----- Original Message -----
From: <eqbards@onelist.com>
To: <eqbards@onelist.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 7:23 PM
Subject: [eqbards] Digest Number 363

>
> >
> There are 25 messages in this issue.
>
> Topics in today's digest:
>
> 1. Re: Question about the teleport song
> From: kim@...
> 2. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> 3. Re: Question about the teleport song
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> 4. RE: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> 5. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4"
<g4mntofcr@...>
> 6. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> 7. Re: Question about the teleport song
> From: "JasonF" <JasonF@...>
> 8. Bards vs Clerics in melee
> From: "Wayne Sheppard" <mrwayne@...>
> 9. Re: Bards vs Clerics in melee
> From: <kim@...>
> 10. RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Blair, Keith (Keith Blair)" <kblair@...>
> 11. RE: Bards vs Clerics in melee
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> 12. RE: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Blair, Keith (Keith Blair)" <kblair@...>
> 13. Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> 14. Re: Binding in evil cities
> From: "Frank Hartmann" <FRANHART@...>
> 15. Re: Petiton to replace level 14 song
> From: Zoie <valkry@...>
> 16. RE: gandering and Tommy Lee was Petiton to replace level 14 song
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> 17. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> 18. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> 19. RE: Question about the teleport song
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> 20. RE: Petiton to replace level 14 song
> From: Greg Gillan <GGillan@...>
> 21. Re: Question about the teleport song
> From: Abraham Hardjana <ahardjan@...>
> 22. Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Frank Hartmann" <FRANHART@...>
> 23. Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: Mike.Langlois@...
> 24. Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> 25. RE: Crysknife (OT) -- SPOILER
> From: "Kyle Sibbald" <ksibbald@...>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:40:24 -0400 (EDT)
> From: kim@...
> Subject: Re: Question about the teleport song
>
> On Thu, 23 Sep 1999, Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4 wrote:
> >
> > of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long time, was
wondering
> > if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I sing that song
> > while at the top of the village (or any high altitude location), will I
> > appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a result take lots
of
> > damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground wherever the song
> > sends me to?
>
> 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> Effect: Random teleport
> Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> Target: Party
> Does not stack with: N/A
> Taunt: ??
>
> Quantified: ??
>
> Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random distance in a
> random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on level and whether
> or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been marginally useful
> as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group member to a
> different random location. It will not teleport you through walls or
> closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
>
> Strategies:
>
> - Useful for instantly coming down from high places, like the top of
> the Aviak Village, or the wizard teleport site spires.
>
> - This used to be useful if you got dragged up a portcullis (Paw and
> Permafrost), but they changed it so it doesn't work through walls
> anymore. Once you're dragged up, you have walls on both sides so
> you won't teleport anywhere. Still, it's worth a shot, especially
> if you're not completely pulled up inside the portcullis. Make sure
> you disband from the rest of your party so they are not flung around.
>
> - It can function as a poor escape tool. It could teleport you far
> enough from the mobs that you have enough time to run for the zone
> without being hit from behind. Of course in the time it takes to
> start this song, you could start Accelerando and accomplish the same
> thing.
>
> Cautions:
>
> - A good way to get your party members pissed off at you, since everyone
> teleports to different locations. Of course if that's your intent...
>
> - Generally a good way to get killed quickly. I've teleported right
> into a full spawn of level 30ish goblins in Permafrost while trying
> to get a friend unstuck.
>
> - The song will place you at ground level, which for bodies of water
> means at the bottom. If it's dark and/or the water is murky, you can
> easily become disoriented and drown before reaching the surface. So
> make sure you consider this possibility if you're using it near water.
>
> --
> John H. Kim
> kim@...
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:45:42 -0500
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> I tested it from the top floor. You appear on the ground some distance
> away. The song takes 5 seconds to "re-act" so if you plan to use it "plan
> ahead" Ie: don't wait until someone is at a sliver of hp - it takes 5
> seconds (2 good rounds of Avo attacks) for the song to stick. The down
side
> is the party members will be spread out and somewhat disoriented - so
brief
> them ahead of time and even test it for fun.
