1 00:00:03,277 --> 00:00:03,338 you 2 00:00:22,990 --> 00:00:27,651 Welcome to the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we review superhero films and debate 3 00:00:27,671 --> 00:00:32,914 the superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing their characters in stat-based battle simulations. 4 00:00:33,414 --> 00:00:38,796 I'm Johnny DC. And I'm his twin brother, Marvelous Joe. And in this episode, we will be reviewing 5 00:00:39,016 --> 00:00:46,339 the newly released film in theaters, Venom, Let There Be Carnage. And uh, you know, it 6 00:00:46,359 --> 00:00:53,026 was, it was dumb. It was not great. It was definitely at least not better than the first movie. but 7 00:00:53,066 --> 00:00:56,867 we'll give you our full thoughts about the film later on this episode. Before that, we're going 8 00:00:56,887 --> 00:01:00,349 to break down the comic book movie news to have come out in the past week. Yeah, there's no 9 00:01:00,429 --> 00:01:05,171 DC news this time. I think they're saving all of that for the upcoming DC fandom later this 10 00:01:05,231 --> 00:01:09,613 month. So we're going to have to settle for Marvel scraps, including Disney settling Scarlett 11 00:01:09,633 --> 00:01:15,235 Johansson's lawsuits over Black Widow and The Eternals gets an updated synopsis. As always, 12 00:01:15,255 --> 00:01:19,177 we list our segment times in our episode description, so feel free to check out the show notes if 13 00:01:19,197 --> 00:01:22,974 you want to skip ahead to a particular topic. If you guys have been listening to the show 14 00:01:22,994 --> 00:01:27,235 for a while, you know that only our most recent four episodes are available to the listening 15 00:01:27,275 --> 00:01:32,076 public. Everything else is only available through subscription. So if you guys want access to 16 00:01:32,116 --> 00:01:37,698 over 200 episodes of archived content, including our Captain America Civil War review, our ScarCrow 17 00:01:37,718 --> 00:01:43,599 vs. Mysterio duel, our Venom review, our Penguin vs. Kingpin duel, our Spider-Man No Way Home 18 00:01:43,619 --> 00:01:49,921 review, or our Mr. Freeze vs. Dr. Octopus duel, be sure to subscribe to this podcast on Spotify 19 00:01:50,201 --> 00:01:55,136 or Patreon. both of which will provide you with an RSS feed to use in your own podcast app. 20 00:01:55,476 --> 00:02:00,640 But on Patreon, you also get bonus content, including bonus episodes, access to our Discord 21 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:06,384 server, blooper reels, and more. It's only $2 a month to subscribe on Spotify or Patreon, 22 00:02:06,684 --> 00:02:12,048 and you could do so by visiting dynamicduel.com slash subscribe, which is linked in our show 23 00:02:12,068 --> 00:02:18,272 notes. We want to give a huge shout out to our newest patron, Levi Yeaton, who is also our 24 00:02:18,352 --> 00:02:24,191 newest executive producer of the show. So Levi, be sure to flaunt that shit. You officially 25 00:02:24,271 --> 00:02:28,493 helped Jonathan and I in our monthly executive producer meetings, determine the content for 26 00:02:28,533 --> 00:02:32,415 this show, including duels and reviews. Although we haven't determined too many reviews lately 27 00:02:32,435 --> 00:02:36,797 because there's so much new stuff coming down the pike. No, but welcome aboard, Levi. It's 28 00:02:36,817 --> 00:02:43,240 going to be a lot of fun. But with that out of the way, quick to the no prize. A no prize 29 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:47,590 is an award Marvel used to give out up until the 90s to fans. Our version, the Dynamic Duel 30 00:02:47,630 --> 00:02:52,693 No Prize, is a digital award we post on social media that Jonathan personally draws for those 31 00:02:52,713 --> 00:02:57,916 who we feel gave the best answer to our question of the week. Last week's question was a doozy. 32 00:02:58,376 --> 00:03:03,419 We asked you guys off the back of the Injustice trailer, should Batman have killed the Joker 33 00:03:03,519 --> 00:03:09,142 in the comics? Why or why not? And we got a whole ton of great answers here. A lot of people 34 00:03:09,202 --> 00:03:13,624 on both sides of the coin. It was really hard to pick just three honorable mentions and the 35 00:03:13,664 --> 00:03:17,398 winner. So we want to thank everyone who answered. but let's go ahead and run down our honorable 36 00:03:17,438 --> 00:03:23,380 mentions. Our first honorable mention goes to DC Joe, who said, Batman should have definitely 37 00:03:23,420 --> 00:03:28,882 killed the Joker after maybe the first or second one, like when he thinks he'll be reformed, 38 00:03:29,382 --> 00:03:32,783 that's understandable, but after that, it's just a pattern that he's not willing to see. 39 00:03:33,483 --> 00:03:39,265 And honestly, that makes him an accomplice. Yeah, kill him. Either that or, I don't know, 40 00:03:39,325 --> 00:03:44,211 extradite him to a state that has a death penalty. That's what I'm saying. You know, how often 41 00:03:44,231 --> 00:03:50,195 has the Joker shown to be incapable of rehabilitation? You know, every time the Joker escapes from 42 00:03:50,255 --> 00:03:54,258 Arkham Asylum, because he's always going to fucking do that shit, Batman has blood on his 43 00:03:54,318 --> 00:03:59,822 hands for always taking him back to that minimum security nuthouse and letting Joker escape 44 00:03:59,962 --> 00:04:05,826 and kill more people. It's on Batman. He's an accomplice to this mass murderer. To say Batman 45 00:04:05,846 --> 00:04:11,630 is an accomplice is very, very unfair, I feel like. He's trying to stop the Joker. And to 46 00:04:11,650 --> 00:04:16,891 say that the Joker is beyond rehabilitation, I also don't think that's fair. We don't know 47 00:04:16,971 --> 00:04:21,132 if the Joker is going to kill again. I mean, he's insane, which also means you can't kill 48 00:04:21,172 --> 00:04:26,013 the guy. He's not responsible in a way for his own actions. We just need to help him control 49 00:04:26,033 --> 00:04:31,295 those. You say that you're unsure as to whether or not the Joker will kill again? I will literally 50 00:04:31,335 --> 00:04:38,097 place every cent I own on a wager that he will in the comic books. Our next honorable mention 51 00:04:38,137 --> 00:04:46,740 goes to Mike Croft, who said, and Batman definitely should not kill the Joker because anyone who 52 00:04:46,780 --> 00:04:52,182 knows the injustice storyline sees what happens to Superman after he decides to cross that 53 00:04:52,222 --> 00:04:59,005 line and the last thing we need is a Batman who goes on murder sprees. Yeah and injustice 54 00:04:59,025 --> 00:05:03,367 was a perfect example for why heroes should not be killing because once a hero makes that 55 00:05:03,407 --> 00:05:08,389 exception for their rule of not killing then why not just kill any villain? That's so stupid. 56 00:05:08,429 --> 00:05:13,455 Why not just become a complete authoritarian? That shit is so black and white, it's ridiculous. 57 00:05:13,495 --> 00:05:18,498 DC really needs to get over this black and white shit, which is another reason why I think Batman 58 00:05:18,518 --> 00:05:22,960 should kill the Joker, to show that there actually are shades of gray in the world. Just because 59 00:05:22,980 --> 00:05:26,702 you make an exception for one mass murderer doesn't mean you need to make an exception 60 00:05:26,742 --> 00:05:30,524 for everyone who ever commits a crime ever. Like if you need to be that black and white, 61 00:05:30,725 --> 00:05:35,707 then set a limit. Once you kill 100 people, guess what? Your ass gets killed by Batman, 62 00:05:35,727 --> 00:05:40,362 okay? And we all know the Joker has killed well more than 100 people, so just do that. if you're 63 00:05:40,382 --> 00:05:43,804 incapable of making decisions that aren't like- No, because then it's gonna be like, oh, well 64 00:05:43,824 --> 00:05:47,827 wouldn't it be better if I just like limit that to like, if they kill 50 people? That'll make 65 00:05:47,867 --> 00:05:52,450 my life a lot easier, right? That's not how it works. Why? It's a shade of gray, why not? 66 00:05:52,890 --> 00:05:58,014 Okay. All I know is that Captain America will put a fool down and do so with good judgment. 67 00:05:58,434 --> 00:06:03,178 Next honorable mention goes to Michael Haggerty, who says- Hi guys, Michael Haggerty here. Uh, 68 00:06:03,198 --> 00:06:11,986 I'm gonna say yes, he should, but, um, not for like any other reason. than to see what Batman 69 00:06:12,067 --> 00:06:16,709 is without Joker? Because we've seen what happens to Joker when there's no Batman in the case 70 00:06:16,749 --> 00:06:22,591 of The Dark Knight Returns. So what happens to the Batman then if there is no Joker, if 71 00:06:22,631 --> 00:06:27,773 there's no that opposite side of the coin? Does he make his focus on more of a different supervillain? 72 00:06:28,718 --> 00:06:33,819 I 100% agree with this answer. I think this is a fantastic answer. Do it for nothing less 73 00:06:33,979 --> 00:06:39,380 than the story. It would be so great to see what happens to Batman, the fallout, the consequences 74 00:06:39,601 --> 00:06:44,142 of his actions if he chooses in fact to kill the Joker, because it's not something that's 75 00:06:44,222 --> 00:06:48,643 ever been done in the comics. And if you're like really concerned about a Batman universe 76 00:06:48,663 --> 00:06:52,604 without the Joker, guess what? It's comic books. They could bring the Joker back as villains, 77 00:06:52,744 --> 00:06:57,846 always come back. So just do it for the story. Well, I was going to say like we've seen what 78 00:06:57,886 --> 00:07:02,729 Batman is like with the Joker dead. The Joker has died in a few like elseworld tales, like 79 00:07:02,749 --> 00:07:08,173 the Dark Knight Returns. You know Batman kept being Batman and in justice Batman kept being 80 00:07:08,233 --> 00:07:12,936 Batman. There's always new threats for him to face. There's always new crime. So I don't 81 00:07:12,976 --> 00:07:17,960 think he would ever stop being Batman just because the Joker was dead. But in terms of seeing 82 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:22,403 what would happen to Bruce Wayne if he killed Joker, we've seen that as well in the Batman 83 00:07:22,423 --> 00:07:27,835 Who Laughs. It breaks him. It breaks Bruce Wayne. You know, Batman killing the Joker is what 84 00:07:27,855 --> 00:07:32,798 the Joker has always wanted. Because he knows that Batman has such a staunch moral code, 85 00:07:33,078 --> 00:07:38,322 that if he violated that, it would destroy him mentally. And basically turn him into the Joker. 