you
Hi and welcome to the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we review superhero films
and debate the superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing their characters in stat-based
battle simulations. I'm Johnny DC. And I'm his twin brother Marvelous Joe. And this episode,
we will be talking all about the DC fandom. All the news to come out of that. It's awesome,
it's amazing. And I guess we'll be talking about what if as well. We have to review that. Hell
yeah, that's the main event of this episode. We will be reviewing the Disney Plus animated
television show What if. Who cares about the DC stuff? Just skip the news. Actually, I think
this is probably the one episode where people are most likely to skip the main event Because
we're gonna be talking about the new Batman trailer, Black Adam's official first look,
Aquaman and the Lost Kingdoms behind-the-scenes clip, the Flash's first look, the Shazam Fury
of the Gods behind-the-scenes clip We're gonna be talking about the DC's League of Superpets
teaser trailer, as well as Blue Beetle and Batgirl's costume concept art, the Peacemaker official
teaser, and the Catwoman hunted trailer. There was a ton of other news to come out of the
fandom, but we're gonna be specifically talking about those items. Yeah, don't forget that
we're also gonna talk about Will Poulter being cast as Adam Warlock in Guardians of the Galaxy
3, which was probably bigger news than anything to come out of the fandom. Nah, we'll get that
shit out of the way right away, real quick. Then we'll get into the good stuff. As always,
we list our segment times in our episode description, so feel free to check out the show notes if
you want to skip ahead to a particular topic. As a reminder guys, only the 4 most recent
episodes of this podcast are available to the listening public if you want access to over
200 episodes of archived content including our Suicide Squad review, Adam Strange vs Star-Lord,
our Deadpool 2 review, Black Adam
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Panache Gordedema. and Nathaniel Prather, hopefully I got those names right, for recently joining
us on Patreon. Thank you guys so much for your generosity and for helping support this show.
You guys are awesome. But with that out of the way, quick to the No Prize. A No Prize is an
award Marvel used to give out up until the 90s to fans. Our version, the Dynamic Dual No Prize,
is a digital award we post on social media that Jonathan personally draws for those who we
feel gave the best answer to our question of the week. For last week's question, we asked,
what was your favorite DCEU film so far and why? There's been 10 of them. We got a few
answers and we want to run down the honorable mentions before we announce the no prize winner.
Our first honorable mention goes to Marquis High, who said, Hello gentlemen, this is Marquis
here. I'm just checking in to put my bid in. I would say there'd be Suicide Squad. James
Gunn to me is the one that should be holding the reins for. just the direction of projects
in general. I know that he's a little bit outlandish, but just his take in the way that all the characters
were able to give their best performance and adhere to just what we would imagine each of
them to be was amazing. Yeah, the Suicide Squad was what Suicide Squad should have been, hands
down. It captured the tone of the comic, the zaniness, the violence. Everything you love
about the comic was captured on film by James Gunn. He's obviously a comic book fan and I
personally wouldn't mind it if he became the Kevin Feige of DC Comics. I wouldn't want everything
to be zany and outlandish, but I think he knows the source material well enough for that to
not happen. Yeah, I agree. I think he has a great sense for story and for the visual side
of the storytelling. He does come with a little bit of his own baggage due to the whole drama
that happened with him a few years ago. But the guy is not only one of the best comic book
directors, he's one of the most original creative minds out there right now. Yeah, totally. Our
next honorable mention goes to Corey Wooten who said, Guys, Corey Wooten here. This list
is getting pretty impressive and this decision is getting tougher and tougher. Wonder Woman
was my favorite a couple years ago. It's phenomenal. I can watch it over and over. The new Suicide
Squad was darn near perfect, but the only answer is Zack Snyder's Justice League, the best comic
book film I've ever seen. Yeah, I mean, honestly, that's my favorite right now as well. Zack
Snyder's Justice League, again, is what the theatrical release of the Justice League should
have been. It's by far the most epic DCEU film to have come out. Yeah, by far. The scale of
Zack Snyder's original vision was just so much more grand in scope than the first theatrical
Justice League cut that we got. So despite the fact that I had a hard time sitting through
it, I could definitely appreciate why many fans would view it as their favorite because it
just had so much to offer. Yeah, it was a tour de force and that's exactly what you want a
Justice League film to be. We'll see the story continue in the upcoming The Flash movie, I
think, and we'll see where we go from there. Our next honorable mention goes to Brandon
Estregard, who said, Alright guys, hopefully this makes an end on time, but I'm gonna have
to give it to Mattis still. Everything about the movie, I just love, I love how- Zack Snyder
brought these godlike beings to a normal world like ours. Superman suit. Definitely by far
the best suit that we've had for Superman, in my opinion. And don't even get me started on
Michael Shannon as the best freaking DCEU villain ever. It was the best villain, best score,
best action. Well, until probably Zack Snyder's Justice League. But yeah, it's such a good
film. It's definitely one of my favorites in the DCEU. Probably my favorite until Zack Snyder's
Justice League came out. I know it gets a lot of hate. I am NOT one of those haters. I love
it I'm one of those haters, but no it has to be commended for you know Henry Cavill I wish
they would announce like him coming back into the role right because he was just fantastic
Although I think a lot of Superman fans are getting their fix now from the Superman and
Lois television show Which is supposed to have pretty good Superman action if you guys haven't
seen the man of steel in a while check it out Now pass I was talking to you Suck at everyone
else. I saw it recently, it still holds up, and I think it gets better and better as time
goes on, and we get more and more context from other DCEU films. It perfectly set up that
world. That does it for the honorable mentions before we name the no prize winner, we wanna
give a big shout out to CJ Kraft, who took the time to visit our website and leave his answer.
Guys, be sure to go check out his book on Amazon, Pages of Terror Trilogy of Fear. I got my hardcover
book coming in the mail, and I'm really excited for it. But the winner. of this week's snow
prize goes to Michael Haggerty who said, wow wow. Guys, Michael Haggerty here. I have been
to the future. You won't believe it. Shhh, shh, shh. Oh God, it's sucking me back. The Batman
is the best DCEU movie. It's true. It's connected. The Flash is pretty good too. Michael Keaton
does some good stuff, but the answer is the Batman. The answer is the Batman.
I'm convinced. I'm convinced he went to the future. I mean, we heard it happen live on
this show. But I don't know if I would consider the Batman to be DCEU. Maybe it is. Michael
Haggerty just said it was connected. It's part of the DCEU. He was in the future. How can
you deny that? The facts are there. I guess that's true. But no, yeah, does the DCEU just
refer to the Snyder verse or is it much bigger than that? I don't know. But. I totally believe
that the Batman will be the best thing that has ever come out from DC. It looks like the
film is going to be amazing, but we'll get into that when we break down the latest trailer.
So do you think Michael Haggerty is trapped in the future now? Probably. Just like Back
to the Future 2. Well hopefully he enjoys those hoverboards. Lucky bastard. Congrats again
to Michael Haggerty for winning this week's No Prize. If you the listener want a shot at
winning your own No Prize, stay tuned to later on this episode when we'll be asking another
question of the week. And now that that's done, on to the news!
Alright, this past week we got some big Marvel news. Despite the DC fandom, Marvel was still
able to shine with this little gem in that Adam Warlock has been cast for Guardians of the
Galaxy Volume 3. Now he was teased at the end of the last film with Aisha growing up being
called Adam in this gold cocoon-like structure. And fans have been wondering what was gonna
happen with that ever since 2017. Yeah, it's been one of the major. dangling plot threads
that Marvel has put out there that we haven't really heard anything about until now. Yeah,
but with volume 3 set to begin filming within the next couple of weeks we got the big news
that Will Poulter has landed that role of Adam Warlock and this was kind of a head-scratcher
for me because I've seen Will Poulter in a few things and he does not seem like an Adam Warlock
type character who I typically view as like this Adonis guy just very mysterious this basically
perfect being. Yeah, honestly, I thought Adam Warlock would be taller. And Will Poulter definitely
has this unique look to him. I always think of him as the funny kid from We're the Millers.
Right. Yeah. Or like the annoying cousin from the Narnia films. He also played this douchebag
racist in Detroit. I heard he was really good in that. He's played a wide variety of roles,
but none of them would lead me to believe that he is a superhero character. That being said,
James Gunn is obviously brilliant at what he does. And whatever he has. planned for Adam
Warlock, I believe 100% that Will Poulter is the man for the job. According to Deadline,
sources are saying that basically his screen test was too good to pass up. So, if that's
the case, I'm really looking forward to seeing this. It'll be a little bit weird seeing him
in the movies considering that the whole Infinity Saga is over and I primarily associate Adam
Warlock with the Infinity Gauntlet storyline. It'll be interesting to see what type of role
he plays within the MCU. post Thanos and the Infinity Stones. Doesn't he have like the soul
stone embedded in his forehead? He has had that. Yeah. I wonder if they'll explore like the
whole soul world that we got to see in some of the Avengers movies, just like that orange
landscape with those films. That would be interesting. Because that's another kind of dangling plot
thread that they never really addressed. Like what is that place? I'm curious. Yeah, me too.
