>From: "G.W. Willman, IV" <gww6e@...>
>Oh a semi-unrelated note: I've recently moved to very quick, light damage
>weapons when I melee - combine dual wield with warsong or anthem you are
>literally the tazmanian devil of meleeers. I got to thinking however, how
>does dual wield really work? Someone speculated that its keyed off your
>primary hand (every swing = chance for dual wield to go off as well). This
>would suggest getting something like a dirk in the primary and then a heavy
>hitter/proc'ing weapon in the offhand, since you could cheat the system in
>affect if your heavy hitter had a chance to hit quicker than its normal
>delay. I haven't experimented, but can anyone elaborate on dual wield
>stragies?
>
>Thanks,
>-GW
><Scummy & Sicarius @ Veeshan>
Orignally posted by "J.M. Capozzi" to
eqbards@onelist.com
Here's a few hard numbers to chew on:
The actual formula for double attack is (SKILL+LEVEL)/500, with the integer
converted to a percentage. 50th level with 200 skill equals 250/500, with
..50 being the result. 50 percent chance to double attack. Monks cap at 250
in DA, all other classes cap at 200. For dual wield, it's (SKILL+LEVEL)/600.
50th level with 200 skill equals 40 percent. Monks cap in Dual Wield at
250, and rogues cap at 210. All other classes cap at 200. Also, once dual
wield exceeds 149 in skill, checks are made to see if you double attack with
the secondary as well, provided you have double attack as a skill. This
check is based on your dual wield skill, and its corresponding percentage
chance. [For those of you wondering why monks get such a bonus in DA/DW,
keep in mind that monk hand speed never drops below 30. They need the
increased attacks to remain competitive with other melee classes who can use
faster weapons, weapons with proc effects, etc.]
I'm not going to bore you all to tears with all the charting and the
formulae used, Monte Carlo simulations, how the fixed damage bonuses due to
strength, offense and weapons skills seriously skew the results in favor of
speed, and about half a dozen other variables. Most of those numbers are
intentionally and forever hidden from the end users view. Suffice it to say
with two weapons of a given efficiency, the faster will always win out in
terms of real damage in any time period beyond 30 seconds. And, the faster
the weapon is (while maintaining the same eff. rating), the wider the gap in
damage results between it and the slower weapon.
Here's an example: Using round numbers here, and mythical weapons, both with
a .25 efficiency rating, a 5 dam/20 delay and a 10dam/40 delay weapon. All
results assume a 50th level player, with 200 in all his combat skills, and
100 STR. The 5 dam/20 delay weapon will outperform a 10dam/40 delay weapon
by about 27 percent in a two minute time period, in the primary. If you
have double attack, it goes up to 44 percent, thanks to double the amount of
DA activation checks. It will outperform by 39 percent if used in the
secondary, mainly thanks to twice as many DW activation checks. If your
class is capable of 'quad' attacks (see above), it goes up to a staggering
73 percent overall spread between the faster and the slower weapons.
Now, this is an extreme example, most real world weapons aren't that
polarized. But you can still expect a marked advantage over the faster
weapon. Enough of an advantage to even sacrifice some small amount of
efficiency in favor of speed. A well balanced scimitar, (5 dam/21 delay,
..238 eff rating), outdoes a barbed leather whip,( 7 dam/28 delay, .25 eff
rating), by 14 percent in a two minute period used as the primary, and 19
percent as the secondary. At 50th level, in pure melee combat, two minutes
is pretty close to how long a typical fight lasts. Drop the time period
down to one minute, the gap narrows, but is still evident. Drop it down to
30 seconds, it's a dead heat, still. Anything less than 30 seconds tends to
favor the whip. You can run this trend down all the way to 17th level for a
bard, and the corresponding skill levels, the spread remains the same for
primary weapons, and reaches it's narrowest point with secondary, but it's
still within 10 percent of the peak spread. This, by the way, totally
disregards the target's defense, assuming a randomized hit with every swing.
If you factor in the highly variable factors of target defense and AC,
first you go nuts, then you come up with results even more in favor of the
faster weapon, as you get more chances to hit as well.
There are some cases, though, where the raw damage numbers DO matter.
Fighting mobs with damage shields(druids, fire elementals, etc), it's best
to use a slower, heavier damage weapon, to minimize the damage YOU take. For
a Rogue, your backstab damage is predicated on the amount of normal melee
damage you can inflict with one hit, as backstab is simply a fixed
multiplier(based on skill and level) on a normally resolved pierce attack.
Higher the base number, the bigger the backstab. If you take a look at the
good 2h weapons, you'll find they are generally *much* more efficient than a
1h weapon, by as much as 100 percent. They HAVE to be, to make up for being
so much slower than the 1h counterparts, and to compete with dual wield. 2h
weapons, especially 2h slash, are purpose designed to be the most efficient
weapons in the game. They don't break the above results, at all, but the
natural efficiency brings the curve around again, offsetting reduced attack
chances.