86 00:07:38,762 --> 00:07:44,726 What a freaking loser. What? You don't call Batman a loser? Are you saying that his moral 87 00:07:44,746 --> 00:07:50,170 code is so fucking rigid, that he can't violate it once without falling apart at the seams? 88 00:07:50,370 --> 00:07:55,846 That's ridiculous. That's a strong man. People are like, Batman has this moral code. and he's 89 00:07:55,866 --> 00:08:01,271 like a role model to kids and stuff like that. And I'm like, what kid out there is not killing 90 00:08:01,311 --> 00:08:06,176 people just because Batman doesn't kill people? He's not a moral figure. Oh, me. He's a freaking 91 00:08:06,236 --> 00:08:09,920 fictional character. I don't know, we'll see when the time comes, you know? But if kids 92 00:08:09,940 --> 00:08:11,801 start killing people, that shit's on you, dude. 93 00:08:14,990 --> 00:08:19,192 That's all of our honorable mentions. We want to give a big thank you to Brandon Estregard, 94 00:08:19,553 --> 00:08:26,657 Frank, Dustin Balkam, Tyson Lee, Michael Harreld, Evan Tomke, Markey High, and Corey Wooten for 95 00:08:26,697 --> 00:08:32,521 giving such fantastic answers. But the winner of this week's No Prize is... Meggy Mathengian 96 00:08:32,822 --> 00:08:37,044 who said, Hey guys, it's me and I don't think Batman should kill the Joker because all life 97 00:08:37,084 --> 00:08:42,048 is sacred and everybody has a chance for redemption, even someone as evil as him. I get the utilitarian 98 00:08:42,068 --> 00:08:45,835 point of view, but I don't think that justifies killing. there's a better way to stop evil. 99 00:08:46,355 --> 00:08:50,579 I think if one focuses on developing good character instead of the consequences of their action, 100 00:08:50,979 --> 00:08:54,622 then the right choices will naturally follow. I think Bruce is morally sound enough that 101 00:08:54,642 --> 00:08:59,006 he's doing the right thing. You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become 102 00:08:59,046 --> 00:09:04,871 the villain. What an act line for this whole debate. Batman should not become the villain. 103 00:09:05,292 --> 00:09:11,037 Batman should not stoop to the level of villainy by murdering people. Everyone sees the Joker 104 00:09:11,077 --> 00:09:15,183 as a murderer. You should just be seeing him as a human because that's what he is. When 105 00:09:15,203 --> 00:09:20,945 you dehumanize your enemy, then there's no limits to what atrocities you yourself could commit 106 00:09:21,005 --> 00:09:26,368 against them. We're not dehumanizing him. He has dehumanized himself through his own actions 107 00:09:26,468 --> 00:09:32,350 against his fellow man. Which one of us is not capable of committing atrocities? Me, I'm not. 108 00:09:32,470 --> 00:09:36,972 We all make it do that shit. Not that shit. You could do other shit that's bad, right? 109 00:09:37,272 --> 00:09:41,706 So like, who are you to cast the first stone? Oh, I could cast a stone against the Joker 110 00:09:41,886 --> 00:09:46,597 given that I've never killed anybody. Yet, that we know of. What? 111 00:09:49,790 --> 00:09:54,572 Mickey was talking about how there's always a better way to defeat evil. Why hasn't Batman 112 00:09:54,612 --> 00:09:58,814 found that way? Why does he keep doing the dumb thing of putting Joker back in Arkham Asylum 113 00:09:58,934 --> 00:10:04,858 over and over again when it proves to be ineffective? Is that not the definition of insanity? Batman 114 00:10:04,978 --> 00:10:09,440 is a little bit insane, but also I think the important note here is that the Joker is quite 115 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:15,583 possibly smarter than Batman or freaking anyone else in Gotham. He finds a way to escape despite 116 00:10:15,623 --> 00:10:19,958 their best efforts. And if you think Batman isn't trying to keep him in there, You are 117 00:10:19,998 --> 00:10:24,823 wrong, my friend. Arkham Asylum is a piece of shit facility. It's like falling down. What? 118 00:10:24,983 --> 00:10:29,068 Like freaking throw Joker in the Phantom Zone or something like that. That's basically worse 119 00:10:29,108 --> 00:10:37,117 than death. Good. Alright. That's the perfect compromise then, right? Something worse than 120 00:10:37,157 --> 00:10:42,261 death, but he's still alive. So there's no murdering, but he's still forever trapped in a hell of 121 00:10:42,281 --> 00:10:47,385 his own making. I think that's the way to go. Did you not see what happened in Lego Batman? 122 00:10:47,585 --> 00:10:52,870 Joker went into the Phantom Zone and got fucking Voldemort and Sauron and King Kong. That's 123 00:10:52,930 --> 00:10:57,513 fucking Lego Batman. That's what would happen. That's stupid. That's what would happen. Congrats 124 00:10:57,613 --> 00:11:01,597 once again to Miggie. You win this week's No Prize if you the listener want a shot at winning 125 00:11:01,637 --> 00:11:05,993 your own No Prize. Stay tuned to later on in this episode when we will be asking another 126 00:11:06,133 --> 00:11:09,677 question of the week. And now that that's done, on to the news! 127 00:11:15,298 --> 00:11:20,141 Alright, as we reported a few months ago, I think back in July, I believe end of July, 128 00:11:20,482 --> 00:11:26,066 we learned that Scarlett Johansson filed a lawsuit against Disney regarding her earnings for the 129 00:11:26,086 --> 00:11:31,110 Black Widow movie. Basically, her contract stipulated that the film would only be released in theaters 130 00:11:31,491 --> 00:11:36,214 and then Disney released it day and date on the Disney Plus streaming app alongside theaters. 131 00:11:36,575 --> 00:11:40,878 And she wasn't happy about that because her salary was in part determined by the overall 132 00:11:40,898 --> 00:11:45,502 theatrical box office of the film. And since Black Widow didn't earn as much. in theaters 133 00:11:45,542 --> 00:11:49,924 because of the streaming release. She was trying to get what she felt was owed her. Yeah, she 134 00:11:49,944 --> 00:11:55,227 was trying to get some Disney Plus money. Yeah. Now, back then, Jonathan and I kind of speculated 135 00:11:55,647 --> 00:12:00,110 that this whole thing might turn into a giant paradigm shift where like Disney Plus and all 136 00:12:00,150 --> 00:12:04,352 the other streaming services are going to have to reveal their data to the public and how 137 00:12:04,392 --> 00:12:08,214 that might affect the productions that they put out there and how much they pay talent. 138 00:12:08,615 --> 00:12:13,377 But all that speculation was largely moot due to the news this past week that Disney has 139 00:12:13,457 --> 00:12:18,432 settled. with Scarlett Johansson. We're not sure about the numbers, but it's no less than 140 00:12:18,492 --> 00:12:23,775 40 million, according to reports. And this sucks, honestly, I think, because I was really hoping 141 00:12:23,795 --> 00:12:27,717 that we were gonna go the distance and really get those numbers. But, you know, that's a 142 00:12:27,857 --> 00:12:32,720 huge can of worms that I don't think any of the streaming platforms are ready to put out 143 00:12:32,740 --> 00:12:37,703 there. So Disney really had no choice but to settle. And you know, there's precedent for 144 00:12:37,763 --> 00:12:43,774 it. We know that HBO Max avoided potential lawsuits like this by paying out. the talent for films 145 00:12:43,815 --> 00:12:48,418 like Wonder Woman 1984 and other movies. Yeah, and the same thing with Emma Stone and Disney 146 00:12:48,458 --> 00:12:53,763 for Cruella. Right. So basically it was kind of a case of greed on both sides. The thing 147 00:12:53,883 --> 00:12:59,848 is that Disney has so much more money as a corporation than Scarlett Johansson. So, you know, Scarlett 148 00:12:59,868 --> 00:13:04,131 was considered the underdog in this whole affair, especially considering some of the dickhead 149 00:13:04,171 --> 00:13:08,775 comments that Disney made, like calling her callous for bringing this up during like a 150 00:13:08,815 --> 00:13:13,122 pandemic, and revealing her salary that she got for the film. You know, yeah, that was 151 00:13:13,202 --> 00:13:18,207 lame. They created a PR nightmare for themselves where they had really no choice once the hearing 152 00:13:18,247 --> 00:13:22,570 started, but to try to, you know, pay this away. Yeah. They were probably literally like, how 153 00:13:22,610 --> 00:13:28,035 much is going to cost to make this all disappear? Scarlett. But you know, despite all the shit 154 00:13:28,055 --> 00:13:32,398 talking that was going on, mostly on Disney side, it seems like everybody's cordial with 155 00:13:32,418 --> 00:13:36,001 each other now. You know, Scarlett Johansson is talking about how great it is to work for 156 00:13:36,062 --> 00:13:40,105 Disney and Disney's talking about how great it is to have Scarlett Johansson as part of 157 00:13:40,125 --> 00:13:44,863 their talent. Right. She's going to end up making a Tower of Terror with them still. Yeah. Which 158 00:13:44,883 --> 00:13:48,185 was surprising to me. I didn't think that was going to happen. Yeah. And maybe we'll even 159 00:13:48,225 --> 00:13:53,507 get future appearances from her in the MCU. If they ever decide to bring her back, you 160 00:13:53,527 --> 00:13:56,888 know, maybe for a Black Widow 2 or something like that, they can find a way to do that, 161 00:13:56,928 --> 00:14:01,650 especially with the reveal of the multiverse within the MCU. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. In 162 00:14:01,690 --> 00:14:06,573 other Marvel news, we got an updated synopsis for Eternals, which is coming out in just a 163 00:14:06,633 --> 00:14:11,171 month, which is super soon. You know, we already got the final trailer that was released a few 164 00:14:11,191 --> 00:14:16,075 weeks ago, and it looks like Marvel is trying to keep the marketing train going by revealing 165 00:14:16,095 --> 00:14:19,877 a little bit more information about the movie, since it seems like people still have a lot 166 00:14:19,917 --> 00:14:24,220 of questions about it. Yeah, it's a huge mystery still, I think. Part of that mystery has been 167 00:14:24,260 --> 00:14:29,844 revealed with this new description, which reads, The Eternals takes place across two time periods. 168 00:14:30,245 --> 00:14:34,928 One storyline is set in the past when they operated as a formidable team and a close family unit. 169 00:14:35,308 --> 00:14:39,751 The second storyline is in the present. when the group is fractured and split apart, can 170 00:14:39,811 --> 00:14:44,874 tend to live among humans hiding in plain sight. The prevailing threat of the Deviants, which 171 00:14:44,974 --> 00:14:49,937 once again threatens the existence of mankind, means the Eternals need to put their differences 172 00:14:49,977 --> 00:14:55,600 aside and regroup. So basically it's gonna be a story of superhero family drama. Where they 173 00:14:55,620 --> 00:15:00,063 were once close, something split them all apart to leave their separate lives and now they're 174 00:15:00,083 --> 00:15:05,250 gonna have to reconcile to face this new Deviant threat with the approaching Celestials. This 175 00:15:05,290 --> 00:15:09,572 synopsis was a huge surprise to me. I thought the film would probably show kind of what happened 176 00:15:09,592 --> 00:15:14,395 in the past, just in flashback, just to set the story up with the majority of the story 177 00:15:14,495 --> 00:15:18,278 sort of happening in modern day, but it kind of sounds like they're going to be swapping 178 00:15:18,438 --> 00:15:22,821 between present and the past throughout the movie, which is really interesting. Yeah. I've 179 00:15:22,861 --> 00:15:27,364 always been a big fan of nonlinear narratives. I think there's a lot of opportunity to get 180 00:15:27,424 --> 00:15:32,623 creative when you don't tell a story in chronological order. In addition to this new synopsis, Marvel 181 00:15:32,703 --> 00:15:37,987 also released a new TV spot called Protect, which featured a lot of new footage from the 182 00:15:38,007 --> 00:15:42,671 movie. It was about 30 seconds long, but we got some really cool action beats here, including 183 00:15:42,711 --> 00:15:48,396 seeing Angelina Jolie's, Thena in action. We see more of Icarus's eye beams. We also got 184 00:15:48,416 --> 00:15:53,220 to look at a new deviant monster that we hadn't seen before. It looks kind of like a flying 185 00:15:53,380 --> 00:15:57,824 squid kind of thing. A lot of tentacles. It's really crazy. The designs on these deviants 186 00:15:57,844 --> 00:16:01,679 are just out of this world, but not actually. because they were actually created here. It 187 00:16:01,739 --> 00:16:05,922 is a delicate balance between revealing enough to the public so that they're enticed to see 188 00:16:05,942 --> 00:16:10,785 the film, but not revealing so much so that they feel like they have a good idea of what 189 00:16:10,825 --> 00:16:15,829 the plot line is overall. Marvel has definitely given away too much in their trailers before, 190 00:16:16,069 --> 00:16:20,672 like with that man and the Wasp, but they definitely didn't give too much away with like the Avengers 191 00:16:20,772 --> 00:16:25,355 endgame campaign. Right. And I think the Eternals campaign is kind of following the latter's 192 00:16:25,395 --> 00:16:29,612 approach. Yeah, yeah, it seems that way. But speaking of the Eternals, That brings us to 193 00:16:29,632 --> 00:16:30,595 our question of the week. 194 00:16:35,042 --> 00:16:40,904 Who is your favorite Marvel or DC character created or partially created by Jack Kirby 195 00:16:41,144 --> 00:16:46,466 and why? Yeah, Jack King Kirby was a big time creator during the Golden Age and Silver Age 196 00:16:46,506 --> 00:16:51,088 of comics. He created so many of the characters that we know and love from Marvel and DC. The 197 00:16:51,148 --> 00:16:55,290 Eternals being some of those characters that he created. So we'd like to hear your thoughts 198 00:16:55,370 --> 00:17:00,892 on his work by telling us your favorite character. Record your answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking 199 00:17:00,932 --> 00:17:04,674 on the red microphone button in the bottom right hand corner. which will prompt you to leave 200 00:17:04,714 --> 00:17:08,917 us a voicemail. Your message could be up to 30 seconds long, and don't forget to leave 201 00:17:08,937 --> 00:17:13,300 your name in case we include you on the podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and draw that 202 00:17:13,360 --> 00:17:18,704 person a dynamic do-or-no prize that we'll post to social media. Be sure to answer before October 203 00:17:18,764 --> 00:17:24,508 9th. And we're excited to bring you guys a new sponsor for this show. Yeah, HBO Max. They 204 00:17:24,548 --> 00:17:28,991 want us to tell you guys about the new Batman podcast they have out called Batman The Audio 205 00:17:29,011 --> 00:17:35,530 Adventures. Bruce Wayne may appear to be a wealthy playboy. But beneath his facade, his true identity 206 00:17:35,831 --> 00:17:41,913 is that of the Batman, waging an endless war against crime. Join the Caped Crusader in Batman, 207 00:17:42,113 --> 00:17:47,415 The Audio Adventures, the first scripted audio original featuring Batman and his villainous 208 00:17:47,455 --> 00:17:54,018 rogues gallery in a world premiere story of life and death in Gotham City, debuting exclusively 209 00:17:54,318 --> 00:17:59,701 on HBO Max. 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And now let's go ahead and get into 216 00:18:38,394 --> 00:18:43,100 our main event where we review the latest Marvel and Sony film to have hit theaters, Venom, 217 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:44,301 Let There Be Carnage. 218 00:18:59,594 --> 00:19:05,716 Alright Venom Let There Be Carnage was directed by Andy Serkis and stars Tom Hardy, Woody Harrelson, 219 00:19:05,776 --> 00:19:11,199 Michelle Williams, Naomi Harris, and Stephen Graham. Now if you have not watched the movie, 220 00:19:11,419 --> 00:19:16,982 this will be a spoiler review as all of our reviews are, so if you're interested in possibly 221 00:19:17,082 --> 00:19:21,824 seeing this film, I would suggest not listening further because we will give away the entire 222 00:19:21,864 --> 00:19:27,355 plot of the movie in our discussion of it. That being said... I don't necessarily recommend 223 00:19:27,435 --> 00:19:31,818 this film. If you are a fan of the original, it's likely that you'll have more of an appreciation 224 00:19:32,178 --> 00:19:37,462 of the sequel. But if you didn't care for 2018's Venom movie, I would just say give this one 225 00:19:37,482 --> 00:19:41,485 a skip or wait until it's on streaming. Yeah, I mean, I didn't really care about the first 226 00:19:41,545 --> 00:19:45,868 Venom movie. I thought it was kind of a step back for the genre actually. And I feel the 227 00:19:45,888 --> 00:19:49,970 same way about this film. It's like a step back from a step back, you know, I would have much 228 00:19:50,010 --> 00:19:55,230 preferred to have not seen this in theaters. To me, this is totally a streaming film. Unfortunately, 229 00:19:55,290 --> 00:20:00,032 Sony doesn't have their own streaming platform upon which they could have released this. So 230 00:20:00,072 --> 00:20:04,154 we were all kind of forced to see it in the theater. And it's doing really well, actually. 231 00:20:04,494 --> 00:20:10,017 Yeah, it's actually broken this year's three day opening weekend record, beating out Black 232 00:20:10,077 --> 00:20:16,140 Widow by about 10 million dollars. So regardless of what we say about this film, the franchise 233 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:21,331 is definitely going to continue because it is so popular. I think a franchise continuing 234 00:20:21,371 --> 00:20:25,514 is always a good thing because whether or not the previous movie was garbage, there's at 235 00:20:25,554 --> 00:20:31,578 least a chance to improve there. The first Vandom movie came out in 2018. We gave that film 3.5 236 00:20:31,999 --> 00:20:37,263 stars saying it had its problems but overall we found it entertaining. And while there was 237 00:20:37,343 --> 00:20:41,686 little to praise about that film other than Tom Hardy's performance and the serviceable 238 00:20:41,806 --> 00:20:46,529 action, I still felt like the first film did a decent job of establishing the franchise. 