I would like to see that. And maybe he could go in there and like bring back Tony Stark
and Gamora or something like that. Who knows? I wonder if he's gonna be the bad guy. I think
he'll start out as the bad guy, but since Adam Warlock is ultimately a hero, he'll probably
switch sides toward the end. That's my guess. We'll see. Yeah, maybe he'll become like the
newest member of the Guardians of the Galaxy. Yeah, because he was certainly part of that
team in the comics. I'm wondering if maybe we're going to see him first in Thor, Love and Thunder
considering the Guardians of the Galaxy are going to be in the first part of that film,
or if we're going to see him in the holiday Christmas special, or if we're going to have
to wait until May of 2023. to finally see him in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3. Hmm. Well,
enough of that shit, let's get on to the good stuff, the DC Fan Dome, starting with the Batman
trailer, which was actually the last bit of news to come out of the Fan Dome. Of course.
It was the only solid news to come out of the event. What? So of course they were going to
make people sit around for 4 hours before they got that. Well, I guess you could say it was
the only solid trailer for sure to come out of the event, which was actually honestly kind
of disappointing. But the trailer itself was not. It was amazing. And honestly, it just
got better as it went along. I'm not gonna lie, early on, I didn't know what to think of it
because I felt like so many of the shots I was seeing had come from other Batman films, especially
Christopher Nolan's. Everything from like the scarred back to like the amber lights of Gotham
City night time to like the interrogation scene in the police station. A lot of it felt familiar.
Well, Matt Reeves' Gotham City feels a lot more like Blade Runner to me. because it's like
always raining, it's very dark and drab. It has a very different feel. It's not quite as
realistic as Nolan's take on Gotham, which felt very real world. This feels a little bit more
comic booky. Well, we know that Blade Runner was actually the inspiration for Batman Begins,
but I agree with you. This looks a little bit more like Blade Runner. It has like the same
kind of vibes, especially with the opening frame where we see the Riddler in a coffee shop.
That was a really cool shot. He gets taken by police. and in his coffee mug is a freaking
question mark that's not that cool like that didn't make sense to me like why the fuck is
he touching his coffee? don't do that because he knows that they're coming for him like he
starts making that symbol even before they come in for him okay I can't wait to see the reaction
from the police officer who's like oh guys he put a question mark in his coffee yeah dude
it's crazy hehehehe after that we get to see Robert Pattinson as the Batman And he delivers
this cool line where he's talking about the bat signal and he's like, it's not just a call,
it's a warning. And yeah, these bad guys in Gotham should totally be afraid of him, because
he's fucking them up. He's like straight up tasing them in the face, and like, not taking
any bullets. No nonsense from them. See, at all. That's a little strange to me though,
because since when is Batman Iron Man? He's never been one to walk into a hail of gunfire
and just have all the bullets ricochet off of him. He doesn't have that kind of body armor.
You know what he does in this film. It's very metallic. It's strange because his mask is
like made out of leather, but I guess he's wearing Iron Man armor beneath that. The thing that
always separated Batman from Superman was that Superman could walk into a hail of bullets,
whereas Batman had to rely on stealth and agility. This is definitely not that Batman. I thought
it was going to be because Robert Pattinson is, you know, a slender guy and stuff. I thought
we were going to see some cool acrobatics, but he's just a tank. That's Actually not a bad
way to describe him. To me, he was very much like a movie monster in this whole trailer.
He was just walking towards you, like Michael Myers or something like that. Just bullets
weren't stopping him, explosions weren't stopping him. Like there was no escape. I actually really
liked that about the character. I don't mind that he's bulletproof in this version, because
I know ultimately he's still a man and could still get shot in the face, you know, worst
case scenario. So he's not completely impervious. He's just a badass. Well, it is about time
that he learned that there's a better way to avoid gunfire than doing backflips. In some
ways that's an evolution for the character, but in other ways I do think that maybe he's
lost something with that invulnerability. Hey man, this is the post Iron Man world! We've
all seen the movie, we all can make, you know, metal suits of armor, so why not Batman? I
have to say though, I don't really like Robert Pattinson's Bruce Wayne. Like that shot when
he's looking up from behind the newspaper and he's wearing those glasses. and his weird hairdo,
he looks like Topee McGuire from Spider-Man 3. He looks like that through the whole movie.
During the fandom though, Robert actually said like, you know, this is still early Batman.
This is still him like when he's first starting out. He hasn't really fully developed his Bruce
Wayne persona yet. Okay. Because that's the mask. That's what he needs to work on. Batman
comes a little bit easier to him. Interesting. Okay, I could buy that. I could buy that. The
standouts of this trailer for me were honestly Catwoman and the Penguin. Freaking Zoe Kravitz
as Selina Kyle is pitch perfect. I would not be surprised if she gets her own like sequel
spin-off from this movie. She looks dead honest Selina Kyle. She looks phenomenal like from
the behind the scenes photos that we saw on set. I thought she was going to have long hair.
No, dude. She has the short Selina Kyle haircut from the comics. It's so cool to see. It's
like she's straight from the comic page. The penguin is not necessarily though like in the
comic books. Penguin is like this aristocrat and here he looks more like a Brooklyn Italian
mobster. Oh yeah dude, Colin Farrell is totally channeling Robert De Niro. In the movie he's
gonna be like, Kabagool, forget about it! Get the cannoli! Ma, the lasagna! It's a me Mario!
But no, that end scene with him where he's like, oh I got you! I got you! And then just to see
his face when the Batmobile drips right through those flames, oh my gosh! I was like on my
feet cheering when I saw that during the fan dome. It was the coolest moment. It was a fantastic
shot to end the trailer where we see upside down from the Penguin's perspective, Batman
walking toward him in the rain. And that music, that music is so cool. I love the Batman theme
so far. I just can't wait for this movie. And really we don't have to wait too much longer
for this. It's going to come out in quarter one, 2022, early March. And honestly, I don't
need another trailer. Warner Brothers has dubbed this the main trailer and I'm like, please
let it be the only trailer that we get henceforth because I am totally sold. Like shut up and
take my money. Moving on to our official first look at Black Adam. I was kind of disappointed
that we didn't get a full trailer. It was really just like a heavily edited clip from early
on in the film when we first get to see Black Adam emerge according to the Rock. That's how
you described the clip. I thought it was pretty badass and it did answer a few questions that
we had about the movie, like does any of it take place in modern times, which it looks
like the film does. Yeah, yeah. In the opening part of the clip, we get to see Adriana Tomas,
who looks like she's some sort of archaeologist or something, find this like floating crown
that's in this underground tomb it looks like. And she uncovers this inscription on the ground
and reads the word Shazam, then all of a sudden, boom, lightning strikes from the sky and Black
Adam emerges. and just fries this guy literally into ashes. That was fucking crazy. Yeah, it
was like a Mortal Kombat fatality. Absolutely, that's exactly what it felt like, like straight
from Injustice. And then they shoot at him and he catches a bullet and he rises in the air.
But he's taking bullets just like Batman does. That's a little weird, right? Dude, get over
it. It's cool. But yeah, that's pretty much the entire clip. Before that, we actually got
to see the actors who play the different members of the Justice Society. talk about the film,
talk about their characters a little bit. We got to see their emblems on their suits. I
cannot wait to see Hawkman in full costume. Ugh, and Dr. Fate, Pierce Brosnan is going
to be awesome as Kent Nelson. Oh yeah, definitely. I'm so jealous that you have a Bond actor in
your films. And you also have Timothy Dalton in Doom Patrol, so what the hell? James Bond
prefers DC, what are you gonna do? Hmm, you know, The Rock has been looking forward to
doing this role for such a long time, and he even went as far as to say that he was born
to play this role during the fandom. He's the producer on this film, so you know he's gonna
make it as cool as possible. Because this is probably gonna be his bread and butter going
forward. Is it possible he's not managing his own expectations for this film? It's the fucking
rock! Hell no! So we have Black Adam, we have the Batman. I would say my next favorite thing
to come out of the fandom would be the behind-the-scenes clip we got of Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom.
And it looks like everyone involved, from Jason Momoa to James Wan to the producer Peter Safran.
are really excited about this story that they're gonna tell. It looks like from the concept
art that they released, like it's gonna be as epic and as massive as the first one was. It
just takes us so many new places all over the world. It's gonna be dope. The concept art
that we got of this Lost Kingdom looks so interesting. I thought it was going to be like underwater,
but this movie almost looks like a voyage to the center of the earth type tale. Yeah, because
you have these giant insects and then you have like these weird tentacle creatures and like
jungle and stuff like that I'm sure a lot of it does take place underwater, but this setting
is so fascinating Honestly, I think it's gonna be a Bermuda Triangle kind of thing because
they've played up that angle in the comics before but yeah They also played like an ice element
in the opening titles when they first were introducing this clip So I wonder if like the Lost Kingdom
is some sort of ice realm Maybe I don't know but it looks like we're gonna see a lot of
cool things Yeah, there's even like this desert concept art with these strange creatures. There's
going to be so many different set pieces within this film. It makes it seem super epic in scope.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, Aquaman looks like it was really expensive, like it had a lot of money
behind it. And this film looks the exact same way. They streamlined the costumes a little
bit. You know, like we got to see the stealth suit a little bit better. Aquaman's new blue
outfit that he's going to have for this film. But we also got to see like a streamlined silver
helmet, black manta, which looks a little bit more classic. but just as badass and iconic.
