Message: 2
Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:27:34 -0800 (PST)
From: Tork <
tdomeii@...>
Subject: UPDATE 2 - we're getting there!
*****
I quite like a lot of these ideas. To save bandwidth, I won't chime in
"neat" or "I like this!" but take it as read wherever I don't make a
comment. = )
*****
1. Party Bind
We did not want a bind song if it was identical to casters, however if the
song allowed you to bind anyone anyplace (melees included) then with spell
reagent costs and mana tolls, we would certainly welcome it, especially at
higher (51+) levels since expansion zones are rumored to be mammoth in
scale.
*****
I don't think, granted that we're getting at level 51+ a song which
duplicates the spell every caster gets by level 14, that this mana cost and
reagent are justified. How often will you USE a party-bind song at 51+
level? I haven't even bothered getting bound in about 5 levels now, at 44 -
and I could get bound any night of the week. There are always casters who
can cast bind (with our clarity their downtime is minimal), so this song has
very limited use at best - it can be hard to find people to bind you, but as
you increase in level you make more and more friends, and this hasn't
troubled me in 30 levels. It's low on my list of desirable songs, and the
mana cost and reagent seem excessive. Unless we can also gate, binding is
NOT a big deal, and of the two gate is 300 times moe useful.
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6. An improved AE DoT with added effect (stamina drain being a common
thread, the other was a lifetap affect). Question at large: do mobs have
stamina and if so, does it impact their ability to fight?
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Granted that DDD is a DoT/AC debuff, and CoC is a DoT/attack speed debuff,
how about a simple AE DoT / resistance debuff? Not unlike the chant series,
granted, but AE and stronger... could be very useful. Another option would
be a DoT / atk rating debuff (so the dumb things HIT us less often).
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7. Upgrade to selo's OR remove hard speed cap.
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Granted we're already NOT getting the full effect of the speed we have, I'd
be terribly upset if they gave us a new song to do what Selo's should
already be doing. We don't need another song. Fix the damn speed cap.
Please please remove this suggestion.
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8. Upgrade to clarity.
Cassandra's Clarified Elegy
Provides clarity2 (whatever that might be) + (limited?) elegy effect.
*****
This effectively mimics enchanters' abilities, with their int/wis buffs and
clarity II. It is not unwarranted nor unbalanced. It removes the need to
weave in elegy and gives increased clarity - in other words just keeps us
*almost* on par with enchanters - they'll still have better int/wis buffs.
John Kim believes bard clarity is better than enchanter clarity, in terms of
mana regen speed. If this is so, I sincerely hope it continues to be the
case 51+. In any case, though, we don't want to lose ground... having
enchanters become better than us at this when right now they are perhaps
inferior, perhaps equal, would disrupt class balance and reduce our
desirability in groups.
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9. Upgrade to MR debuffing abilities.
Denon's Fog of War. AE snare. AE slow attack speed. AE Dot. AE magic
debuff (30 pts at least). effect of fog?
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Please remember that every additional effect you add to a song is another
saving throw by the recipients. A song that has 4 or 5 effects bundled
together is worthless because of the astronomical resist rate. I'd never
use this, because it would rarely stick on deep greens. I'd settle for AE
chains, bu thonestly this is another low-priority song for me - the other
ideas here are far better in my opinion.
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10. One-way teleport (self only? to bard guild?).
*****
Please DON"T remove this. I think being able to get some very limited (and
preferably random) teleporting abilities keeps us the jack-of-all-trades we
were designed to be. We'll never have the control or versatility of a
wizard or druid... but being able to port to cities is something nobody can
do right now. It's a great tool for leaving dungeons, while druids and
wizards remain best qualified to get parties TO dungeons. The control and
abundance of druid/wizard ports will still make them the preferred mode of
travel in most cases. You want to get to High Pass or Rivervale? Bards can
get you within 5 zones... wizards and druids can get you within from 1 to 3
zones, depending. Self or group... if it's group it ought to probably take
half our mana... so you get 2 shots at arriving where you want to (33%
chance of any bard guild).
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11. Mem blur song.
Fitful's Forgetful Improv
Voice
Causes the target to become so fixated on the improv that it forgets
whatever else it was dong. Drawback: Bard possibly left on hate list.
*****
A mem blur that leaves only the bard on the hate list? Ouch. LOADING
PLEASE WAIT... we don't need this, we have plenty of tools to taunt with
right now (Chains, for example, has a VERY high taunt rating, and far
greater combat utility).