239 00:20:46,826 --> 00:20:51,147 And I still feel that way. I rewatched the first movie right before seeing Let There Be Carnage, 240 00:20:51,528 --> 00:20:56,170 and I'm really glad I did because not only is it a fun movie, but seeing the sequel immediately 241 00:20:56,330 --> 00:21:02,112 after just made it so very clear to me that the sequel really leans into what made the 242 00:21:02,192 --> 00:21:07,935 first movie merely mediocre and just doubled down on that. Venom, Let There Be Carnage is 243 00:21:08,015 --> 00:21:14,017 not a disaster by any means, but it lacks an interesting plot. It's borderline goofy at 244 00:21:14,077 --> 00:21:18,601 times. It doesn't have a whole lot of characterization outside of the main protagonist. It failed 245 00:21:18,641 --> 00:21:24,446 to do the source material justice, definitely. And really it's just too short of a film. Yeah, 246 00:21:24,486 --> 00:21:28,589 I cannot believe how short this film was. Like when it ended, I was like, what? We're like 247 00:21:28,609 --> 00:21:32,372 already at the close of the third act. What the hell happened? Yeah, the movie is just 248 00:21:32,552 --> 00:21:37,616 over 90 minutes, like an hour and a half. But it also doesn't feel like the studio left a 249 00:21:37,676 --> 00:21:41,560 lot on the cutting room floor. You know, it just feels like they didn't have enough story 250 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:46,911 to tell basically. Exactly. Yeah, totally. And surprisingly, it was Tom Hardy that wrote the 251 00:21:46,931 --> 00:21:53,354 script alongside Kelly Marcel. What? I did not know that. Yeah. Wow. I would have expected 252 00:21:53,554 --> 00:21:58,056 much more of an effort from him, I guess. Yeah, me too. I was going to go into this sort of 253 00:21:58,096 --> 00:22:02,819 blaming the studio, saying, you know, once again, it's a studio not respecting their characters, 254 00:22:03,059 --> 00:22:06,961 not knowing enough about their characters. But it's kind of hard to say that now knowing that 255 00:22:07,001 --> 00:22:11,900 Tom Hardy was the writer. Yeah, I don't know if he's written previous efforts before, but 256 00:22:12,120 --> 00:22:17,024 I'll definitely say he did a better job of acting in this film than writing it. Because the story 257 00:22:17,084 --> 00:22:22,069 is mostly a series of character building moments for Eddie and Venom, with the plot's driving 258 00:22:22,189 --> 00:22:27,993 elements revolving around Cletus gaining the symbiote and attempting to kill the hero. It's 259 00:22:28,054 --> 00:22:33,018 not a complex story, like the prime conflict for the protagonist is basically this tug of 260 00:22:33,038 --> 00:22:38,078 war of whether or not he should be a crime fighter, which is never interesting to see. and the 261 00:22:38,118 --> 00:22:43,021 fact that Carnage is the driving force is disappointing since they really dropped the ball in terms 262 00:22:43,041 --> 00:22:49,006 of developing Cletus Kasady. By the time the film ends and Cletus dies, I honestly felt 263 00:22:49,046 --> 00:22:53,649 like I barely even knew the character. There was so much wasted potential in regards to 264 00:22:53,689 --> 00:22:58,873 Carnage who, if you listened to our last episode, had so much more background to pull from. The 265 00:22:58,913 --> 00:23:04,377 film could and should have explored the origin of these alien Klintar symbiotes and their 266 00:23:04,397 --> 00:23:08,899 means of reproduction. They definitely, I think, had the space to do that in this movie. We 267 00:23:08,919 --> 00:23:13,641 should have also witnessed the relationship between Cletus and Carnage and how it compared 268 00:23:13,721 --> 00:23:17,743 to any of Venom. I don't think we got nearly enough of that. We also didn't get enough of 269 00:23:17,763 --> 00:23:21,364 the relationship between Venom and Carnage. You know, in the comics, it's established that 270 00:23:21,404 --> 00:23:26,747 there's an innate antagonism that Clint are have among their kin, but we didn't get any 271 00:23:26,807 --> 00:23:31,569 explanation of that here. Yeah, you're right. Like, I have no idea how Carnage even came 272 00:23:31,609 --> 00:23:36,231 about. Like, if anyone bites Eddie. Are they gonna get like a new carnage symbiote in them? 273 00:23:36,471 --> 00:23:41,093 Like, they didn't get to the reproduction aspect at all. They could have totally made this a 274 00:23:41,213 --> 00:23:46,295 normal runtime film just by adding those essential bits. Ultimately, I think one of the biggest 275 00:23:46,315 --> 00:23:51,177 disappointments was that we should have been truly afraid of Cletus Kasady, you know, who's 276 00:23:51,237 --> 00:23:56,819 not just a serial killer, but in fact a mass murderer. And yeah, this film is PG-13 and 277 00:23:56,839 --> 00:24:00,721 it has to stay that way because eventually it's gonna be folded into the Spider-Man franchise. 278 00:24:01,181 --> 00:24:06,011 I get that. But there are ways to portray a character of that dangerous and disturbing 279 00:24:06,051 --> 00:24:11,132 nature that don't need explicit violence. Yeah. Just have it happen like in the dark or like 280 00:24:11,232 --> 00:24:15,733 off frame. Just like, show some blood splatter or something like that. Right. Yeah. I mean, 281 00:24:15,853 --> 00:24:19,775 look at characters like Heath Ledger's Joker, you know, the dark night was a PG-13 movie 282 00:24:19,815 --> 00:24:24,856 and he was horrifying. Yeah. Look at other PG-13 films like the ring and what you can get away 283 00:24:24,876 --> 00:24:30,670 with there of a horrific nature, you know, the PG-13 rating does have some leeway. and this 284 00:24:30,690 --> 00:24:35,853 film just didn't capitalize on it, which they needed to do, I think, for a character like 285 00:24:35,953 --> 00:24:41,036 Carnage. They just left him as kind of bland overall, really. Like, I don't get the movie's 286 00:24:41,076 --> 00:24:46,279 choice to turn Cletus into this lovesick clown, as opposed to this scary figure, because he 287 00:24:46,319 --> 00:24:51,382 enjoys killing. That's what makes him scary. That's what I didn't get from this film. There 288 00:24:51,402 --> 00:24:56,544 are so many times during this movie when I was watching this, just expecting Carnage to just 289 00:24:56,564 --> 00:25:01,937 like kill anyone he came across. Instead, we got Woody Harrelson in a weird haircut. So 290 00:25:01,957 --> 00:25:07,542 bizarre. Yeah, Carnage is sometimes described as being as violent and insane as the Joker. 291 00:25:08,102 --> 00:25:13,387 And I don't understand why the filmmakers wouldn't have taken Joaquin Phoenix or what Heath Ledger 292 00:25:13,407 --> 00:25:18,532 did with the Joker as inspiration. Woody Harrelson is every bit the actor as Heath Ledger and 293 00:25:18,572 --> 00:25:23,776 Joaquin Phoenix. And that's so disappointing that they didn't do more with him. The movie 294 00:25:23,816 --> 00:25:28,452 was, frankly, cheesy at times when it came to the villains and some of the side characters, 295 00:25:28,772 --> 00:25:33,715 even the Eddie and Venom dynamic. What made the first film interesting is that they really 296 00:25:33,775 --> 00:25:39,358 towed the line with the humor. Like it presented Venom not just as an amusing creature, but 297 00:25:39,438 --> 00:25:44,081 a dangerous one. Like when he told Eddie to rip off these guys' heads and pile the bodies 298 00:25:44,101 --> 00:25:50,265 and heads in the corner of the room, it was like, what? That's hilarious and scary. You 299 00:25:50,285 --> 00:25:55,275 know? The first movie balanced really well the amount of jokes we were willing to tolerate 300 00:25:55,335 --> 00:26:00,958 from a threatening monster villain. But in this sequel, Venom was pretty much a teddy bear. 301 00:26:01,038 --> 00:26:05,880 You know, he was totally non-threatening, almost always being played for laughs. I think they 302 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:10,622 leaned way too heavily on the humor, probably thinking that's what audiences loved the most 303 00:26:10,662 --> 00:26:15,224 about the first film. Yeah, he freaking went to a rave and everyone thought he just was 304 00:26:15,244 --> 00:26:19,530 like the coolest guy there. I was like, shouldn't he be like trying to eat everyone? Shouldn't 305 00:26:19,550 --> 00:26:25,274 they be horrified by him? Yeah, totally. Venom should be threatening and scary. First and 306 00:26:25,314 --> 00:26:30,859 foremost, with only like the occasional hint of whimsy as a means of subversion and interest, 307 00:26:31,579 --> 00:26:37,684 never ever in my whole life have I ever wanted to see Venom flip pancakes while singing or 308 00:26:37,724 --> 00:26:44,010 wear glow sticks at a rave. He's almost a parody of himself in this movie. Make him scary first, 309 00:26:44,390 --> 00:26:49,718 jokes later, if at all. Yeah, for every like turds in the wind kind of joke. we should definitely 310 00:26:49,738 --> 00:26:55,619 be seeing like a decapitation or two. Right, exactly, like the first movie. Beyond the story 311 00:26:55,639 --> 00:27:00,701 and the humor, I didn't feel this sequel brought anything new to the table visually that the 312 00:27:00,741 --> 00:27:05,782 original film didn't have. I thought the end fight with Carnage was not necessarily better 313 00:27:05,822 --> 00:27:09,963 than the end fight with Riot. They were actually kind of similar, but I found the fight with 314 00:27:10,003 --> 00:27:15,285 Carnage to be even more of a confusing CGI fest. There were just like so many tentacles flying 315 00:27:15,305 --> 00:27:18,894 all over the place. The action was a little bit undiscernible. And I thought Carnage was 316 00:27:18,914 --> 00:27:23,197 gonna use his powers in all kinds of cool ways because Venom was like, oh shit That's a red 317 00:27:23,357 --> 00:27:27,901 one But really he didn't get too creative with his powers the movie should have explained 318 00:27:27,981 --> 00:27:33,805 what a red one actually meant Exactly and why he was red why there was an apparent lack of 319 00:27:33,845 --> 00:27:38,208 symbiosis between Carnage and Cletus Because it didn't look that way to me like the way 320 00:27:38,268 --> 00:27:43,692 Cletus would visually Morph into carnage