Yeah, is his helmet a little bit smaller in this one? I couldn't tell if it was smaller.
I don't think it was, but his costume overall is definitely less bulky. It's less of like
a suit of armor and more like a sleek wetsuit kind of thing. We got to see a lot more of
Patrick Wilson as Ocean Master in this clip. It almost looks like him and his brother, Aquaman
team up for this film, which is pretty cool. Yeah, but I suspect some kind of betrayal down
the line. I did notice that they used Amber Heard as like sparingly as possible. Yeah,
she only appeared in like two quick flashes of the behind the scenes footage. But it looks
like she's wearing the same suit, which is fine because that suit was just perfection in the
first film. This film is also coming out next year, just like the Batman, just like Black
Adam. But in December, December 16th, also scheduled to come out next year is the Flash. That's
coming out in November. And we got a teaser from that during the fan dome. I was expecting
much more from this Flash panel, honestly. The brief look that we got of the movie. really
didn't get me excited like I thought it would because it didn't really provide anything new.
Like we knew that Michael Keaton's Batman is gonna be in the movie. We knew what the new
costume is gonna look like, although I will say it looks pretty impressive in live action.
I think the main takeaway that I got from this flash first look was that Ezra Miller just
seems like a really unlikable person. Yeah, it was kind of weird the way he introduced
the clip during the fandom. He was like, this is me on the set, this is what it looks like
behind me. He was obviously in front of a green screen. The guy's just trying to be funny,
but it's like, OK, dude. As for the clip itself, I think it relied a little bit too heavily
on our nostalgia for the Tim Burton Batman film, which, you know, comes in spades. Don't get
me wrong. I was super excited by, you know, like the music and everything and seeing the
cave. But it is a flash film, and I do want to see more of the flash and like. Who's gonna
be the villain and different things like that? I wanted a greater sense of the story. Considering
that this isn't a trailer, it was really only the briefest of teasers, I guess I'm not surprised
that we didn't get that, but I gotta say, this doesn't get me as excited as some of the other
projects that we saw during the fandom. Because of how much we don't know about it yet, I guess.
What are your thoughts on the costume? I'm not in love with the mask. The silhouette is all
off, because it doesn't have the protruding ears. It's just like on his mask. I don't love
it. I much prefer Zack Snyder's Justice League version. Which version of Ezra Miller do you
prefer? The long haired version without bangs or the short haired version with bangs? Uh,
I mean I knew that there were going to be two different versions of Barry Allen maybe in
this film. I thought the other one was going to be a villain but it looks like he's an ally.
Which is really interesting. It almost seems like the curly haired version of Barry Allen
is the version from Michael Keaton's Batman's universe. So it's like I guess it works. There
has to be some form of Barry Allen in that world So I guess Ezra Miller could just play himself
twice. Why not? His hair was a little bit too close to Sasha Kaye's Supergirl's hair They
all kind of look alike, but oh well. It was cool to hear Michael Keaton's voice I'll say
that. The line about him like, you know saying that he could go anywhere anytime Why would
he choose to save this universe? It kind of seems like Michael Keaton is retired and kind
of given up on this world so Maybe we'll get some Dark Knight Returns angles in there. I
don't understand why we didn't get to see Michael Keaton, at least as Bruce Wayne. Or, you know,
why didn't we get to see the car at the end? Like, we all know what it looks like. I actually
thought the same thing. Right, exactly. There are just some weird creative choices in this
teaser that we got that, again, not as excited as I am for other projects. I'm a little more
excited for Shazam! Fury of the Gods, which we also got a behind the scenes clip for during
the fandom. I really liked the first movie. I thought they captured the tone perfectly.
And it's really cool to see the same characters back on screen, you know, back in their cool
costumes, their updated costumes, they look really cool. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, these costumes
look much better than the first movie. But we had already seen this before. I was particularly
interested in seeing what the bad guys look like with Helen Mirren and Lucy Liu. I think
they look fantastic. I'm really excited for the Greek mythology angle that they're really
taking this movie. Yeah, I mean, not only did we get to see Lucy Liu and Helen Mirren as
some of the villains, but we also got to see like some of their goons like Griffins and
Cyclops and Harpies and Dragons and stuff like that. That's exciting. That's really cool.
I can't wait to see like Olympus and you know, like the Library of Eternity, you know, the
different locations that they were talking about during this behind the scenes snippet. What
did you think of the fact that Jack Dylan Grazer looks like he's about 20 years old now? He's
almost an adult himself. I mean, it's to be expected, right? Look at it too and how much
he grew from it one. He was one of my favorite characters from the first movie. So I'm just
excited that I get to see him again as Freddy. The first film didn't make that much money
at the box office, but I'm really hoping that this film catches on with audiences because
the first one was so good. And you know, it's all the same filmmakers and everything like
that. This film, just like Aquaman looks like, you know, quite a bit of money is being put
into it. So I have high hopes. It's currently slated to premiere in 2023. And who knows,
maybe we'll get to see Black Adam meet Shazam in the end credits stinger or something like
that. I really hope so. That would be awesome. That would be really cool. Speaking of The
Rock real quick, though, we also got a teaser of the DC League of Super Pets film. DC's animated
film that's coming out May of next year. The Rock is doing the voice of Crypto and Kevin
Hart is doing the voice of Ace the Bat Hound. It's such a good duo. I always love it when
those two guys team up in movies like with Central Intelligence and of course the Jumanji films.
I think they have great chemistry and I'm glad to see them working again together, especially
on a project like this, which I'm actually looking forward to. I always enjoy like a good, you
know, like Pixar movie or something like that. So I think it's great that they're making this
movie to appeal to a younger demographic. Yeah, I agree. It's always great to make films for
kids. You know, I love taking my daughters to see those, but I think I'm not quite ready
to say that this is Pixar caliber. considering the teaser was mostly just like a pee joke.
And not even a good one. Now who was the pig, the squirrel, and the turtle? Was that What's
It and Chip? Yeah, I don't know if they're actually gonna be called What's It and Chip in the film,
but it is the Flash's turtle and Green Lantern's squirrel. The pig actually belongs to Wonder
Woman, apparently. What? I thought Wonder Woman had a kangaroo. I guess they decided not to
go that route. for this film. Maybe the kangaroo is just a little bit too exotic, like you wouldn't
normally see a kangaroo just hopping around the city. So it's a little bit more conspicuous,
I guess, to have a kangaroo. That's weird. I was a little bit nervous about The Rock doing
the voice of Crypto and Kevin Hart doing the voice of Ace. I kind of figured that those
voices should be reversed, but at least this trailer did sell me on the voice work and that
they did a great job as their characters. Moving on to the Blue Beetle movie, we got to see
the filmmakers talk a little bit about the character and how excited they are for the project, which
honestly I wasn't expecting anything more. The film was only announced fairly recently, but
we did get some pretty dope concept art. And honestly, if it's anything like this in the
actual film, that's gonna be amazing. Yeah, the art is great. I really love the visual
style that they seem to be incorporating for this film. I really loved it when Sholo Mareduña,
the guy who's playing Jaime Reyes in the movie, was kind of gushing about how it is the best
superhero costume in all of superhero films. And he was like challenging everybody else
to have like a better costume. I really liked his energy. And the way that the writer and
director were talking about the movie, how he compares to someone like Peter Parker, whose
first instinct was to keep his superhero life a secret from his family. Whereas within the
Latin family, good luck keeping a secret from them. So he really shares that secret with
his family within this movie and within the comics and how that's unique among superhero
alter egos. For sure. Yeah, that's gonna be, I think, a unique and exciting take on a superhero.
As far as the concept art, one interesting thing about it is that we got to see cord industries
on a building in the background behind the Blue Beetle character, which to me is really cool.
I wonder if that means Ted Kord will play a role in this film somehow. I think that would
be really cool. Right, because Ted Kord was the second Blue Beetle in the comic books.
We also got to see the star and filmmakers of HBO Max's Batgirl film talk about that film
as well as tease some concept art just like Blue Beetle. Although this concept art wasn't
as good. No, it was nothing. It was basically just a silhouette among a cityscape. We didn't
get a good feel for what the costume looked like or anything. I mean, it does look like
she'll have like a yellow-ish cape, and she's definitely gonna have the red hair. Like they
said that explicitly, that yes, it's Batgirl, she will have red hair. Interestingly, they
did say that the character was going to be pretty brutal, so she definitely seems to be in line
with, you know, how Ben Affleck played his character. Just, no nonsense. But that does seem a little
bit out of character, no? Maybe. Maybe not if it's set in the same Snyderverse universe.
