem with the

01:50:06.640 --> 01:50:09.560
 low sodium intake but

01:50:09.560 --> 01:50:14.760
 chronically that high aldosterone has a

01:50:14.760 --> 01:50:19.680
 pro-inflammatory effect and and so chronically

01:50:19.680 --> 01:50:27.520
 Getting more of all of the alkaline minerals than you really need is a safety precaution that

01:50:28.240 --> 01:50:33.320
 will suppress your aldosterone and protect your heart from

01:50:33.320 --> 01:50:39.880
 Inflammation and fibrosis and hypertension and so on so in the long run

01:50:39.880 --> 01:50:50.120
 Sodium has this protection against cell swelling inflammation fibrosis inflammation

01:50:50.120 --> 01:50:56.200
 And in if taken in reasonable amounts it tastes good too

01:50:57.080 --> 01:51:02.320
 And what about can salt ingestion trigger migraines in some predisposed people?

01:51:02.320 --> 01:51:05.320
 Yeah, when when you're

01:51:05.320 --> 01:51:07.680
 already

01:51:07.680 --> 01:51:09.680
 on a low salt diet and

01:51:09.680 --> 01:51:15.720
 Take salt one of the common physiology experiments is to

01:51:15.720 --> 01:51:18.560
 have people

01:51:18.560 --> 01:51:23.560
 drink a quart of plain water or a quart of plain water with a

01:51:23.560 --> 01:51:25.720
 heaping

01:51:25.720 --> 01:51:27.720
 teaspoon of salt added to it and

01:51:27.720 --> 01:51:31.080
 at the end of the physiology lab

01:51:31.080 --> 01:51:35.560
 Everyone who got the unsalted quarter water

01:51:35.560 --> 01:51:43.520
 Would have formed about a quart of urine and the ones that got the salt didn't have any extra forming

01:51:43.520 --> 01:51:47.200
 And it took a usually a couple days

01:51:47.200 --> 01:51:50.840
 For that excess water to to come out

01:51:51.400 --> 01:51:56.920
 So when you take a sudden dose of salt it makes you swell up and retain water

01:51:56.920 --> 01:51:59.840
 until your

01:51:59.840 --> 01:52:05.720
 Aldosterone has adjusted downward. I see so it just takes a while to do it adjust to it

01:52:05.720 --> 01:52:08.520
 Yeah, and you'll notice

01:52:08.520 --> 01:52:12.160
 Anything that is

01:52:12.160 --> 01:52:16.680
 Susceptible will swell up your fingers and toes and and lips and

01:52:17.360 --> 01:52:22.680
 eyelids and such might swell up in the first day after you eat a lot of salt, but

01:52:22.680 --> 01:52:24.960
 people who

01:52:24.960 --> 01:52:29.860
 For example on a long airplane trip would always get swollen feet

01:52:29.860 --> 01:52:36.440
 If they adjusted two or three days in advance by eating extra salt on some baking soda

01:52:36.440 --> 01:52:42.680
 They didn't get swollen feet from sitting still anymore. Huh? I

01:52:42.680 --> 01:52:45.400
 see, so

01:52:45.400 --> 01:52:51.480
 So you're retaining the you're retaining the liquid then and in a different place or are you not?

01:52:51.480 --> 01:52:54.840
 No, you're suppressing the aldosterone. So it

01:52:54.840 --> 01:52:57.600
 Gets the water out of you

01:52:57.600 --> 01:53:02.280
 the one of the ways sodium works is

01:53:02.280 --> 01:53:05.520
 the albumin molecule is

01:53:05.520 --> 01:53:09.800
 full of negative charges and it holds

01:53:09.800 --> 01:53:13.240
 the sodium

01:53:13.400 --> 01:53:16.480
 In in association so you get a cloud of

01:53:16.480 --> 01:53:22.840
 positive negative charges which holds on the water it

01:53:22.840 --> 01:53:25.280
 keeps the

01:53:25.280 --> 01:53:27.280
 water osmotically

01:53:27.280 --> 01:53:29.800
 held in in your bloodstream

01:53:29.800 --> 01:53:35.840
 If you're low in either albumin or sodium

01:53:35.840 --> 01:53:37.880
 your

01:53:37.880 --> 01:53:39.480
 blood itself

01:53:39.480 --> 01:53:41.480
 loses the osmotic

01:53:42.040 --> 01:53:46.160
 quality and the water stays in your cells and

01:53:46.160 --> 01:53:48.800
 extravascular spaces

01:53:48.800 --> 01:53:53.720
 When the combination of albumin and sodium is present in the blood

