> Never say never. If there is no shammie/enchanter around to do attack
speed
> debuff, or the enchanter is busy mezzing, I always Chain. The attack
speed
> debuff is just too beneficial, and I don't have slots for both binding and
> chains (I can count on two hands the number of times I've dememmed chains
in
> a dungeon). Yes, most high level mages are smart enough to put away their
> earth pet in dungeon groups, but one in particular (level 49) refused;
that
> was /after/ talking.
You get the same debuff with an AE from binding and you don't break snare,
and you are party friendly. If you made the chains decision with a ranger
or druid in a pick up group from my server and forget ever being invited on
a raid or dungeon crawl again. Maybe here I'm a bit spoiled also since my
guild is primarily shamans and slowing MOBs down usually only becomes my job
on super high magic resist mobs like Ogre Guards. (Not worth the mana when
I can stick my song 50% of the time). I also don't always have chains
loaded... even for backup. A lot of times our method for dealing with
runners when snare fails these days is a BIG blast from our nuker and a BIG
dot from our shaman... Haven't seen anything make it far after that.
Actually on the Efreeti Raid, that is why I was packing binding instead of
chains... Thanks god the other bard had chains :).
> While Chains does break early, it's more the exception than the norm. On
> mobs with a decent magic resistance, they seem to break early, but those
are
> also generally the same cases that I yell "can't chain" and let the druid
do
> their work. Also, I don't have much problem twisting in another song on
> medium blues (usually an attack speed buff, to finish off quicker), and
only
> feel that I HAVE to chain-Chain on high blues or higher.
What level mobs are you fighting? In my experience it is a rule, not
exception. Anything above level 35 or so will tend to break chains at
random times and not last 3 ticks... ever. My charisma is about 125 and
when buffed is about 160 something and my dex is usually buffed out over
200. Do stats play a role here? I still have chains wear off after the
first tick if not sooner fighting low blue greater kobolds in B!
> Unfortunately, with overcrowding being what it is, this isn't true
anymore.
> Heh, we've even let a runner go a couple times in Guk, HOPING he'd bring
> back a train. In the efreeti party example, I've not been on one that
> didn't have both a snarer (usually a druid) and an attack speed debuffer
> (either an enchanter or a shaman). If both are present, and able to do
the
> slowdown and snare, then I cede to them. If either, in a normal hunting
> group, is missing or unable to perform due to other responsibilities, I'm
> chaining.
No argument here. Bards are great when the primary class isn't present. We
seem to have a fantastic ability to fill in the holes of any party and at
least partially make up for any missing class. When they are there and
capable, I always let them have first shot and use my songs as back up for
when they fail. I too have grouped with my brother's druid since level 1
and have the nice added advantage of being in the same room so we don't even
have to coordinate via chat interface. I also rarely end up in crowded
dungeons. The list method on our server means that you can end up waiting 6
to 8 hours for a spot fighting ANYTHING in Guk, and the fact that I'm almost
always playing with my wife's warrior and my brother's druid means that we
don't wait on lists since we need 3 spots, not one. As a result, most of my
dungeon time is spent on organized raids of 2 or more groups going into
places like Sol B or Kedge Keep or doing crawls of places like Paw where it
still isn't that crowded. In these scenarios chains tends not to be a
primary option.
> To clarify:
>
> Chains is not the ONLY song I use in pulling. It gives a great head-start
> for Invis pulling in places like live side Guk. It also means melee mobs
> won't be hitting you all the way back (you can baby step them without
having
> to let them wack on you). I prefered Charm (if low enough) or Pixie when
> pulling casters. A mob generally won't start casting on you unless they
can
> see you (they will, however, finish a spell they started before you ducked
> around the corner).
Guk is different and so is Sol B. I can see using chains there as the
pathing problems are nearly as intense.... I still say that you are asking
for trouble with pixie, charm or chains in places like Paw or Sol A...
I'm starting to see that a lot of our differences have more to do with what
and where we are fighting then how to use the song. I don't tend to need
chains when fighting for XP because in the places I fight at for XP, we
don't care about runners. Oggok bouncers, specs, giants, etc... you simply
don't need to stop these things as they really don't run far and if they do,
so what. I don't think you would disagree with my assessment of chains on
things like Efreeti raids or dungeon crawls though :).
Hmmm, I've always wondered what it would be like to fight for XP in lower
Guk... But I personally don't see myself having that chance anytime in the
near future. Perhaps when the expansion comes out... (well, one could
wish!)
Taneran