And the filmmakers did imply that Batman would be making an appearance in this movie. We don't
know which Batman yet. I'm really, really hoping it's been Affleck. But we'll see. One project
that I think is in really good hands is Peacemaker. Of course, James Gunn is doing that. I wasn't
sure how involved he was with the show, but it sounds like he wrote every single episode,
and he directed five out of the eight episodes of the show, which is really cool that he was
that involved. The cast looks like they're hilarious together. They have such good chemistry, you
know, whether it's from a Zoom call or, you know, some of the behind the scenes footage
that we saw. I'm honestly really looking forward to this more so than I had been prior to this
panel. Well, I remember thinking after the Suicide Squad movie, if a Peacemaker television series
would be successful because he was kind of a douche, you know, you kind of hated him within
the Suicide Squad film. But seeing this and seeing the real comedic approach, almost sitcom-esque
approach that they're taking to the characters makes me pretty excited to see it. Yeah, it's
almost like a workplace comedy or something like that, you know? Yeah. The official teaser
that they put out just had me cracking up so much. Like, just his interactions with each
one of these different castmates. I cannot get over how funny this show looks like it's going
to be. Yeah, my favorite part was when Vigilante was like, you know, we're killers, but the
difference about us is that we only kill bad guys. Usually. Unless there's a mistake. Yeah,
yeah, Vigilante looks like he's gonna be hilarious, which is a pretty interesting take on the character,
but, you know, right up James Gunn's alley. I also love Eagly, how he's just like sticking
his head out the car window and like giving hugs and stuff. The butt baby thing went on
for a little long, but uh, it was still funny. I thought, yeah, I thought it was good. You
know, I thought it was a butt baby until I was like 14. That explains a lot. The show actually
comes out pretty soon. January 13th, I think is its debut date on HBO Max. So look forward
to that. I definitely am. What I'm less sure about is Catwoman Hunted, which we got our
first trailer for during the DC fandom. It's an animated film, and it's very much like an
anime kind of style. But I couldn't quite get what tone they were trying to capture in this
first trailer. So much like totally Ocean's 11. It's Ocean's 11 meets anime meets superheroes.
I'm actually really excited for this. I really like the funky kind of vibe that they were
giving off for it. I think it'll be a lot of fun. I mean, it's definitely a heist film,
which is what a Catwoman film should be, but it almost seemed like a parody of the character
as well. You know, there's a little bit of innuendo and quite a number of cat puns. Yeah, but they
kind of address that within the trailer itself where they're like, don't you get tired of
the cat stick? So it's pretty self-aware, I think. Again, I think it's a parody, which
I guess could work, but it's not really anything I think most fans were asking for. No, I think
if I am watching a Catwoman centric movie, I want it to be a fun heist movie. That's exactly
what this looks like. I think as long as it's not too over the top, I think it'll be fine.
We'll see. This film drops February 8th, 2022. So it's coming up. But that was like all of
the major news, I would say, to come out of the fandom. What did you think of the fandom
overall? Did you watch it? Watch the fandom? What? Why would I watch the fandom? You suck.
I watched the fandom. I do wish they would have substituted some of the CW show stuff for upcoming
announcements. There wasn't really anything new that was announced during this fandom.
And some of the other projects that we have heard about weren't talked about at all, such
as Green Lantern Corps, any of the JJ Abrams Justice League dark stuff. Nothing about Michael
B. Jordan's Superman movie. I think this fandom could have been better, if I'm being honest.
We kind of pretty much knew everything we were going to get. Hopefully if they do this again
next year, and I'm really hoping that they do, we'll get more movie announcements. But all
in all there was a lot of cool things to come out from the fandom and we want to know what
your favorite thing was. That's our question of the week.
Tell us what your favorite news to come out of the DC fandom was, and why. Record your
answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking on the red microphone button in the bottom right hand
corner, which will prompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message can be up to 30 seconds
long, and don't forget to leave your name in case we include you on the podcast. We'll pick
our favorite answer and draw that person a Dynamic Duel No Prize that we'll post to social media.
Be sure to answer before October 23rd. Bruce Wayne may appear to be a wealthy playboy, but
beneath his facade his true identity is that of the Batman, waging an endless war against
crime. Join the Caped Crusader in Batman, the Audio Adventures, the first scripted audio
original featuring Batman and his villainous rogues gallery in a world premiere story of
life and death in Gotham City, debuting exclusively on HBO Max. Starring Jeffrey Wright as Batman
and a who's who of incredible Saturday Night Live alums, This rollicking adventure, told
across 10 episodes, is written and directed by Emmy winner Dennis McNicholas, includes
devilishly delightful original music by Doug Bossie, and performances by Rosario Dawson,
John Legrizamo, Chris Parnell, Melissa Villaseñor, Seth Meyers, Jason Sudeikis, Brooke Shields,
Fred Armisen, and many, many more. Go to HBOmax.com slash Batman Audio Adventures for more, and
stream Batman the Audio Adventures. Only on HBO Max. Big thanks to HBO Max for sponsoring
this episode, but let's go ahead and get into our main event now where we review the Disney
Plus animated series, What If.
Alright so What If is an animated series on Disney Plus that was directed by Brian Andrews,
written and created by A.C. Bradley, and starring many familiar names and voices from the live
action Marvel Cinematic Universe. It explores the newly created multiverse that we saw manifest
in the Loki television show with a series of anthological tales told from the perspective
of the Watcher, a cosmic entity who oversees the events happening in each episode. Each
story is set up with a question of what if. This reminds us of a single change in the primary
MCU continuity and unfolds the universal effects from that change. The show is reportedly already
coming back for a second season next year which is a good thing in my mind because no matter
how I feel about the execution of this first season, the concept of the show is worthwhile.
Before we get into our thoughts any further though we want to let you guys know that this
will be a spoiler review as all of our reviews are. So if you haven't seen What If yet, and
you don't wanna know anything about the show, go ahead and pause this podcast now and revisit
it when you do check it out. I think if you are a diehard MCU fan who is fascinated by
the new Marvel multiverse, and you want a taste of it before the new Spider-Man No Way Home
and the Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness films hit theaters, then check it out
for sure. You'll at least find some of the episodes good, if not interesting. And that's pretty
much how I felt about this season as a whole, hit or miss. Some episodes were great, some
episodes I just couldn't get into. And that is somewhat of a disappointment considering
how psyched I was for this series based on the trailers that were released leading up to its
debut. I was the opposite. I was not psyched for this at all. I really don't care about
like Marvel, Elseworld, Tales, alternate universes. What did save this for me? Possibly is the
fact that turned out in the end to be a little bit less Anthological than I thought it was
going to be you know some of the characters from some of the previous episodes returned
And that was kind of cool to see them all interact Yeah And there's also a rumor that some of
these characters in these shorts may be showing up in live action in the multiverse of madness
Movie so that'll be pretty cool if that does happen and it'll be totally worth watching
this series Before I started watching the show I was so pumped because I was expecting this
beautifully animated high concept cerebral show about the nature of fate and choice and causality.
And I think that's what the series tried to be, but it ended up as a mostly well animated,
semi thought provoking affair that didn't quite live up to the standards set by the MCU's live
action offerings. So yeah, that's probably a case of me not checking my expectations and
I paid the price, but I probably should have known better because a lot of the what-if comic
books are hit or miss also. You know, there are some what if comics that are just freaking
epic and mind blowing and so damn good. Like what if Captain America were revived today?
Or what if Magneto ruled all mutants? Stories like that. They're not only good, they're kind
of essential reading if you're into those characters. But you know, there are a lot of duds out there
too. Obviously, that's kind of the nature of an anthology. But good or bad tales aside,
and the comics and the show has both, the potential. that exists within the what-if concept is worth
more than any single story. The potential to be introspective and groundbreaking and thought-provoking
is baked right in. You can tell some fucking awesome stories. The concept itself is the
show's greatest asset. But it's also its greatest hindrance. Yeah, you know, oftentimes I'll
complain about a Marvel movie saying, like, oh, you know, there's a barrier to entry. You
have to do homework and see these other films before you can really appreciate this and that
makes it inferior. One of the reasons I praised Shang-Chi was that it was almost standalone.
These stories are not set in the primary continuity of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. It potentially
may not be leading up to some bigger story that's happening within that universe, but it may
also be. So I was kind of torn as to how interested I should be in the show overall. If you're
saying that some of these characters, are going to make live action appearances, that's cool,
then I'm really glad I watched it. If they're not, then like, I really didn't care too much
for it, honestly. Well, I mean, it's just a rumor. We don't know what's gonna happen in
Multiverse of Madness yet. But you raise an interesting point about like your interest
in the show. The main problem I have with this series is that the what if concept inherently
doesn't require much investment on behalf of the audience because any single story anthological
exploration outside of the primary universe is just a sandbox that the writers can let
thrive or destroy. It technically doesn't affect anything that matters. We don't have to care
about it essentially. And because we don't have to be invested, sometimes it's hard to be.