as opposed to being covered up by him like how 321 00:27:43,732 --> 00:27:49,116 Eddie is covered up by venom, right? The transformation seemed to imply that Cletus and Carnage had 322 00:27:49,236 --> 00:27:54,980 a more cellular level of bonding, like in the comics. But then the film contradicts its visual 323 00:27:55,100 --> 00:28:00,143 cues with dialogue about how Cletus and Carnage were less connected, which felt wrong to me 324 00:28:00,163 --> 00:28:04,186 because Cletus and Carnage in the comics are essentially one and the same. Yeah, yeah, it 325 00:28:04,206 --> 00:28:09,430 seemed that way based on our last episode compared to what I learned in our Venom vs. Clayface 326 00:28:09,470 --> 00:28:15,206 episode. Like Eddie, Brock, and Venom are separate entities, where Cletus Kasady is Carnage. So 327 00:28:15,226 --> 00:28:19,228 they kind of dropped the ball there. But with all that negativity aside, I know I probably 328 00:28:19,268 --> 00:28:23,190 sound disappointed in this movie because I kind of was. But Jonathan, tell me something good 329 00:28:23,230 --> 00:28:27,732 about this film. What did you like about this movie? Let's get some positivity in here. It 330 00:28:27,792 --> 00:28:34,476 is a good popcorn film in that its merits are pretty much solely based on entertainment and 331 00:28:34,496 --> 00:28:41,059 just having a fun, good time. I did legit laugh a number of times at the jokes and just the 332 00:28:41,079 --> 00:28:45,702 character of Venom. Yeah, I'll say this movie is funnier than the first one. Yeah, I think 333 00:28:45,742 --> 00:28:50,065 I could guarantee that you will be smiling in the theater if you see it there. You know, 334 00:28:50,225 --> 00:28:55,108 everyone harps on how Venom should not be comedic, and I actually agree with them. That didn't 335 00:28:55,188 --> 00:28:59,590 stop me from laughing, though. If Tom Hardy wrote some of these jokes, Tom Hardy is a funny 336 00:28:59,610 --> 00:29:03,853 guy. Let's go ahead and talk about that in our character breakdown. You know, Eddie Brock 337 00:29:03,993 --> 00:29:09,036 and Venom were both played by Tom Hardy. I think he gave a great performance here, as he usually 338 00:29:09,096 --> 00:29:13,783 does. Tom Hardy is just a brilliant actor. And I think he's this film saving grace, much like 339 00:29:13,823 --> 00:29:18,645 how he was the best thing about the first film. But I'll say again that it is hard to watch 340 00:29:18,745 --> 00:29:24,388 a movie where the primary conflict for the hero is whether or not he wants to be a hero. You 341 00:29:24,408 --> 00:29:29,371 know, we kind of touched upon that for our Luke Cage season one review. Like, we know these 342 00:29:29,411 --> 00:29:35,174 characters as being someone who will fight crime. And when it takes like two movies to get the 343 00:29:35,194 --> 00:29:39,697 character to that point, it can get a little bit exhausting. Oh, totally. Yeah, absolutely. 344 00:29:39,797 --> 00:29:44,272 This whole film, I was just like... Listen to Venom, dude. Be that lethal protector. Yeah, 345 00:29:44,332 --> 00:29:48,035 well, I mean, that's where we thought his character was at the end of the first movie, you know, 346 00:29:48,095 --> 00:29:53,358 because at the end he ended up killing the convenience store robber who's threatening Mrs. Chen. I 347 00:29:53,378 --> 00:29:57,241 thought he was going to start off this movie at that point, but it seems like his character 348 00:29:57,281 --> 00:30:01,424 backslid a little bit where he was still a little bit uncertain as to what his purpose was with 349 00:30:01,464 --> 00:30:05,267 the symbiote. And that should have been something that like maybe even Carnage played upon. I 350 00:30:05,287 --> 00:30:09,166 mean, like, you know, you're getting mad at me for killing people, but look at you. Are 351 00:30:09,206 --> 00:30:12,808 you a hypocrite? Oh yeah, they totally could have done that. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. That 352 00:30:12,828 --> 00:30:17,931 would have been a great arc for him to justify to himself why he is the better man, so to 353 00:30:17,971 --> 00:30:23,194 speak, despite the fact that he's an anti-hero. It writes itself, man. I guess the better man 354 00:30:23,234 --> 00:30:27,517 is not a good of phrase as the lesser of two evils, which is what venom is supposed to be, 355 00:30:27,777 --> 00:30:32,416 absolutely. At the end of this movie, we see Eddie Brock come to the same realization that 356 00:30:32,457 --> 00:30:36,840 he learned at the end of the first movie, which is kind of accepting his circumstances as being 357 00:30:36,900 --> 00:30:42,345 bonded to this creature and, you know, ready to set out and fight bad guys. Venom also had 358 00:30:42,385 --> 00:30:46,348 an arc here, although it was a little bit strange, you know, like at the rave, he was talking 359 00:30:46,388 --> 00:30:50,892 about alien rights and stuff. It seemed like he wanted to be respected more than anything 360 00:30:50,952 --> 00:30:55,876 else. The whole film was kind of like an odd couple tale between Eddie Brock and Venom. 361 00:30:56,196 --> 00:30:59,919 Like it was almost like they were in a relationship. And this was the story of their breakup and 362 00:30:59,939 --> 00:31:03,821 how they got back together and learned to like respect one each other and accept that they're 363 00:31:03,881 --> 00:31:09,705 right for each other. Yeah, and that is an interesting primary conflict. Too bad that the whole thing 364 00:31:09,825 --> 00:31:15,308 just got resolved with a mere apology. It was basically Venom saying, you got to apologize 365 00:31:15,408 --> 00:31:19,811 and then Eddie apologizing and then them being cool with the whole central conflict of their 366 00:31:19,851 --> 00:31:24,293 story here, you know. Yeah, it was all kind of played for laughs. There was no grand gesture. 367 00:31:24,654 --> 00:31:30,377 There was no moment of cathartic realization or anything like that is just very unsatisfying. 368 00:31:30,837 --> 00:31:35,339 And now that you mentioned it, like what was to stop Venom from going out and fighting crime 369 00:31:35,399 --> 00:31:39,261 and eating people in those other bodies? Like why didn't he do it then? Like why did he even 370 00:31:39,281 --> 00:31:43,704 need to go to Mrs. Chen for chocolate? Why wasn't he eating people right off the bat? That's 371 00:31:43,724 --> 00:31:48,146 a good question. We do know that those other bodies that he was in weren't sustainable because 372 00:31:48,166 --> 00:31:51,408 like as the first movie explained, it's kind of like an organ transplant kind of thing. 373 00:31:51,528 --> 00:31:56,558 The symbiote has to be a match with the host. So He may not have been able to sustain himself 374 00:31:56,678 --> 00:32:00,919 being attached to those hosts despite eating other people. That's the only reason I could 375 00:32:00,939 --> 00:32:07,061 give. Hmm. Let's move on to Cletus Kasady and Carnage, both played by Woody Harrelson. A 376 00:32:07,081 --> 00:32:10,582 lot of people may not know that Woody Harrelson also provided the voice for Carnage in this 377 00:32:10,642 --> 00:32:16,144 film. I myself thought the voice was a little bit too deep, and I don't know if I'm just 378 00:32:16,184 --> 00:32:20,905 being conditioned by the Spider-Man animated television series, but in that show, his voice 379 00:32:20,925 --> 00:32:25,766 was a lot more like... high pitched and layered a little bit, you know, frightening. But as 380 00:32:25,786 --> 00:32:31,128 far as Woody Harrelson's Cletus Kasady, I think he did as well as he could have. On paper, 381 00:32:31,428 --> 00:32:36,969 it should have been perfect. But the problem, I think, was what was actually on paper. There's 382 00:32:37,009 --> 00:32:40,771 only so much for him to work with based off of the script that he was given. He seemed 383 00:32:40,831 --> 00:32:45,832 so much less unhinged here than he did in the after credit scene for the first Venom film. 384 00:32:46,072 --> 00:32:49,993 There, like his performance was wild and like his eyes were like popping out of his head 385 00:32:50,013 --> 00:32:55,135 and everything. And here he was just kind of normal guy, you know? It was really weird toward 386 00:32:55,155 --> 00:32:59,856 the end of the film when Cletus was explaining to Eddie how he was like so alone as a child 387 00:32:59,916 --> 00:33:03,878 just wanting to be loved and how right before he died he was like I just wanted to be your 388 00:33:03,918 --> 00:33:10,200 friend basically. It seemed like they were trying to rationalize his horribly evil behavior and 389 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:15,030 while that's you know an interesting approach to take with a lot of villains, I don't think 390 00:33:15,050 --> 00:33:18,915 that's the right approach to take with Cletus Kasady because he's freaking one of the most 391 00:33:19,175 --> 00:33:24,401 evil villains out there. You don't humanize him. You make him an evil force of nature like 392 00:33:24,441 --> 00:33:31,128 the Joker. His is the sort of evil that needs no rhyme or reason. It just is because he is 393 00:33:31,168 --> 00:33:36,770 chaos incarnate. Because some men just want to watch the world burn. Exactly. It was kind 394 00:33:36,810 --> 00:33:41,332 of cool in this movie, probably one of the more interesting scenes of the film when they delve 395 00:33:41,472 --> 00:33:47,735 into Cletus's backstory via the use of animation. It was kind of an interesting way to circumvent 396 00:33:47,815 --> 00:33:51,676 showing a lot of the violence of his past. Oh, yeah. Yeah, if they would have filmed that 397 00:33:51,696 --> 00:33:55,038 with like a real kid, that would have gotten real dark. I'm sure Disney would have been 398 00:33:55,058 --> 00:34:00,020 like, no, we don't want venom in our film. Right, right. But that animation was the most character 399 00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,770 development that we got for Cletus. And ultimately, I don't think it was enough. Let's move on 400 00:34:04,790 --> 00:34:12,274 to Cletus's girlfriend, Frances Bereson, AKA Shriek, who is played by Naomi Harris. What 401 00:34:12,314 --> 00:34:19,599 the fuck was this character? She was so bad. Like Naomi Harris is a decent enough actress. 