>
> But having been camping KFC (so delete me) for more levels than I care to
> admit, I can now run to the top floor - with Selo's and the drum and pull
> birds without a problem. The first time I went up there - I fell to my
> death just being disoriented and missing the small ramp. Practice,
> practice, practice! Now (or even 2 levels ago - prolly around 25) I can
> jump off the top floor and live (I lose 3 bubbles of health though so its
> not a viable option for pulling.)
>
> Also, if you move somewhere that causes the mob that is attacking you
> "pathing problems" (ie it for some reason cannot find a good way to run
> after you - like some people who try to "safe zone" or trap mobs against
> terrain features) the mobs will now "teleport" to your immediate vicinity
> and continue their attack. So, if you Melfious Motion and evacuate - the
> mobs will be along shortly - so you better immediately make tracks for the
> zone!
>
> Sylly
>
> p.s. aviaks are sometimes called "chickens" - you can guess why we call it
> KFC
>
> p.s.s. memorize this: /ooc Paw neg 3200 pos 800
> (you will be typing that a lot if you hunt at Aviaks)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4
> [mailto:g4mntofcr@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 1:22 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: [eqbards] Question about the teleport song
>
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4"
> <g4mntofcr@...>
>
> I was fighting last night at the top of the aviak village in
> South Karana.
> Fortunately everything went well and I never had to flee for
> the zone border
> to escape death. Had I been forced to do so I probably
> wouldn't have
> survived because of the numerous ramps you have to use to
> get to the bottom
> of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long time,
> was wondering
> if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I
> sing that song
> while at the top of the village (or any high altitude
> location), will I
> appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a result
> take lots of
> damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground
> wherever the song
> sends me to?
>
> Thanks
> Galtin of E'ci
>
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>
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>
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>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:43:35 -0500
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> Subject: Re: Question about the teleport song
>
> >- The song will place you at ground level, which for bodies of water
> > means at the bottom. If it's dark and/or the water is murky, you can
> > easily become disoriented and drown before reaching the surface. So
> > make sure you consider this possibility if you're using it near water.
>
>
> I also found that, at least in Kithicor, once in the water it would never
> teleport me out. Ya it could have been a bad run on the number generator,
> but in an hour or more of random teleports (*laughs*, so I was bored and
> didn't know I couldn't go through walls) once I hit the water I stayed.
> Still, it might have been that wacky random number generator.
>
> Tszaaz E'Taurguin
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 12:47:57 -0600
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> Subject: RE: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
> My load times are from 2-4 minutes usually more towards 2. I have seen
> people playin this game with load times of 5 minutes, but how they do it I
> can't imagine. Those people actually have a far greater danger than you
do
> and can often die trying to zone out of Grobb. It isn't they won't live
> with danger, its that for many the danger is far greater than for those
who
> have DSL or better.
>
> Also for most the danger is intolerable because a guard can kill them in 4
> hits. Many people don't go to Guk until they are far higher in level than
> was really intended. I haven't gotten too many trains there because the
> blue froggies don't run they fight me till they die. Its easy to snare
the
> few that do run generally. Convincing my groupmates who don't have
> Acellerando to go is very difficult though.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Frank Hartmann [mailto:FRANHART@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 11:32 AM
> To: eqbards@onelist.com
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: [eqbards] Why do the melee classes keep wanting
> Bind?
>
>
> From: "Frank Hartmann" <FRANHART@...>
>
> Sounds like you've had some bad experiences in Grobb. My condolences. The
> /quit does work, I have had to use it myself. My load times are fairly
fast,
> so maybe that's the difference.
>
> I still consider binding in evil cities an option. Others don't because
they
> choose not to play with that level of danger. That's alright, I respect
> that. I just am tired of hearing melee classes whine that the ONLY way to
> fight in Cazic or Guk is to be bound in Freeport and that they hate the
long
> run back. It's not the ONLY way. It just may be the only way for some
> individuals depending upon their danger tolerance level.