01:53:53.720 --> 01:53:55.480
 water

01:53:55.480 --> 01:54:01.920
 flows out of the tissues into the blood and the blood passing through the kidneys then

01:54:01.920 --> 01:54:10.120
 can get rid of the water that otherwise would sit around in your tissues and

01:54:11.800 --> 01:54:13.800
 that same situation

01:54:13.800 --> 01:54:18.600
 Impairs circulation because your blood volume is low and the fluid volume

01:54:18.600 --> 01:54:22.680
 Outside the blood vessels is is too high. Oh, I see, right

01:54:22.680 --> 01:54:25.640
 and the the anti-diuretic

01:54:25.640 --> 01:54:33.680
 hormone is a another side of this that is a lot more complicated than and responds to

01:54:33.680 --> 01:54:36.000
 distress

01:54:36.000 --> 01:54:43.720
 Estrogen and and a lot of other things where the aldosterone is is pretty closely related to the mineral balance

01:54:43.720 --> 01:54:49.840
 And what is the anti-diuretic hormone? Is that what are you calling? What is that?

01:54:49.840 --> 01:54:52.400
 It's a pituitary

01:54:52.400 --> 01:54:53.640
 hormone

01:54:53.640 --> 01:54:56.200
 that causes water retention

01:54:56.200 --> 01:54:59.160
 with sodium loss

01:54:59.160 --> 01:55:01.680
 and a

01:55:01.680 --> 01:55:03.680
 low thyroid person

01:55:03.680 --> 01:55:05.880
 old people

01:55:06.240 --> 01:55:08.240
 people after accidents

01:55:08.240 --> 01:55:10.800
 anyone in serious stress

01:55:10.800 --> 01:55:17.040
 The they call it inappropriate secretion of anti-diuretic hormone

01:55:17.040 --> 01:55:21.200
 syndrome and that's very common where

01:55:21.200 --> 01:55:24.280
 edema is the

01:55:24.280 --> 01:55:33.080
 What what is really harmful the brain swells up for example, because the body has too much water and not enough salt

01:55:33.080 --> 01:55:35.480
 and

01:55:35.480 --> 01:55:37.480
 the remedy for that

01:55:37.480 --> 01:55:40.360
 is

01:55:40.360 --> 01:55:42.560
 Just adding sodium but

01:55:42.560 --> 01:55:48.280
 That's not fundamental and if you do it too fast, you disturb the balance in the different compartments

01:55:48.280 --> 01:55:52.920
 but the basic reason for it is that you aren't producing the

01:55:52.920 --> 01:55:57.200
 carbon dioxide from a thyroid deficiency and

01:55:57.200 --> 01:56:00.080
 the absence of the

01:56:00.080 --> 01:56:03.760
 high production of carbon dioxide means that you aren't able to

01:56:04.680 --> 01:56:09.320
 retain the sodium in your kidneys as as the water passes through

01:56:09.320 --> 01:56:14.680
 and so the low thyroid person loses sodium because the

01:56:14.680 --> 01:56:18.480
 Reverse of the process that

01:56:18.480 --> 01:56:21.800
 happens in other cells in the kidneys

01:56:21.800 --> 01:56:25.320
 carbon dioxide allows the cells to

01:56:25.320 --> 01:56:28.240
 catch and retain sodium

01:56:28.240 --> 01:56:31.840
 Well, that's fascinating and

01:56:33.360 --> 01:56:39.000
 Can't say I get it all but I understand it a little bit that's that's very interesting Ray. Thanks for

01:56:39.000 --> 01:56:46.280
 explaining all that and I had more questions, but I didn't have any more from other people I think I got I got to them all and

01:56:46.280 --> 01:56:49.400
 anything you want to say to

01:56:49.400 --> 01:56:51.520
 sum up about

01:56:51.520 --> 01:56:57.400
 Staying healthy and keeping your oxidation working. Well, we have about two minutes. Oh

01:56:59.200 --> 01:57:03.480
 Just keeping stress down and the fun up

01:57:03.480 --> 01:57:07.520
 Judging food by

01:57:07.520 --> 01:57:15.320
 Largely by how it tastes rather than by what the experts say. Okay. Well, that's easy advice to follow

01:57:15.320 --> 01:57:21.640
 so on that note Ray, I really want to thank you for coming on these last two shows and

01:57:21.640 --> 01:57:27.920
 And I'll tell people how to get in touch with your website if they want to read more

01:57:28.320 --> 01:57:30.320
 Then I'll say goodbye

01:57:30.320 --> 01:57:34.040
 Okay. All right. You thank you so much. Thank you so much, Ray

01:57:34.040 --> 01:57:36.880
 Yep, bye