402 00:34:19,639 --> 00:34:24,121 I like her in a lot of the stuff I've seen, but sometimes she makes these really weird 403 00:34:24,181 --> 00:34:30,765 character decisions that play off so bad. She did not need to be in the movie. Like you mentioned 404 00:34:30,805 --> 00:34:37,300 earlier, The whole thing with Cletus needing like a love story angle was completely unnecessary. 405 00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:42,382 It's like they only had her here because they needed somebody who would be able to destroy 406 00:34:42,422 --> 00:34:46,504 both of the symbiotes, who had a power set of that nature. Yeah, I mean I was thinking about 407 00:34:46,544 --> 00:34:50,786 that the whole time I was watching the movie. Like, this is like the worst character to have 408 00:34:51,026 --> 00:34:55,608 Carnage fall in love with, even though I know it's a precedent in the comics, because she 409 00:34:55,668 --> 00:35:00,482 is his weakness. It's like Superman falling in love with a Kryptonite woman. and then getting 410 00:35:00,542 --> 00:35:05,466 pissed at her for being made out of kryptonite. It's weird. Yeah, yeah. But in terms of the 411 00:35:05,506 --> 00:35:11,590 performance, like Naomi Harris was very inconsistent. At times she had this like weird girly cartoony 412 00:35:11,610 --> 00:35:17,374 voice. It was strange. I don't understand what her motivations were, like why she was so hell 413 00:35:17,394 --> 00:35:21,878 bent on causing destruction. I don't get why she like all of a sudden had a change of heart 414 00:35:21,898 --> 00:35:26,341 at the very end. And I was like, no, Carnage, she's doing too much, blah, blah. That was 415 00:35:26,401 --> 00:35:31,265 stupid. Like she just got done killing the guy that she wanted to kill, allegedly killing, 416 00:35:31,325 --> 00:35:35,769 you know, Detective Patrick Mulligan. And then only afterward she was like, this is too much. 417 00:35:35,809 --> 00:35:40,213 And it's like, what are you talking about? Like you knew this was all part of the plan. Like, 418 00:35:40,333 --> 00:35:44,596 you know, Shriek, Carnage and Cletus, they were all set out to get their revenge. If I wrote 419 00:35:44,616 --> 00:35:49,861 this film, Shriek would not be in it. Cletus would have escaped from his execution and just 420 00:35:49,961 --> 00:35:55,205 gone on a killing spree. And that was the film. Like Venom had to stop this killing spree. 421 00:35:55,634 --> 00:35:59,840 Yeah, and he would have had to have been a little bit more creative in how he did that, considering 422 00:35:59,860 --> 00:36:03,865 that they didn't have, you know, a built-in failsafe with the shriek character. Who didn't 423 00:36:03,905 --> 00:36:08,091 see that coming a mile away? Everybody fucking saw that. I also just want to point out that 424 00:36:08,131 --> 00:36:16,194 the worst line of this movie was when she was like, peeps tried. Botched it. Ugh. Let's move 425 00:36:16,254 --> 00:36:20,997 on to Anne Wayne, who was played by Michelle Williams. Kind of like the first movie, she 426 00:36:21,197 --> 00:36:25,079 was really just a supplemental character. She didn't have too much bearing, except for the 427 00:36:25,099 --> 00:36:29,081 cool moments where she got to don the symbiote again. I really liked that they brought She-Venom 428 00:36:29,121 --> 00:36:33,584 back, if only for a little bit, because I really liked her appearance in the first movie. And 429 00:36:33,644 --> 00:36:38,967 I like that Anne likes being Venom. Anne she still likes Eddie Brock, it seems, even though 430 00:36:38,987 --> 00:36:44,210 she can't handle his continual lying. I'm really glad that the movie chose not. to pair those 431 00:36:44,230 --> 00:36:48,531 two up together in the endo and keep Dan around because I just don't think it would fit the 432 00:36:48,551 --> 00:36:52,673 characters for them to end up back together. And I like Dr. Dan. It was nice that they gave 433 00:36:52,713 --> 00:36:57,155 him a little heroic moment here in the final battle where he was pouring fire on the symbiotes. 434 00:36:57,635 --> 00:37:00,656 Yeah, I kind of get the feeling that this is probably the last time we'll end up seeing 435 00:37:00,676 --> 00:37:05,338 those two characters in the franchise, maybe, but I think you've kind of done all you can 436 00:37:05,358 --> 00:37:10,320 with them anyway, so. Yeah, yeah, I agree. The last character that I want to talk about is 437 00:37:10,420 --> 00:37:15,722 Steven Graham, who played Detective Patrick Mulligan. He was generic cop, big deal, but 438 00:37:15,762 --> 00:37:20,985 every time he was on screen, I kept waiting for hints toward Toxin. Because in the comics, 439 00:37:21,025 --> 00:37:27,047 he becomes Toxin. Wait, what? Yeah, Toxin is Carnage's offspring. He's more powerful than 440 00:37:27,087 --> 00:37:31,989 Carnage and Venom combined. He has like these poison claws. He's an okay character, but he 441 00:37:32,029 --> 00:37:36,491 ends up bonding to Detective Patrick Mulligan. They didn't do anything with him until the 442 00:37:36,571 --> 00:37:41,733 very end of the movie, but it was so confusing how they went about it. Because like Shriek 443 00:37:41,873 --> 00:37:46,388 killed him. Essentially or almost killed him it like she tied this chain around his neck 444 00:37:46,608 --> 00:37:50,031 I thought she was gonna hang him, but she ended up just like throwing him backward It was really 445 00:37:50,071 --> 00:37:55,134 bizarre and it turned out he didn't die and he has glowing eyes why he has glowing guys 446 00:37:55,514 --> 00:37:59,957 Absolutely no idea because toxin himself doesn't have glowing guys You know he looks like carnage 447 00:37:59,997 --> 00:38:05,261 on his top half and venom on his bottom half I gotta say if he's the villain in another 448 00:38:05,381 --> 00:38:10,945 venom movie I'm not looking forward to that at all like venom going up against another 449 00:38:11,005 --> 00:38:17,783 symbiote and like one who's played by an actor as mediocre as this guy. I totally agree. It's 450 00:38:17,803 --> 00:38:22,645 like, oh, that's gonna sell tickets. Yeah. Considering we've got Riot in the first film and Carnage 451 00:38:22,665 --> 00:38:26,946 in the second film, let's see something new for the next film. Like maybe they go down 452 00:38:27,066 --> 00:38:31,227 the route of Null and we finally get the history on these alien symbiotes and things like that. 453 00:38:31,407 --> 00:38:35,068 That might be cool. And with that story, you could even bring Carnage back and maybe do 454 00:38:35,088 --> 00:38:39,469 him justice this time. But definitely not Toxin. I don't think he's a strong enough character 455 00:38:39,629 --> 00:38:43,635 for a third film. But let's go ahead and break down the story highlights. So the film starts 456 00:38:43,695 --> 00:38:49,797 off in 1996. We see a young Cletus Kasady fall in love with Frances Bereson at the St. Estes 457 00:38:50,077 --> 00:38:55,159 home for unwanted children. She is a mutant with a sonic scream who's taken to a special 458 00:38:55,179 --> 00:39:01,382 holding facility at the Ravencroft Institute. The whole mention of mutation was really surprising 459 00:39:01,402 --> 00:39:06,704 to me. This was like the first time we've heard anything about mutation since the X-Men films. 460 00:39:07,044 --> 00:39:13,540 Yeah, and I have kind of mixed feelings about this. On one hand, it is exciting to see that 461 00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:18,204 they may be working toward mutants within the multiverse or whatever. On the other hand, 462 00:39:18,364 --> 00:39:23,809 I really hate that she will be the introduction to mutants, because Shriek in this movie just 463 00:39:23,869 --> 00:39:30,034 sucked. They're her peeps! They botched it! I would have preferred if the introduction 464 00:39:30,074 --> 00:39:35,158 to mutants was just more impressive, I guess. So en route to the Institute, Shriek nearly 465 00:39:35,218 --> 00:39:40,678 kills Patrick Mulligan, who was an officer helping facilitate the transfer. He shoots Shriek in 466 00:39:40,698 --> 00:39:46,139 the eye and he believes he killed her, but she's successfully transferred in secret. Which kind 467 00:39:46,159 --> 00:39:50,901 of confused me later on in the movie. I'm wondering why they kept her incarceration at Ravencroft 468 00:39:50,921 --> 00:39:56,422 a secret, even to local authorities. Was it just like a government, like secret experiment 469 00:39:56,802 --> 00:40:00,724 center? And maybe that's why it was off the books. Like they were trying to keep mutation 470 00:40:00,744 --> 00:40:04,105 a secret. That's the only thing I could come up with. It would have been nice if they kind 471 00:40:04,125 --> 00:40:09,390 of like explained that though. Back to the story in the present. Detective Mulligan asks Eddie 472 00:40:09,410 --> 00:40:14,932 to speak with the serial killer Cletus Kasady to potentially get more info on his past murders. 473 00:40:15,432 --> 00:40:21,313 Cletus gives Eddie some kind of vague poem for some reason, and Venom memorizes Cletus's cell 474 00:40:21,333 --> 00:40:26,135 drawings and deduces the location of several missing bodies from the killer's past. Why 475 00:40:26,155 --> 00:40:31,616 do you think Cletus had such a draw to Eddie Brock? Like, was it just because he was a former 476 00:40:31,676 --> 00:40:36,177 TV personality? I still don't understand why Cletus saw Eddie Brock as like a family member. 