>
> Keledal
> Bard of Erollisi Marr
>
>
> >>> "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...> 09/23 10:44 AM >>>
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
>
> Yeah that's a good one. You don't get to hit /quit or any other command.
> You die before you zone in on your client as you zone in on the server for
a
> bit before you appear on the client side. All you see is a never ending
> stream of Loading...Please wait messages. No command bar, no reports of
> damage, no view of Grobb, nothing, period. And your supposed safe spot
may
> also be the real spot for a guard that's been trained temporarily
elsewhere
> which is worse if you don't know it. He then returns to his spot every
time
> the server is reset, if he ever leaves it. How do I know all this,
there's
> a lower level Kitasi on Solusek that was my first bard who listened to a
> monk and got bound in Grobb. Went from 12th to 9th before they lowered
the
> death penalty before I realized it wasn't some glitch and reset my
computer.
> Needless to say he hasn't seen any action since as I moved to a server
where
> I had friends who could bind. Also only the time alive counts towards the
> 30seconds. The time passing thru the Loading period doesn't so you die
> however many times that guard can kill you before you react and cut the
> connection plus the 30+ seconds of linkdead.
>
> Kitasi
>
> Also, there is no excuse for any player to die 20 times in a row in one of
> these unfortunate instances. If you respawn and are immediately attacked
by
> a guard at your bind point, you need to use the /quit command. This
> immediately exits you from the game without the 30 second camping wait.
You
> may need to wait a few minutes for that guard to return to his post before
> reentering the game, or you may have to resort to moving the guard with a
> mule character. Such are the dangers inherent in binding in enemy
territory.
> But again, that does not mean it's not feasible. Just dangerous.
Everyone's
> personal limit of danger varies.
>
> Keledal
> Bard of Erollisi Marr
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 19:53:28 +0100
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4" <g4mntofcr@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> Thanks John. Since I'm gonna try my hat at soloing for a while, think I
> might start having this song memorized. Its too bad that it won't
teleport
> the entire party to the same random location. Do you guys think this is
> something that we should ask Verant to consider changing somewhere down
the
> road? Since it would help the entire party, and doesn't impact solo play
at
> all, it shouldn't be a class balance issue.
>
> Galtin of E'ci
>
> > of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long time, was
> > wondering
> > > if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I sing that
song
> > > while at the top of the village (or any high altitude location), will
I
> > > appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a result take lots
> > of
> > > damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground wherever the
song
> > > sends me to?
> >
> > 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> > Effect: Random teleport
> > Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> > Target: Party
> > Does not stack with: N/A
> > Taunt: ??
> >
> > Quantified: ??
> >
> > Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random distance in a
> > random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on level and
whether
> > or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been marginally
useful
> > as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group member to a
> > different random location. It will not teleport you through walls or
> > closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
> >
> >
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 12:57:37 -0600
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> Curious, will the teleport work thru doors that have a crack around the
> opening? Might be a way into huts that are broken or locked. Might take
> forever to hit the crack, but who knows?
>
> Kitasi the ever curious
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4 [mailto:g4mntofcr@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 12:53 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport song
>
>
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4" <g4mntofcr@...>
>
> Thanks John. Since I'm gonna try my hat at soloing for a while, think I
> might start having this song memorized. Its too bad that it won't
teleport
> the entire party to the same random location. Do you guys think this is
> something that we should ask Verant to consider changing somewhere down
the
> road? Since it would help the entire party, and doesn't impact solo play
at
> all, it shouldn't be a class balance issue.
>
> Galtin of E'ci
>
> > of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long time, was
> > wondering
> > > if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I sing that
song
> > > while at the top of the village (or any high altitude location), will
I
> > > appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a result take lots
> > of
> > > damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground wherever the
song
> > > sends me to?