So when I was digging the show, it was good. But when I wasn't digging the show, it just
felt pointless. Well, I mean, as far as an investment goes from the audience, they had to have at
least have seen the film that the anthological show riffs on, you know? The Doctor Strange
episode would not make sense so much if you haven't seen the Doctor Strange film. Same
thing for Black Panther or Guardians of the Galaxy or Captain America, the first Avenger.
I think if you've seen those movies, this show becomes more interesting, but not everyone
has. So I think this is really a show for the Marvel diehards, of which I'm not. And honestly,
even if you are a Marvel diehard, it doesn't necessarily mean that you're gonna be invested
in the particular tales that this show has to tell. Not helping matters, I think, was that
I felt largely detached from the character animation here. I personally don't connect with animation
as I do with live action. Which was not to knock the animation, because overall I think the
show is a win visually. Even though the characters basic movements could be a little stiff, and
their faces were soulless abominations. I think the action was tremendous. And the background
plates were just breathtaking, and the colors... Oh man, the colors were absolutely gorgeous.
I like how each episode had its own palette to complement the setting and story. Yeah,
I mean, it's not surprising that the animation was great. It's Disney. You know, they are
the best when it comes to animation. So yeah, I figured it would be good. And honestly, it
was better than I thought it was going to be. The cell shading took a little bit to get used
to. It's why I think they opened up with the Captain Carter story because it had sort of
this like Max Fleischer animation old school feel to it where you could more easily accept
the cell shading. And while some scenes, particularly dialogue heavy scenes kind of seems like they
were pulled out of like a video game cut scene. I think the action is where the show really
shined. Yeah, the dialogue scenes seemed like very cheap but I think they spared no expense
when it came to the action, you're right. Overall, this series did get me thinking about the nature
of alternate universe stories, their purpose, and what makes them good. So one of the purposes
of an alternate universe tale is to provide a new perspective on the primary universe in
a story not bound by the confines of canon. You learn how changes in continuity affect
or don't affect the characters we know and love and we see how large their role really is in
their greater universe. These type of tales are reimaginings, essentially, like 1602 for
Marvel or The Dark Knight Returns for DC. Another purpose of alternate universe tales is to experiment
with the primary universe by telling a story seemingly set within that continuity but involving
events that could not or should not happen within that world. Something like Marvel Zombies or
Injustice. What an alternate universe story should not be is essentially a retelling of
a previous story with some minor elements changed. And I think that was a mistake that this show
made occasionally. The episodes that departed heavily from the MCU were more interesting
to me than those that essentially served to tell the same story with a twist. Because the
episodes that did that just told essentially a less interesting tale than the original.
were more engaging. I felt the same way. Absolutely. You know, I love Elseworld Tales. I love these
alternate reality stories. My favorite DC Comics storyline is an Elseworld Tale, Kingdom Come,
and that definitely isn't retreading anything new. It's charting new territory. You know,
it's asking like, what if this happened in the future? And that's a really cool notion to
me. I think one of the reasons, you know, in the comics, the New 52 failed was because a
lot of fans didn't want to see like slightly altered. takes of storylines that they were
already familiar with. Yeah, no, yeah, that's a great example for sure. And as we go down
this episode breakdown, we're definitely gonna be able to point out which of these stories
lacked originality and which ones were more compelling. So let's go ahead and do that.
The first episode was called, What If Captain Carter Were the First Avenger? It had Jeffrey
Wright as the watcher, who I freaking loved in this entire series. I think Jeffrey Wright
has such a commanding voice full of presence. You believe that the dude is a cosmic entity,
you know, and you know, he's doing the voice for Batman in the audio adventures on HBO Max.
Yeah. And he's playing commissioner Gordon in the Batman. Yeah. The guy is just fantastic.
I can't get enough Jeffrey Wright. He needs to be in every single project. This first episode
also had Haley Atwell as Captain Carter. Chris Evans was not in this. He was played by a guy
named Josh Keaton who I thought did a bang up job. Ross Markand who played the Red Skull
in the Endgame movie relent his voice to the character here and Sebastian Stan played Bucky
Barnes in the worst voice performance ever given ever. The plot of the episode is, during World
War II, a Hydra spy shoots and injures Steve Rogers before he can undergo project rebirth.
SSR agent Peggy Carter kills the spy and steps in to receive the serum instead. Howard Stark
equips her with a uniform and shield and she becomes Captain Carter. She steals the Tesseract
from Hydra and Stark uses it to build the Hydra Stomper Armor, which Steve Rogers pilots. The
armor gets captured and Red Skull uses the Tesseract to summon an interdimensional monster. Captain
Carter and her allies rescue Steve and she pushes the creature back into the other dimension.
70 years later, she returns, having not aged a day. Now I think right off the get go, we
realize that the entire premise for the episode is not necessarily just set up. by the question
of the episode. You know, this episode is titled, What If Captain Carter Were the First Avenger?
The Watcher states that the change in this universe was that Peggy Carter decided to stay on the
testing room floor, but really you see a whole bunch of different circumstances that dictate
the flow of this story, such as, you know, the Hydra agent in the MCU movie was sent to observe
the experiment to see if it was a success and then capture the Super Soldier Serum. In this
episode, he was sent to prevent the test from ever taking place. So little things like that.
I did like this episode. This was actually one of my maybe top three episodes of the whole
series. Yeah, I really like how it kind of took similar themes from the Agent Carter television
series, live action, that got two seasons. The feminist themes of like the guy is not wanting
to let the girls out in the field and like she goes out there and she just absolutely kicks
ass. If anything, It seemed like she kicked more ass than Captain America did, considering
that she actually like acquired the Tesseract while it was in transition. That's what I was
thinking. Yeah. She was like a better version of Captain America than Steve Rogers almost.
She was definitely more lethal. She was straight up like killing dudes with that shield. How
hard she was hitting them. I thought it was pretty crazy. But I thought it was really clever
how the story used the Tesseract as kind of like an early arc reactor. the thing that powered
the hydra stopper armor and how Steve Rogers was the one to pilot that suit. That was cool.
It's actually pretty, I think, interesting to have Steve Rogers out in the field with Peggy.
He was like her iron giant. It reminded me kind of like, you know, like Stargirl and Stripesy
in a way. Yeah, definitely. That scene where they're doing the aerial combat with the Nazi
fighter planes was really badass. I could watch that all day. That was amazing. I think the
story did lose a little bit in the third act right after Steve gets captured by Hydra after
the train explosion and they go to rescue him in that Nazi castle. It was interesting how
Red Skull chose to use the Tesseract as a portal as opposed to a weapons energy source like
he did in the live action film. Right. Yeah, that definitely was another detour that they
took from the actual film. I did think that the monster that he summoned was pretty cool
though. Seeing Captain Carter with his sword and shield fight this like mythological Cthulhu
type monster, reminded me a lot of like Wonder Woman actually. Yeah. I thought that the creature
was actually going to be Shuma Gorath and that it was going to tie into a Dr. Strange story
down the line, but I think it was just this tentacle beast. Yeah. You can't do Shuma Gorath
now that you know, DC did Starro. Sorry. Completely different character, but. I did think that
it was entirely ridiculous that this huge ass tentacle monster was able to be essentially
just pushed back through the portal with her little shield. You know? That was so dumb.
She sold it, I thought. Did she? Okay. Me, I was like, what's this bullshit? Like it just
got done freaking killing the red skull and it was like destroying this entire castle and
she just kind of like walked it right back in. That's fair. Overall, I mean, I did- like this
episode I rated a three out of five stars mainly because I felt like I'd already seen most of
the story especially if you've seen Agent Carter I think a lot of the themes that this episode
tried to play up were done better within that series. See I haven't seen that series I thought
this was one of the more original episodes actually so I'd like to I'd probably give it like a
three and a half four. The next episode two was called What if T'Challa Became a Star Lord?
This episode. actually had Chadwick Boseman in one of his last performances as the character,
he played Star-Lord T'Challa. It was really nice hearing him in this role again. The episode
also starred Michael Rooker as Yondu, Josh Brolin as Thanos, Benicio del Toro as the Collector,
Karen Gillan as Nebula, and Jimon Honsu as Korath the Pursuer. In the story, the Ravagers mistakenly
kidnap T'Challa as a child instead of Peter Quill. He grows up to be a famous galactic
hero known as Star-Lord who steals from the rich and gives to the needy. He plots with
Nebula to steal a magic bean-like artifact called the Embers of Genesis from the Collector. While
searching for it, T'Challa discovers a Wakandan spacecraft and learns his home was not destroyed
like Yondu told him. He fights the Collector for the artifact and wins with his allies help.