477 00:40:36,758 --> 00:40:41,920 I don't know. He just kind of saw him as a kindred spirit, I guess. Maybe he had some kind of 478 00:40:42,020 --> 00:40:46,982 inclination that there was something darker lurking within Eddie. Not quite sure. I'm also 479 00:40:47,102 --> 00:40:52,945 not sure what the purpose of Cletus's poem was, considering that, like, I don't think he knew 480 00:40:53,085 --> 00:40:56,727 where Sheik was being held or that she would have access to, like, newspapers or something 481 00:40:56,747 --> 00:41:01,449 like that. So- Or that she was even still alive. Right. So basically it was Cletus just wanting 482 00:41:01,469 --> 00:41:06,236 to play games with Eddie. And then Venom kind of seeing through that and cutting to the chase 483 00:41:06,456 --> 00:41:11,881 with where the bodies were hidden. That was a cool scene when Venom was having Eddie draw 484 00:41:12,041 --> 00:41:16,785 out everything that was on the cell walls from Cletus' cell. I thought that was like a super 485 00:41:16,825 --> 00:41:20,808 cool power. I would love to have like a superpower like that. I thought it was cool when he put 486 00:41:20,848 --> 00:41:25,432 the Sharpies away and then he started drawing on the page with his own strands, kind of. 487 00:41:25,932 --> 00:41:30,416 If anything, Eddie Brock can give up his career as a journalist and just sell drawings all 488 00:41:30,436 --> 00:41:34,887 day since Venom is so artistic and talented. Apparently revealing the location of these 489 00:41:34,927 --> 00:41:40,372 bodies and getting Cletus sentenced to the death penalty gave Eddie's career a huge boost But 490 00:41:40,392 --> 00:41:44,955 we never really saw how that manifested right? It's not like you got a show back or anything 491 00:41:44,995 --> 00:41:48,759 like that, you know, right? Yeah, he wasn't speaking to his old colleagues back in New 492 00:41:48,779 --> 00:41:52,942 York or something like that, which would have been cool So Cletus receives the death penalty 493 00:41:53,082 --> 00:41:59,607 and berates Eddie for his actions Venom lashes out and attacks Cletus in a cell who bites 494 00:41:59,708 --> 00:42:04,362 Eddie's hand ingesting part of the symbiote Eddie meets up with Anne who tells him she's 495 00:42:04,382 --> 00:42:10,584 getting engaged to Dr. Dan Lewis. I'm really wondering if Venom did reproduce like he did 496 00:42:10,604 --> 00:42:15,285 in the comics at the moment that Cletus bit Eddie's hand, or if the movie was treating 497 00:42:15,325 --> 00:42:20,127 it more like a piece of venom that just kind of gained its own autonomy. I guess there's 498 00:42:20,167 --> 00:42:24,548 no real difference between that and the way that symbiotes reproduce since it's asexual, 499 00:42:24,648 --> 00:42:28,449 but I wonder if there was any confusion among the general public as to why this piece of 500 00:42:28,469 --> 00:42:33,620 venom would turn evil. I mean, I'm still wondering that, like, why would Carnage, his offspring, 501 00:42:33,700 --> 00:42:39,483 want to kill Venom? They never explained that. I guess for the film, you'd have to claim that 502 00:42:39,663 --> 00:42:46,206 Cletus's own hatred of Eddie kind of manipulated Carnage into being evil or something. The Carnage 503 00:42:46,246 --> 00:42:51,389 symbiote stops the lethal injection from entering Cletus's body and transforms him into Carnage. 504 00:42:51,789 --> 00:42:56,072 He escapes, killing all the guards and freeing the prisoners. I thought this was actually 505 00:42:56,092 --> 00:43:01,947 the best scene in the movie. I liked how Carnage manifested. during the execution process. I 506 00:43:01,987 --> 00:43:06,549 think that was done better here than in the comics even. And that escape scene when he's 507 00:43:06,589 --> 00:43:11,472 just like terrorizing the entire cell block, that was impressive. I was like, holy shit, 508 00:43:11,552 --> 00:43:16,215 it's freaking Carnage. I thought the way he killed that one security guard with the tongue 509 00:43:16,315 --> 00:43:22,218 choking thing was the most creative and disturbing kill by Carnage. Like all of those prisoners 510 00:43:22,258 --> 00:43:27,321 that he walked past in that prison should have all been like massacred. Yeah, I'm not sure 511 00:43:27,341 --> 00:43:32,431 why he freed the prisoners. And really the film doesn't address the mass prison breakout at 512 00:43:32,511 --> 00:43:36,152 all, you know? But I'm not sure why Carnage didn't kill them, considering that's probably 513 00:43:36,172 --> 00:43:39,673 what he would have done. They should have at least addressed what happened with the prisoners. 514 00:43:40,153 --> 00:43:44,494 Eddie and Venom end up having a falling out, since Eddie doesn't want to eat bad guys, and 515 00:43:44,554 --> 00:43:49,876 Venom leaves Eddie's body. Eddie learns about Cletus' escape and investigates Cletus' past 516 00:43:50,096 --> 00:43:55,586 at St. Estes. He calls Mulligan to tip him off to the Shriek connection. Meanwhile, Venom 517 00:43:55,666 --> 00:44:01,388 goes to a rave and appreciates being around people he calls weirdos. I felt like the whole 518 00:44:01,428 --> 00:44:06,129 rave scene could have just been cut from the movie. You know, he could have been going around, 519 00:44:06,169 --> 00:44:09,910 traveling around, and then ended up at Mrs. Chen's place. And the film would have been 520 00:44:10,050 --> 00:44:14,251 probably the exact same. If not better, because we wouldn't have had to have seen Venom look 521 00:44:14,271 --> 00:44:19,513 like a joke with all the glow sticks. Yeah, save that time for like some more carnage character 522 00:44:19,533 --> 00:44:25,332 development or something. Yeah. Cletus and Carnage rescue Shriek from Ravencroft, which I thought 523 00:44:25,352 --> 00:44:30,315 was a pretty cool scene too, and the pair destroy a group of police who come to stop them. Yeah, 524 00:44:30,335 --> 00:44:34,799 I did think it was cool that like, Carnage just appeared in the cell when that like, doctor 525 00:44:34,819 --> 00:44:38,842 lady was being a jerk to Shriek. Yeah, and the fight they had against the cops was pretty 526 00:44:38,882 --> 00:44:42,905 impressive. This was the first time that we see Shriek use her powers in Carnage's presence, 527 00:44:42,945 --> 00:44:47,168 and he gets like really pissed off at her. And at that point, everyone's wondering like, why 528 00:44:47,208 --> 00:44:51,482 Carnage would even bother assisting Cletus in rescuing her. Together, Shriek, Cletus, and 529 00:44:51,502 --> 00:44:56,643 Carnage burn down the old St. Estes home. Eddie is taken into the police station for questioning 530 00:44:56,743 --> 00:45:01,705 and he calls Anne as his lawyer. He tells her the situation and she finds venom with Mrs. 531 00:45:01,765 --> 00:45:08,827 Chen, which I thought was pretty funny, like when Mrs. Chen had the venom face. She dons 532 00:45:08,847 --> 00:45:13,768 the symbiote herself and uses it to break Eddie out of jail and the pair are reunited and make 533 00:45:13,808 --> 00:45:19,699 amends. Detective Mulligan stumbles across Cletus who kidnaps him. for Shriek who was seeking 534 00:45:19,759 --> 00:45:24,883 revenge against the detective for shooting out her eye all those years ago. In turn, Shriek 535 00:45:24,943 --> 00:45:30,008 kidnaps Anne and Dan calls Eddie to tell him that she's been taken to a cathedral where 536 00:45:30,048 --> 00:45:34,912 Cletus and Shriek plan to get married. The whole marriage thing was a little weird. Eddie arrives 537 00:45:34,932 --> 00:45:40,017 at the cathedral and Shriek tries to kill Venom using her powers. Carnage threatens to kill 538 00:45:40,057 --> 00:45:45,441 her if she uses them again. And Venom fights Carnage while Shriek apparently kills Mulligan. 539 00:45:46,038 --> 00:45:50,782 I liked how during the Carnage-Venom fight they did establish that Carnage was physically stronger 540 00:45:50,942 --> 00:45:55,846 than Venom considering he was able to tear down that wall on top of Venom and Venom was unable 541 00:45:55,906 --> 00:46:01,451 to push the wall off of himself. Shriek ends up claiming that Carnage is going too far and 542 00:46:01,491 --> 00:46:06,295 Carnage tries to kill her and she falls from the cathedral roof, letting loose a scream 543 00:46:06,355 --> 00:46:10,859 that separates the symbiotes from their hosts and destroys the cathedral spire. 