> >
> > 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> > Effect: Random teleport
> > Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> > Target: Party
> > Does not stack with: N/A
> > Taunt: ??
> >
> > Quantified: ??
> >
> > Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random distance in a
> > random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on level and
whether
> > or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been marginally
useful
> > as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group member to a
> > different random location. It will not teleport you through walls or
> > closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:04:09 -0500
> From: "JasonF" <JasonF@...>
> Subject: Re: Question about the teleport song
>
> You can ask, but they won't change it. In fact I don't think it should be
> changed. A lot of the bard songs are tweaked with some slight drawback
over
> the caster's version of the same thing, and this is the way it needs to
be.
> We can wait until everyone is called "oom" before we hit MMM and have a
> mana-less evac. This advantage (not using mana) is really quite powerful
and
> simply must be offset slightly in some way.
>
> Crier Sharpsong - 23rd Bard on Fennin Ro
>
> 24th for about 30 minutes last night, but the new sparklies caught the
> attention of a Cyclopes in Rathe Mountains.
>
> Welcome to level 23!
>
>
> Jason A. Farqu´┐¢
> CDI at http://www.pigging.com/
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4 <g4mntofcr@...>
> To: <eqbards@onelist.com>
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 1:53 PM
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport song
>
>
> > From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4" <g4mntofcr@...>
> >
> > Thanks John. Since I'm gonna try my hat at soloing for a while, think I
> > might start having this song memorized. Its too bad that it won't
teleport
> > the entire party to the same random location. Do you guys think this is
> > something that we should ask Verant to consider changing somewhere down
the
> > road? Since it would help the entire party, and doesn't impact solo
play at
> > all, it shouldn't be a class balance issue.
> >
> > Galtin of E'ci
> >
> > > of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long time, was
> > > wondering
> > > > if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I sing that
song
> > > > while at the top of the village (or any high altitude location),
will I
> > > > appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a result take
lots
> > > of
> > > > damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground wherever the
song
> > > > sends me to?
> > >
> > > 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> > > Effect: Random teleport
> > > Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> > > Target: Party
> > > Does not stack with: N/A
> > > Taunt: ??
> > >
> > > Quantified: ??
> > >
> > > Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random distance in a
> > > random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on level and
whether
> > > or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been marginally
useful
> > > as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group member to a
> > > different random location. It will not teleport you through walls or
> > > closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:09:54 -0400
> From: "Wayne Sheppard" <mrwayne@...>
> Subject: Bards vs Clerics in melee
>
> > Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 11:38:34 -0400 (EDT)
> > From: <kim@...>
> > Subject: Re: Bards vs Clerics in melee
> >
> >
> > My point is that a class whose specialty is supposed to be
> > healing is better at combat than we are. I suppose you could
> > argue that we're not supposed to be very good at combat
> > either, but still I'd like to be better than the class whose
> > purpose is anti-killing.
>
> [mini cleric topic]
> Just to clear up any misconceptions here are the Cleric DD spells
> Lvl - Dam/mana - Name
> 1 - 10/12 - Strike
> 5 - 19/20 - Furor
> 14 - 83/70 - Smite
> 29 - 200/145 - Wrath
> 44 - 510/240 - Resolution
>
> As you can see, these are some of the worst DD spells in the game. And
> after level 14, there is a 15 level gap before an improvement. The levels
> just before a spell upgrade are the hardest, as you are using spells from
14
> levels ago. I do believe that Clerics are positioned just about right for
> DD spells, as they do have better defence compared to all other pure
> casters. There are some sweet spots just after they get a new spell where
> they can solo somewhat, but there are dead spots where they are very
> ineffective with DD spells.
>
> [back to bards]
> Here was the original message I replied to:
> > As a result, [hybrids] get magic
> > plus superior battle skills. Since our battle skills are less than all
> > other hybrids...really on par with clerics if truth be told,
> > then perhaps we can get a
> > pure caster attribute like bind to make up for it.