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12. Upgraded Atk Song
Since we are out speed buffed by enchanters, a straight addition to Atk
with an added component. Most commonly heard suggestion: rune type
shielding. Other suggestions: massive ac bonus, massive regeneration
effect, massive MR buff.
*****
Problem with rune shielding is simply that we refresh our songs every 6
seconds. A song that lowers the damage received instead of making us immune
to a certain amount of damage is far more balanced. Say the song reduces
damage received by (level/2 or level/3). At level 60, you could weave this
and hymn and almost (but not quite) ignore a mob of VERY low greens. It
would help fights against high-level monsters some, but not too much granted
their damage output will be in hundreds of points per blow.
*****
16. Serious upgrade to healing. (NB: of all the issues brough up, this
needs the most serious analysis btw.)
Currently at 50th with a store bought lute:
Niv´┐¢s=15 hp/tick
Hymn=17 hp/tick
Total=roughly 30hp/tick
Typical mobs encountered at that level hit in low 100´┐¢s, double hit 100% of
the time and have an approximate delay of 25. As a damage per second
figure, that approaches 80 damage/second, 3 seconds/tick, 240 damage/tick.
*****
Ummm it's 6 seconds per tick. A tick is not the startup time for a song
(3.0 seconds), it's how much time elapses in between pulses when you leave a
song running. This means your figures are all off by 50%. = (
*****
17. Melanie´┐¢s Call to Arms
I came up with a song that is the opposite of Melanie's Mellifluous
Motion. A song that teleports all party members in the zone to the bards
location.
Name: Melanie's Call to Arms
This song would be extremely useful in conjunction with a binding group
leader.
*****
Maybe I just need more caffeine, but I don't see how the place where the
group is bound or who bound them has any impact on the utility of this song.
Anyone who can cast gate can already bind anywhere. All in all a great
idea for a song and one with many many many uses. Trying to get deep into
dangerous territory? Wait at the zone while the crazy bard sneaks in,
risking life and limb. I LOVE it - this would make bards far more desirable
in groups, no question. I suspect due to the huge utility of such a song
that they'd want to limit it somehow... mana or reagents, bah.
*****
19. On mana regeneration and putting ´┐¢no mana´┐¢ into perspective, by John H.
Kim ;)
*****
I love this summary. However, it is not a song suggestion, but a guideline
for song creation. It ought therefore to be in the preface or conclusion,
rather than in the middle of the song list.
I feel you ought to address somewhere in this document the guidelines for
functionality of bards songs at 51+. Among the isseus to be addressed would
be the balance of bard/enchanter clarity (i.e. don't change the balance,
whatever it might be - enchanters getting clarity II has many bards
concerned); the speed cap on Selo's; the scale of damage of our targeted
damage songs (Bellow and the chants just don't do meaningful damage at level
50, so they need rescaling or replacement at 51+); and the current status of
lullaby (it is demonstrably broken, no word yet). These are not song
suggestions, but rather observations about the manner in which our existig
songs will be used and useful at 51+.
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20. Upgraded mez capabilities.
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Granted we have broken mes songs now, I really don't want an upgraded broken
song, nor to replace my broken songs 35 levels later with working ones.
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22. What'd I forget?
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Upgrade to Cinda's Charismatic Carillon. Possibilities include party-wide
carillon, identical to existing one; or bard-only improved action song which
works simultaneously on all factions (either exactly like existing so or
simply setting EVERY mob in a zone to indifferent).
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*****
Rokenn's song:
Selo's Shooting Star
Instrument: Percussion
Effect: Group, a combination of Selo's Accelerando, Shauri's Sonorous
Clouding, and Agilmente's Aria of Eagles with infravision. Be great fun for
traveling
Please include this as one of the desirable songs - it has great utility and
would simplify travel immensely. Also note that right now it is impossible
to move quickly and invisibly, or levitate invisibly, so this song adds
something we cannot currently do.
*****
*****
How about a charisma buff? It'd be very useful when woven with our mental
songs (charm, fear, mes, lull, etc).
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*****
Force shock-style song, which knocks the target back and does some DD damage
- this is an upgrade to Bellow, with the fun Tentacle-terror effect. Could
be made AE or targeted - more useful if targeted of course.
*****
*****
Illusions! Self-only, party-wide, anything! GIVE US ILLUSIONS! I want to
be able to pretend to be other things, other races, anything... just the
ability to muck about with illusions would be great. Don't give us the
perks enchanters get from their illusions if it's "overpowered" and
"unbalanced" (bwahahaha) but let us have at high levels something enchanters
can do their whole careers!
*****
Aloro Silvertongue (E'ci)
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