544 00:46:14,122 --> 00:46:19,526 manages to save Eddie by cushioning his impact. Cletus was not so fortunate, and Venom devours 545 00:46:19,566 --> 00:46:24,291 the carnage symbiote. Cletus claims he only wanted to be Eddie's friend before getting 546 00:46:24,331 --> 00:46:29,215 his own head bitten off. Yeah, Venom was like, fuck this guy. Yeah, I mean, I don't know how 547 00:46:29,235 --> 00:46:34,320 I felt about that. Like, it was funny, but like, whatever emotional impact the film was going 548 00:46:34,380 --> 00:46:39,124 for, with Cletus telling Eddie he just wanted to be his friend, they totally negated all 549 00:46:39,144 --> 00:46:43,019 of that with the fuck this guy joke. So it seemed just unnecessary. They shouldn't have tried 550 00:46:43,039 --> 00:46:47,921 to humanize Cletus to begin with. I also really didn't care for the fact that Venom killed 551 00:46:48,061 --> 00:46:53,224 Cletus. Like I think he should have gotten locked up again, personally. You could always bring 552 00:46:53,244 --> 00:46:57,567 Cletus back by saying that remnants of the Carnage symbiote are still in his bloodstream and that 553 00:46:57,607 --> 00:47:02,609 it gives him a regenerative healing factor, just like in the comics. Okay, sure. Eddie 554 00:47:02,649 --> 00:47:07,512 says goodbye to Anne and Dan accepting their relationship, and he and Venom travel to a 555 00:47:07,572 --> 00:47:13,331 tropical location as fugitives from the law. to start over as the lethal protector. How 556 00:47:13,351 --> 00:47:17,473 were they fugitives from the law though? Because of the police station escape that they did 557 00:47:17,553 --> 00:47:22,535 earlier. So it's now a matter of public record, basically, that monsters exist and that Eddie 558 00:47:22,575 --> 00:47:27,077 is one of them. But Eddie wasn't a monster when they escaped. That was like Ann's fault. I 559 00:47:27,117 --> 00:47:31,740 mean, don't tell that to me, man. Tell that to the writers of the film. It's a huge plot 560 00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:36,590 hole. Like I did not get it. I did not understand what was going on in the theater. Yeah, I mean, 561 00:47:36,610 --> 00:47:41,052 you could totally say that Eddie had deniability, like he was just kidnapped by this monster 562 00:47:41,092 --> 00:47:44,595 or something. And, you know, they didn't know it was Anne. Like she, Venom, doesn't look 563 00:47:44,615 --> 00:47:49,878 like Anne, so she has deniability too. There is the loose thread of Detective Mulligan possibly 564 00:47:49,918 --> 00:47:53,320 being alive that they would have to contend with, because if he is alive, then he knows 565 00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:57,662 everything and Venom really would be a fugitive. But it's really not clear what's going on with 566 00:47:57,722 --> 00:48:02,465 Detective Mulligan, so. The film ends with Venom and Eddie in the tropics in the mid-credits 567 00:48:02,485 --> 00:48:08,036 scene. They're watching a telenovela as Venom hints at his alien races knowledge of the universe. 568 00:48:08,617 --> 00:48:12,699 Suddenly, they're transported to an apparent alternate dimension or at least a different 569 00:48:12,739 --> 00:48:19,303 location where they see Spider-Man's true identity as Peter Parker revealed. Venom licks the screen. 570 00:48:19,803 --> 00:48:25,066 I'm not sure if this moment where he changes dimensions is a result of the Loki television 571 00:48:25,086 --> 00:48:29,749 show or if it's going to be a result of the Spider-Man No Way Home movie during Doctor 572 00:48:29,769 --> 00:48:34,459 Strange's spell. Perhaps the two events coincide simultaneously, but we don't know that yet. 573 00:48:34,919 --> 00:48:39,782 Yeah, that would have made like the ending events of Far From Home and Venom 2 and Loki kind 574 00:48:39,842 --> 00:48:44,404 of all happen at the same time maybe. Right, yeah, like right around the same time. Did 575 00:48:44,444 --> 00:48:50,166 it seem like Venom was infatuated with Spider-Man? Well, yeah, clearly. I don't know why. Yeah, 576 00:48:50,246 --> 00:48:56,789 why? I wonder if it'll lead to Venom and Eddie traveling to meet Spider-Man just so the symbiote 577 00:48:56,809 --> 00:49:00,640 could be passed. Yeah, I'm guessing that Venom will probably make an appearance in the end 578 00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:04,783 credits of No Way Home to transfer the symbiote. Oh, you think he's going to show up in the 579 00:49:04,863 --> 00:49:09,547 end credits and not the actual movie as one of the villains of No Way Home? Uh, I don't 580 00:49:09,567 --> 00:49:13,710 think so. I don't know why. A lot of people are speculating that Venom is going to be one 581 00:49:13,730 --> 00:49:17,613 of the main villains of that film, which I think would be pretty cool to get Tom Hardy in that 582 00:49:17,653 --> 00:49:22,717 movie, too. But we'll see. If they're planning on getting the most out of the Venom-Spider-Man 583 00:49:22,757 --> 00:49:27,261 relationship, I think they should definitely save Venom as an after credits teaser for No 584 00:49:27,281 --> 00:49:32,009 Way Home. That way they can both like, I guess, team up in a movie down the line. Yeah, I agree. 585 00:49:32,089 --> 00:49:36,413 I don't think you need Venom just yet. You know, save their relationship for another Spider-Man 586 00:49:36,453 --> 00:49:42,619 film down the line. Or Venom 3. Yeah, exactly. But that's the whole movie. Overall, I think 587 00:49:42,759 --> 00:49:49,465 that the film was written and directed by actors who should probably stick to acting. Oh, damn. 588 00:49:49,785 --> 00:49:54,862 Andy Serkis. I love him so much as an actor from like Gollum and Lord of the Rings. to 589 00:49:54,922 --> 00:50:00,464 Caesar in the Planet of the Apes films, to Ulysses Klaw in Black Panther. He's so brilliant and 590 00:50:00,504 --> 00:50:05,666 brings so much to his performances, whereas I felt he brought relatively little to his 591 00:50:05,706 --> 00:50:10,829 direction of this film. I don't think that Tom Hardy wrote a great script. That is to say 592 00:50:10,869 --> 00:50:15,771 the film is not a complete disaster. I did enjoy it only at the base level for Tom Hardy and 593 00:50:15,811 --> 00:50:21,273 Brandon's quirky relationship, and some of the action is entertaining, particularly that carnage 594 00:50:21,313 --> 00:50:26,495 prison escape. But it's full of questionable things from plot points to acting choices, 595 00:50:26,855 --> 00:50:31,357 and I wish it was a better film. You know, I've been looking forward to seeing Venom and Carnage 596 00:50:31,538 --> 00:50:36,720 fight in a live action film against each other ever since I was a kid. And this was not quite 597 00:50:36,740 --> 00:50:41,202 the movie that I was hoping for ultimately. I am interested in seeing where Venom goes 598 00:50:41,242 --> 00:50:45,584 regarding Spider-Man, and I just really hope that the Venom monster is not such a clown 599 00:50:45,764 --> 00:50:50,990 in his next appearance. I kinda got the feeling that the filmmakers really, really wanted to 600 00:50:51,130 --> 00:50:55,994 sell the end credits stinger, like if people so worked up about how cool that was that they 601 00:50:56,074 --> 00:51:02,758 may forget how mediocre the movie itself was as a whole. I give this film two and a half 602 00:51:02,798 --> 00:51:07,962 stars out of five. That's one whole less star than we gave the first Venom movie. You saw 603 00:51:08,002 --> 00:51:12,925 this movie before me and you kind of let me know that you weren't quite happy with it before 604 00:51:13,005 --> 00:51:17,368 even I saw it. I thought that you were being kind of harsh on it. But after seeing the film, 605 00:51:17,408 --> 00:51:22,126 there were so many plot holes. and I felt they did such a disservice to the character of Carnage 606 00:51:22,526 --> 00:51:26,708 that I have to agree with you. Yeah, I think it's like right run in the middle of the road. 607 00:51:27,048 --> 00:51:33,109 Not a good film, but not the worst either. 2.5 stars sounds right to me. It was just too disappointing, 608 00:51:33,249 --> 00:51:38,231 I think, to get a better rating than that. My biggest concern is that once again, these filmmakers 609 00:51:38,291 --> 00:51:43,172 are not taking the character seriously. It's almost like Sony is going back down the path 610 00:51:43,312 --> 00:51:47,293 as they did with the Amazing Spider-Man franchise, where they just don't know what the hell they're 611 00:51:47,313 --> 00:51:52,373 doing. Hopefully Marvel can save them and Sony continues their collaborative relationship 612 00:51:52,693 --> 00:51:57,898 with Marvel Studios. Yeah, yeah, the moment Sony goes rogue and decides to break off ties 613 00:51:57,938 --> 00:52:04,544 with MCU or Kevin Feige or whatever is a dark day. I do not have high hopes for Sony manning 614 00:52:04,584 --> 00:52:09,408 the reins of the Spider-Man franchise, especially with a film like this. But that does it for 615 00:52:09,448 --> 00:52:13,171 our review. Let us know what you guys thought about Venom Let There Be Carnage by writing 616 00:52:13,211 --> 00:52:19,735 to us at dyna or by visiting us on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter. You can find links to 617 00:52:19,915 --> 00:52:23,896 all of our social media accounts by checking out our show notes or visiting our website, 618 00:52:23,956 --> 00:52:29,537 dynamicduel.com. And on our site, you can also find a link to our Patreon page where we offer 619 00:52:29,598 --> 00:52:34,839 bonus content, including bonus episodes and duels, monthly live movie watch-alongs, collectible 620 00:52:34,879 --> 00:52:40,781 pincets, and access to our Discord server. Check it out right after this episode. Our lowest 621 00:52:40,861 --> 00:52:46,853 tier is only $2 a month. which is also the cost to subscribe to the show on Spotify. Our next 622 00:52:46,913 --> 00:52:52,077 episode is going to be a duel. It's kind of Halloween themed, but it also ties into Spider-Man 623 00:52:52,097 --> 00:52:58,262 villains. We're going to pit Man-Bat versus Morbius, the living vampire. Yeah, we were 624 00:52:58,302 --> 00:53:02,625 trying to save this one for, you know, when the Morbius movie was released, but everything's 625 00:53:02,645 --> 00:53:07,369 been pushed back so far. We need to get this duel done now in lead up to our upcoming team 626 00:53:07,409 --> 00:53:13,058 duel where we're going to pit the Justice League Dark against the Midnight Suns. So look forward 627 00:53:13,078 --> 00:53:16,798 to that coming soon down the line. But that does it for this episode. We wanna give a big 628 00:53:16,818 --> 00:53:22,580 thanks to our executive producers, John Spies, Ken Johnson, Jace Crump, John Storosky, Zachary 629 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:28,621 Hepburn, John Beccinina, Mitchell Phipps, Steven Lovato, Dustin Balcom, Salvador Hernandez Contreras 630 00:53:28,661 --> 00:53:33,922 Jr., and Levi Yeaton for making this podcast possible. And we'll talk to you guys next week. 631 00:53:34,382 --> 00:53:36,103 Up, up, and away, true believers.