>
> Ok, instead of arguing about the battle worthness of a Bard I should have
> just used your own argument against you. The level 14 song was a pure
> caster type song. Only pure casters got the identify spell. You felt
that
> bards needed a pure caster type song, and you already had it. Happy now?
>
>
> If any class (Bards for example) get binding, there will be a major uproar
> from all other classes without binding. I mean MAJOR UPROAR. So it
doesn't
> matter what kind of Vulcan logic you use to argue that Bards need binding
it
> won't happen. Putting BardBind in your petition will do no good at all,
and
> probably cause Verant to not fully consider the rest of your petition.
>
> What you need to ask for is to have all classes be able to bind anywhere
(or
> maybe just Inns) they choose instead of just a city. Verant is much more
> likely to consider something that would be fair to all classes, and not
just
> for Bards.
>
>
> Wayne
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:29:58 -0400 (EDT)
> From: <kim@...>
> Subject: Re: Bards vs Clerics in melee
>
> On Thu, 23 Sep 1999, Wayne Sheppard wrote:
> > [back to bards]
> > Here was the original message I replied to:
> > > As a result, [hybrids] get magic
> > > plus superior battle skills. Since our battle skills are less than
all
> > > other hybrids...really on par with clerics if truth be told,
> > > then perhaps we can get a
> > > pure caster attribute like bind to make up for it.
> >
> > Ok, instead of arguing about the battle worthness of a Bard I should
have
> > just used your own argument against you. The level 14 song was a pure
> > caster type song. Only pure casters got the identify spell. You felt
that
> > bards needed a pure caster type song, and you already had it. Happy
now?
> >
> > If any class (Bards for example) get binding, there will be a major
uproar
>
> I didn't write that. :-) I am absolutely against bards
> getting bind. The only thing I was arguing for in this line
> of discussion is that our defensive melee skills need to be
> increased a bit.
>
> --
> John H. Kim
> kim@...
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:36:15 -0600
> From: "Blair, Keith (Keith Blair)" <kblair@...>
> Subject: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
> > Also, there is no excuse for any player to die 20 times in a
> > row in one of these unfortunate instances. If you respawn and
> > are immediately attacked by a guard at your bind point, you
> > need to use the /quit command. This immediately exits you
>
> I don't know about you, but I know for a fact that you appear
> on the other side of a zone or respawn before you're actually
> given control of your character again. I've had many a times
> where I was zoning and could hear myself being attacked but
> was still waiting for my screen to show me what was going on
> and allow me to fight back. With guards and any character of
> low level, a couple hits and you're dead before you even get
> to see what happened, or type anything.
>
> I'd still like to see how you expect to get past the Grobb
> guards that sit outside the entrance in the first place. Let's
> say you in fact are level 19 or higher and you have your invis
> song. You get past the guards, get bound just inside the tunnel
> and all is well. Now you're dead. You have no invis. You can't
> go to the bank. Luckily no guards have been dragged to the zone
> border. You have to figure out how to get past the
> guards outside. How do you propose this is done?
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:36:57 -0600
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> Subject: RE: Bards vs Clerics in melee
>
> The mere fact that there would be a MAJOR UPROAR makes it obvious that not
> being able to bind is a far more serious detriment than you would have us
> believe. Binding is bar-none the most powerful ability in the game,
period.
> There is no ability that makes up for it nor any package of abilities that
> does so balance-wise.
>
> To call Clerics pure casters is a joke. Clerics and Shamans are hybrids
> plain and simple. Both can melee effectively at some levels and sit back
> and cast at other levels. Pure casters are never effective at melee.
There
> are four Pure caster classes in this game. Magician, Enchanter, Wizard,
and
> Necromancer. Clerics, Druids and Shamans are hybrids that lean heavily to
> caster. Shadowknights, Rangers, and Paladins are hybrids that lean
heavily
> towards melee. Balance would suggest that Bards are hybrids that lean
> neither way. We get the worst of both worlds for the most part. The
lousy
> defensive skills of the caster hybrids and the lousy offensive spells of
the
> melee hybrids.