He forgives Yondu for lying to him and reunites with his family back on Earth. This episode
I actually didn't love too much. It was actually my least favorite episode. It was also one
of my least favorite episodes. Partly because I think T'Challa is much cooler as Black Panther
and Peter Cool is much cooler as Star-Lord. So to see a less cool version of Star-Lord
was not interesting. I think the way they played up his character, especially when it involved
Korath and how he like... Idolized Star-Lord and everything like that. I thought it got
a little bit ham-fisted, you know Absolutely T'Challa is out there essentially saving the
universe being such an influence over the galaxy Even convincing someone like Thanos to not
be Thanos. That was fucking weird a stretch I'll say you know if he could convince Thanos
to give up his agenda Like why didn't he think to do that during Avengers Endgame? Like he
could just talk him out of it I guess that doesn't make sense because they were in the middle
of a battle. But like if you could convince the mad Titan to abandon his goal, then we
should have saw that type of diplomatic reasoning in Black Panther with Killmonger. Oh, totally.
That's like convincing dark side to give up his search for the anti-life equation. Exactly.
No, that's the character. It's bullshit. Yeah. I think that was the moment where I was like,
fuck this episode. And like the whole premise of this. episode was supposed to be like nature
versus nurture. Like, are you going to be the same person, even if you grow up in a different
environment? And I think this episode tried to show that, yeah, T'Challa has such a strength
of character that he remained the same honorable person despite the fact that he was captured
by a bunch of thieves. And while that sentiment is nice, the execution was crap. Like he completely
transformed what the Ravagers were all about. He had too much influence. on everyone from
Nebula to Korath that I think just did not seem realistic. It made so many characters less
interesting. Like I mean, I think things got a little bit better when I thought Nebula had
betrayed him. But then that turned out to all be like a ruse as well and I was like ugh.
It was cool to see Howard the Duck. I think Seth Green did his voice, right? Yeah, he did.
Howard the Duck showed up in a few episodes here. That was fantastic. The Embers of Genesis
was an interesting plot point that I feel like would absolutely destroy any planet that they
tried to use it on. I did think it was touching when T'Challa returned home and had that nice
celebration with his family. Although there was kind of like a bittersweet ending when
we see Peter Quill working at Dairy Queen and then he's approached by his father Ego who
uses him to essentially take over the universe and fulfill his plot from Guardians of the
Galaxy volume 2. Overall though I think I give this episode a 2.5 out of 5. It was definitely
my least favorite just because the plausibility of it all. Yeah, I think that's a fair rating.
Two and a half, two stars. That's probably my rating as well. Episode three was titled, What
If the World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes? It starred Samuel L. Jackson as Nick Fury, Jeremy Renner
as Hawkeye, Mark Ruffalo as Hulk, Tom Hiddleston as Loki. Lake Bell, I thought gave a pretty
convincing Black Widow performance. I think she mostly hit the right notes to mimic Scarlett
Johansson. I didn't realize that was like Belle. Yeah, I thought she did a really good job.
She's just a really talented voice actress in general. Yeah, she also plays Poison Ivy in
the Harley Quinn animated series. That's right, yep. Robert Downey Jr. wasn't here. It was
a guy named Mick Wingert who played Iron Man. And of course, Michael Douglas returned as
Hank Pym. The story goes that during the time around Iron Man 2, The Incredible Hulk and
Thor, the original Avengers Initiative candidates are mysteriously killed, including Iron Man,
Thor, Hawkeye, and Hulk. Black Widow investigates and tells Fury their murders are related to
Hope before getting killed herself. Loki arrives on Earth to avenge Thor, but Fury bargains
with him to bring the killer to justice. He deduces its Hank Pym as Yellowjacket, who is
upset that his daughter Hope died under S.H.I.E.L.D.'s watch. Hank tries to kill Nick Fury, but Loki
stops him and later vows to conquer Earth. Fury finds new Avengers recruits in Captain America
and Captain Marvel. I really liked this one. What? It was pretty good. This was like my
second to least favorite episode of the whole season. Really? This one was really dumb, I
thought, actually. The way like that twist ending, which honestly was spoiled for me, because
I tend to watch things with subtitles. So when Black Widow was talking about how it's all
about hope, hope was capitalized. Oh no. So I realized that she was talking about Hope
Van Dyne, right? And I was like, oh, this is stupid. I really liked revisiting some of the
scenes from those earlier MCU movies, especially seeing Mark Ruffalo in the scene from the Incredible
Hulk movie when he's escaping that university and Thunderbolt Ross' troops are closing in
on him. It was pretty novel, I think, to see that actor in that scene. And like the way
he died, like exploding, I thought it was pretty crazy. I was like, what the hell is going on?
Like how Hawkeye ended up killing Thor, you know, and then he died himself while in custody.
I thought it was actually a- pretty solid mystery. And when they finally revealed that it was
Yellowjacket, Hank Pym turned evil, I thought it was a pretty true homage to his darker turns
within the comic books. Didn't you think that the whole twist that Hope died in a scene that
we never saw in a character that had never been mentioned prior in the episode was a cheap
twist though? Maybe, but I don't think it was cheap if you know Hank Pym's history in the
comics. At face value, yeah, you're probably right. Like shouldn't he have been upset about
like Janet maybe? Why? Because she was a S.H.I.E.L.D. agent who died. You know, we didn't see or
hear about Hope dying prior, so we would never have suspected that. That's true. Yeah, but
then I guess you would have had the clever wordplay about how it's about Hope. Why couldn't Black
Widow have just said, it's fucking Hank Pym? Like why even have wordplay? So dumb. I don't
know. I liked it. I liked it. I especially like how at the end we get to see like joining of
a new Avengers team involving Captain America and Captain Marvel. But that also doesn't make
sense too because Captain America was the first Avenger. So why would he be like on a backup
list of the Avengers? Because he wasn't discovered in the ice until after the events of Iron Man
2, Incredible Hulk and Thor. Oh, that's true. Okay, nevermind. I actually rate this episode
a four out of five. I would give this episode like a 1.5 or two out of five. Geez. It sucked.
Episode 4 was called What If Dr. Strange Lost His Heart Instead of His Hands. It stars Benedict
Cumberbatch as Dr. Strange, Rachel McAdams as Christine Palmer, Benedict Wong as Wong, and
Tilda Swinton as the Ancient One. After losing his girlfriend Christine Palmer in a car crash,
Dr. Stephen Strange learns the mystic arts and uses the Time Stone to try and save her. The
Ancient One instructs him that her death is an absolute point in time that cannot be reversed.
and she splits Doctor Strange into two versions of himself so that the good version may one
day stop the misguided version. The misguided version becomes all powerful by absorbing mystical
beings, eventually absorbing his counterpart and transforming into the monstrous Doctor
Strange Supreme. He resurrects Christine Palmer, but the temporal paradox destroys reality and
leaves Doctor Strange Supreme as the sole survivor of an empty universe. I loved this episode.
I think it's my favorite episode. Yeah, I would say it's my favorite episode as well. I mean,
I think the episode should have been titled, what if Dr. Strange drove Christine Palmer
to his award ceremony, but losing his heart instead of his hands just sounds better. I
mean, that is definitely a huge alteration from the movie and that she was in the car with
him, but other than that, I thought it was pretty good. I think Rachel McAdams totally forgot
who her character. was in this performance because she was like so flirtatious and like so sexy
voiced. Whereas Christine Palmer in the movie was not very flirtatious. She was very like
straightforward and caring and everything, but definitely not like sexified. Yeah, did they
even have like a romantic relationship in the movie? I mean, there were exes, so it was slight.
One of the things I really liked about this episode was just seeing the ancient one and
Dr. Strange interact again, but Also the use of magic, like the way Dr. Strange Supreme
became all powerful, how he kind of like started with some of the weaker mystical beings and
then slowly worked his way up the totem pole. I thought that was pretty fascinating. I also
liked when Wong and the good Dr. Strange were doing their spell writing, the way that manifested
with like these mystical text characters in the air and how they were just kind of pulling
them out and like working them that way. Yeah, that was cool. I hope we see that kind of magical
visual language utilized within the live action films because I think that'd be cool to see.
And it was so tragic, the ending, how everything just kind of like turned black and like floated
away. And like he became like the sole survivor in this universe just trapped all alone for
all eternity. And how he like pleaded with the watcher and the watcher was like, no dice.
You did this to yourself, bro. It was cool to see the Watcher interact with the Dark Doctor
Strange. I thought actually that was a really cool aspect of this episode. The fact that
the Watcher broke the fourth wall in a way. Yeah, I love every time he broke the fourth
wall. I loved every time that we saw him gazing upon the events from the sky in the background.
He shows up quite frequently in these stories. Yeah, it was always kind of a treat to see
him just in the sky in the background. I actually liked that. I was like, oh, it's Wat 2. That's
cool. Overall, this episode I think was the best. I give it four and a half stars out of
five. Yeah, I'd give it the same rating. The fifth episode was called, What If Zombies?
And it stars Mark Ruffalo as the Hulk, Chadwick Boseman as Black Panther, Paul Bettany as Vision,
Sebastian Stan as Winter Soldier, Evangeline Lilly as Wasp, Paul Rudd as Ant-Man, Jon Favreau
as Happy Hogan, Danai Gurira as Okoye, Emily Van Camp as Sharon Carter, David Smolchin as
Kurt, and Hudson Thames as Spider-Man. They apparently, they couldn't get Tom Holland.
But in the story, Hank Pym brings back a zombie virus from the Quantum Realm while trying to
rescue his wife Janet, causing a zombie apocalypse. With most of Earth's heroes as the Walking
Dead, a small band of survivors try and find a potential cure at Camp Lehi. They find Vision,
who can cure the virus using the Mind Stone, but not the Scarlet Witch, who is too powerful.
He rips out his Mind Stone in atonement for feeding victims to the Scarlet Witch and gives
it to the Black Panther, Spider-Man, and Ant-Man. who head to Wakanda to broadcast the stone's
frequency around the world. However, a zombified Thanos is already waiting for them there. This
was, I think, a really fun episode in that it played almost exactly like how a zombie movie
would, albeit with Marvel superheroes that we know and love from other movies. Yeah, that
was cool. Yeah, I love how Peter was like, haven't you guys ever seen a horror film? When they
were talking about splitting up and stuff like that. Yeah, it was good. It was almost like
meta in a way. Yeah. Most zombie movies involve, you know, a small group of people just trying
to survive and slowly but surely most, if not all of them get picked off by the zombie hoard.
Most zombie movies don't have a great ending and the same goes for this one. I like how
they started out with like a large group and that they each started dying like happy Hogan
on the train and then Bucky when he discovers the Scarlet witch. Scarlet witch was so freaking
scary. Like when she blasts open that door and you just see her silhouette. and how she's
like hunched over the way they animated her movements kind of reminded me of the chick
from the ring. And I was like, oh, shit, Baba Yaga. It was a really dark turn. Like this
is probably some of the darkest shit that Disney has ever done when like you have the reveal
that the vision has been feeding people to Wanda. Yeah, he fed Wanda like Black Panther's leg,
I think. Yeah. Fucking crazy. And it was so weird. Like, I think he was rationalizing it
by saying that he was preventing her chaos from unleashing upon the earth. But he could have
easily destroyed her. And they ask him why he didn't. And like, at that point, he realizes
how much he fucked up because he doesn't have a good reason for why he didn't just kill her.
You know, obviously, it's because he loves her, but it wasn't worth the lives of all those
innocent people, you know? Right. Love is not always logical. And he's supposed to be this
logical creature. When he realizes that. His decision making wasn't based in logic like
he claimed it was. And he was like, yeah, just take my Mind Stone. Ripped my brain out. That's
pretty hardcore. As hardcore as I wanted a Marvel zombie story to be. So I was really glad to
see this one. I'm not sure if the whole Thanos lying in wait and what kind of thing made sense.
No, it didn't. It was what it was. They needed some kind of ending like that. Yeah, they were
taking the Mind Stone right to him. So what's worse than Thanos? Zombie Thanos with the Infinity
Gauntlet. But overall I do think that this was a fun episode, I gave it 4 stars out of 5.
It was pretty much exactly what I wanted it to be. I didn't think I liked this episode,
but just talking about it made me realize that yeah this was a good episode, one of the better
ones I think. I'll give this like 4 stars. Episode 6 was called What If Killmonger Rescued Tony
Stark? It stars Michael B. Jordan as Killmonger, Jon Favreau as Happy Hogan, Chadwick Boseman
as Black Panther, Angela Bassett as Ramonda, Danai Gurira as Okoye, Andy Serkis as Klawe,
Don Cheadle as War Machine, Paul Bettany as Jarvis, and Mick Winger again as Tony Stark.
In it, Killmonger saves Tony Stark from being taken by the Ten Rings and reveals Obadiah
Stane's involvement in the abduction plot. Tony takes Killmonger in as a confidant and helps
him build a humanoid combat drone out of vibranium. Killmonger manipulates Tony Stark into arranging
a vibranium purchase by War Machine from Ulysses Claw. Killmonger kills War Machine and Black
Panther who shows up to stop the deal. He also kills Stark, who confronts him regarding his
manipulation, making it all look like a Wakandan attack. Killmonger travels to Wakanda and helps
them fend off the US retaliation, gaining their trust and becoming the new Black Panther. Shuri
visits Pepper Potts, who both distrust Killmonger and propose an alliance to stop him. Now this
episode was called What If Killmonger Rescued Tony Stark, but what it should have been called
was What If Killmonger... went about his plan from the Black Panther movie in a more convoluted
and more boring way. That's what I was gonna say. I was like, this whole thing was so convoluted,
way more convoluted than it needed to be. He was almost like a double agent against himself.
It was weird. It was strange, especially the way it ended. I kind of figured that maybe
he was going to fulfill his goal and then realize the evilness of his actions or something, learn
some kind of profound lesson through it all about maybe family or something like that.
He never got his comeuppance. It ended on a cliffhanger, which I didn't know why at the
time. We learned later that, you know, he kind of needs to remain the bad guy. But as a whole,
this episode just didn't work. Well, yeah, like Killmonger when the Black Panther movie came
out, he was such like a fan favorite character. Like people really liked Michael B. Jordan
as the character. So I'm with you. I also thought that he was going to have like some kind of
turn in the story where he became a good guy, you know, when the episode ended on that really
weird cliffhanger. I was also like, what the fuck was this episode? It was not a good episode.
Yeah, I give it two and a half stars out of five. I would give it like two stars, maybe
one and a half. The next episode, episode seven, was called What If Thor Were an Only Child?
It stars Chris Hemsworth as Thor, Natalie Portman as Jane Foster, Tom Hiddleston as Loki, Kat
Dennings as Darcy Lewis, Jeff Goldblum as the Grandmaster, Taika Waititi as Korg, Jamie Alexander
as Sif. and Alexandra Daniels as Captain Marvel. Brie Larson didn't contribute to this one.
The story goes, when Odin neglects to adopt Loki as his own after the war with the Frost
Giants, Thor grows up an only child, craving attention through hard partying. When his father
enters the Odin's sleep, Thor travels to Earth to throw a party, his arrival detected by Jane
Foster. Thor and Jane fall in love, though the party's craziness threatens the planet.
and she and Thor fight. Jane reaches out to Friggo with Heimdall's help, and Thor scrambles
to clean up the planet before his mother arrives. They're successful, though as Thor asks Jane
out, they're interrupted by a variant of Ultron invading the universe and wielding the Infinity
Stones. This episode was fucking dumb. Like, it was my least favorite episode. Really? Yes.
I didn't think it was too bad. I thought it was funny. The whole thing was just played
for laughs. They, like, traded every character. as a joke from Loki to Jane to Frigga. Well,
this was like the comedy episode. It was kind of like a riff on party movies, you know, where
like the teen throws the big party and then has to clean up before the parents get home.
Who the hell cares? Like, why was that one of the story ideas that came up in the writer's
room? Like, you know what would be funny? If like Thor was like a frat bro. It's like, ugh.
Yeah, I mean, there's not too much substance here. I think there is a lot of charm. And
I do think that the fight between Thor and Captain Marvel was pretty epic. I thought that was
done really well. But yeah, I mean, there was not really a huge plot, largely a vehicle,
I think, for Chris Hemsworth to be funny. Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly what it was. And of all
the different episodes that we got here, this was the one I was least interested in, like
learning the whole what if story behind. It was so pointless. Well, what did you think
about Thor and Loki's relationship in this? How despite the fact that they weren't brothers,
they still called each other brothers. Brothers from another mother? Yeah. Loki is more interesting
as Thor's brother, not as a frost giant. Not as his bro? I think so. What did you think
when you saw Infinity Stone Ultron come through at the end? I thought, oh they found a way
to tie all these stories together. Because I knew that the next story was going to be, you
know, what if Ultron won? Overall I give episode 7, What if Thor Were an Only Child, a 3.5 out
of 10. What? This one gets like a 0.5 for me. This was pointless. It would get a point five
if it was drawn in crayon and was spoken in gibberish. Fine. A one. Episode eight was called
What If Ultron Won? It stars Jeremy Renner as Hawkeye, Lake Bell as Black Widow, Toby Jones
as Arnim Zola and Ross Markand as Ultron. I don't think Ross did as good of an impression
of James Spader as he does of Hugo Weaving as Red Skull. To me, Ultron's voice took me out
of this a little bit. I thought he did a decent impression. In the story, Ultron assumes his
Vision form and defeats the Avengers, unleashing a nuclear holocaust on the planet. He kills
Thanos upon his arrival and acquires the other Infinity Stones. Which was dumb! Oh man, we'll
talk all about that. Alright. With the stones, Ultron wipes out nearly all life in the universe,
except for Hawkeye and Black Widow who plot to defeat him using Arnim Zola's analog artificial
intelligence. They arm one of Hawkeye's arrows with their upload device, But Ultron evades
defeat by leaving his universe after becoming aware of the Watcher's presence. He attacks
the Watcher and begins destroying other realities. The Watcher approaches Doctor Strange Supreme
and asks for his help in forming a team to stop Ultron. So let's talk about Ultron killing
Thanos so easily. The vision from Infinity War has really got to be kicking himself. If he
knew that's all he had to do to defeat Thanos when he arrived in Wakanda, then the Avengers
would have won easily. Tony would have even had to die. Like Tony's death is on Vision.
Exactly. You know, I bet you even Scarlet Witch would have been able to do that. Like in Vision
and Scarlet Witch together, like when Thanos was approaching, they should have just been
slicing him in half. They really turned Thanos into a bitch in these episodes. That's what
I'm saying. That should have been an epic battle, but maybe they were too cheap. Maybe they ran
out of time to animate that. They just needed to get the story moving, I guess. but my jaw
like physically dropped when Ultron killed Thanos and I was just like, what the fuck? Okay. But
I did like the rest of the episode. I especially liked how they handled Hawkeye here. He was
such a fucking badass. Like they need to do more of that shit within the live action stuff.
Oh right. With Jeremy Renner. The fact that he was like firing three arrows at a time and
hitting his marks, all the different trick arrows that he had. He seems like such a powerhouse,
which is what Hawkeye is. Anyone who hates Hawkeye. doesn't realize that he could go up against
freaking anybody with his trick arrows. He has an arrow for every occasion. Let's hope we
see some of this in the Hawkeye TV show. Yes, we need to see that. We need to see him sniping
people without even being seen, doing some serious damage with some like explosive arrows or some
shit. And just like being this real wild card that can hit you no matter what. He was definitely
the coolest he's ever been in the MCU in this episode. Yeah. And I appreciated that. And
I also thought that their plan to defeat Ultron, given that he's, you know, a digital artificial
intelligence was pretty clever. Yeah, he's all powerful, but unlike Thanos, he's not an actual
organic being, meaning that no matter how powerful he gets, he's still susceptible to the failings
of all technology. Did it make sense though that they could upload, you know, an analog
AI to a USB drive? Yeah. Oh, okay. It must've been some kind of like magnetic tape type upload.
device thing or something. I don't know. I was just wondering like what made Arnim Zola so
much more powerful than Ultron? I wouldn't say he was a more powerful form of technology,
but just as powerful of a mind, which I think in its analog form would have taken Ultron
by surprise. Especially considering that it seemed Ultron didn't really know how to use
the stones to their full extent, as we'll discuss in the next episode. Overall, I give What If
Ultron Won four stars out of five, mainly because... I like seeing Hawkeye in action. I really thought
the fight between Ultron and the Watcher was cool. Yeah, I would agree. Four stars make
sense. The last episode, episode nine, was called What If the Watcher Broke His Oath? It stars
Hailey Atwell as Captain Carter, Lake Bell as Black Widow, Chadwick Boseman as Star-Lord,
Michael B. Jordan as Killmonger, Chris Hemsworth as Thor, Benedict Cumberbatch as Doctor Strange
Supreme, and Cynthia McWilliams as Gamora. Gamora was a surprise in this episode. I thought I
had actually skipped an episode. Same. But what really happened was that this season was supposed
to be 10 episodes. They couldn't finish the 10th one in time due to COVID. So what they're
gonna do is they're gonna put the episode where Gamora defeats Thanos into season two. In this
episode, the Watcher and Dr. Strange Supreme recruit Captain Carter, Star-Lord, Killmonger,
Party Thor, and Gamora into a guardians of the multiverse team to stop Ultron. They plan to
use Gamora's Infinity Stone Crusher device to defeat him, though it needs to be powered by
the Soul Stone. The team confronts Ultron and they fight, joined at one point by Zombie Scarlet
Witch. Star-Lord swipes one of the stones, but Gamora's device fails since it can only destroy
her universe's stones. Black Widow fires the Arnim Zola arrow, which takes over and seemingly
defeats Ultron. Killmonger then takes control of the stones, though Arnim Zola fights him
for them. With the stones in between ownership, the Watcher seals them in a pocket dimension.
The Guardians are returned to their respective universes, though Black Widow is taken to the
universe where Hank Pym killed the Avengers so that she can help stop Loki's invasion.
Back home, Captain Carter discovers the hydrostomper with someone inside. Oh, I think I missed that.
Was that an after credit scene? Yes. Captain Carter lands back on the Lemurian Star where
she's fighting Batroc, and they find out that the mysterious cargo the ship is holding is
Hydra Stopper, allegedly with Steve Rogers inside. All right, dang it, I have to go see that now.
Yeah, I assume that's gonna play into season two, because I think Captain Carter's going
to be a mainstay character throughout each of these what-if seasons. Overall, I liked the
action in this episode, but some of the plot seemed a little bit questionable, like the
whole needing the Soul Stone to power the Infinity Gem Destroyer. that didn't even work? Right.
Yeah, because all of a sudden they're like, oh, it must only work for my universe's stones,
which is stupid and also highlights another complaint I have in that it's comic book canon
that the Infinity Stones only affect the universe that they originate from. That's what I was
thinking. Like, didn't they establish that in Loki? Yeah, that's what I thought. Outside
of the time stream when Ultron was fighting the Watcher, he shouldn't have been able to
use the stones. Yeah, they would have just been paperweights and then Watcher would have wiped
his ass with Ultron. So they're kind of going against their own canon as it were regarding
the stones, which is also different from the canon from the comic books. So it's a little
bit hard to understand. Especially considering that the stones could be used in other universes,
just not destroyed in other universes. I don't know if I'm being nitpicky, but I don't know.
I didn't buy it. One thing I didn't get was that the Watcher and Dark Doctor Strange said
that they put this team together because they each had like specific traits that they would
need to defeat Ultron. And like, why the hell would you put Killmonger on the team? Like,
what did he contribute other than turning evil? Well, the Watcher knew that he would betray
the team and ultimately he needed Killmonger to do that, to wrest control of the Infinity
Gems from Ultron. And during that transition point is when the Watcher had already planned
to seal them in the Pocket Dimension. Really? Yes. Okay, that's convenient. He's the Watcher,
he sees everything. One of my favorite moments from this episode was actually seeing Dark
Doctor Strange go up against Infinity Gem Ultron. I think that was probably the highlight of
maybe the entire series. Just seeing these like two powerhouses go at it. Yeah, yeah, that
was really well done. The main purpose of this episode was to spotlight that action between
the Guardians and Ultron wielding the Infinity Stones. What kind of annoyed me was that Ultron
wielded the stones in a very inefficient way. Kind of like how the Hood did in the comics.
Like he didn't realize that he had unlimited power with them and that he could do anything.
He could just will them out of existence instead of fighting them. Right, like why go to alternate
universes and take them over with robots when he could just snap everything out of existence?
Yeah, he's taking too much of a warrior's approach, which seems a little off for an artificial
intelligence character. You'd think he'd take the most logically efficient route and just
snap everything away, including the Guardians of the Multiverse. Tom, zero stars. No, overall,
I thought the action really salvaged this episode despite some of the questionable plot points.
I give this one three stars out of five. Yeah, I'll probably give it three as well. The action
was pretty cool. And I just really liked Uwatu in this episode. Like whenever the watcher
gets involved, I think it's just awesome for some reason. He's not supposed to, but he does
it and it's always interesting. Yeah, I totally agree. Overall, like when averaging the scores
that I gave each episode, and factoring in the whole point about how the concept of the series
has it going against itself, but also figuring the potential that the series could have in
the future. Overall, I give season 1 of What If 3 stars out of 5. I'll always appreciate
What If for its novelty, but in a multiverse where anything is possible, nothing matters.
So to make audiences care, they have to do even better with their stories. Otherwise the show
may as well be called But why? Which is really how I felt with some of these episodes. Absolutely.
Or like, what the fuck? I think Three Stars is pretty fair. Like you mentioned earlier,
each episode was hit or miss. The hits were pretty awesome. The misses were fucking awful.
It's like, why does this even exist? So like almost straight in the middle, Three Stars
is a good rating. It's not horrible, it's passing. But that does it for this review. Let us know
what you thought about what if by writing to us at dyna or by visiting us on Facebook, Instagram,
or Twitter. You can find links to all of our accounts by checking out our show notes or
visiting our website, dynamicduel.com. And on our site, you can also find a link to our Patreon
page where we offer bonus content, including bonus episodes, monthly live movie watch alongs,
collectible pinsets, and access to our Discord server. Check it out right after this episode.
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Subscribe now to access over 200 archived episodes of this podcast. Our next episode, we are going
to review the DC animated film that comes out the day this episode drops, which is injustice.
I'm really looking forward to this probably more than any other DC animated movie that
I've heard announced. So I probably have to check my expectations, but I expect good things.
We're really looking forward to it, especially after the opening scene that we got to see
during the DC fandom. That was really cool. It's like straight from the comic. I can't
wait to see this movie. But that does it for this episode. We want to give a big thanks
to our executive producers, John Spies, Ken Johnson, Jace Crump, John Storosky, Zachary
Hepburn, John Beccinina, Mitchell Phipps, Steven Lovato, Dustin Balcombe, Salvador Hernandez
Contreras Jr. and Levi Yeaton for helping make this podcast possible. And we'll talk to you
guys next week. Up up and away, true believers.