>
> It takes a particular type of person to have fun playing a bard. Bards
can
> be fun to play, no doubt about it, but those who find them so, myself
> included, would have fun playing a bard no matter what the abilities were
> just because that's the type of people we are. I'd just like to be able
to
> have as much fun playing the class I am most attracted to as my friends do
> playing the class they are most attracted to. Right now, character
> balance-wise, that ain't happenin'.
>
> Oh and the Identify spell isn't the only spell those pure casters get at
> that level is it? In fact it isnt even one of 4 per level group but more
> like 1 of 8 or ten. also our 12th level DD does 7 points of damage max.
> Yeah we can cast it a lot if we don't cast anything else since none of our
> spells have the 45+ minute duration of cleric buffs.
>
> Kitasi the exasperated
>
> [mini cleric topic]
> Just to clear up any misconceptions here are the Cleric DD spells
> Lvl - Dam/mana - Name
> 1 - 10/12 - Strike
> 5 - 19/20 - Furor
> 14 - 83/70 - Smite
> 29 - 200/145 - Wrath
> 44 - 510/240 - Resolution
>
> As you can see, these are some of the worst DD spells in the game. And
> after level 14, there is a 15 level gap before an improvement. The levels
> just before a spell upgrade are the hardest, as you are using spells from
14
> levels ago. I do believe that Clerics are positioned just about right for
> DD spells, as they do have better defence compared to all other pure
> casters. There are some sweet spots just after they get a new spell where
> they can solo somewhat, but there are dead spots where they are very
> ineffective with DD spells.
>
> [back to bards]
> Here was the original message I replied to:
> > As a result, [hybrids] get magic
> > plus superior battle skills. Since our battle skills are less than all
> > other hybrids...really on par with clerics if truth be told,
> > then perhaps we can get a
> > pure caster attribute like bind to make up for it.
>
> Ok, instead of arguing about the battle worthness of a Bard I should have
> just used your own argument against you. The level 14 song was a pure
> caster type song. Only pure casters got the identify spell. You felt
that
> bards needed a pure caster type song, and you already had it. Happy now?
>
>
> If any class (Bards for example) get binding, there will be a major uproar
> from all other classes without binding. I mean MAJOR UPROAR. So it
doesn't
> matter what kind of Vulcan logic you use to argue that Bards need binding
it
> won't happen. Putting BardBind in your petition will do no good at all,
and
> probably cause Verant to not fully consider the rest of your petition.
>
> What you need to ask for is to have all classes be able to bind anywhere
(or
> maybe just Inns) they choose instead of just a city. Verant is much more
> likely to consider something that would be fair to all classes, and not
just
> for Bards.
>
>
> Wayne
>
>
>
>
>
>
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___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:39:24 -0600
> From: "Blair, Keith (Keith Blair)" <kblair@...>
> Subject: RE: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
> > the long run back. It's not the ONLY way. It just may be the
> > only way for some individuals depending upon their danger
> > tolerance level.
>
> At level 15 when I first entered Guk that *was* the only way.
> There was absolutely no way for me to get past the Troll
> guards outside of Grobb in order to be bound there. That's
> not a tolerance level. That's a reality.
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:42:11 -0500
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
> >> the long run back. It's not the ONLY way. It just may be the
> >> only way for some individuals depending upon their danger
> >> tolerance level.
> >
> >At level 15 when I first entered Guk that *was* the only way.
> >There was absolutely no way for me to get past the Troll
> >guards outside of Grobb in order to be bound there. That's
> >not a tolerance level. That's a reality.
>
>
> This whole thing strikes me as a simple troll (hee!) post. Clearly good
> aligned characters being bound in evil cities is absurd. Monks could sneak
> it at one point great. All the danger tolerance level in the world doesn't
> make it s SMART thing to do (as outlined by John, the hours lost due to
> death don't make up for the running time). No amount of machismo makes the
> argument make any sense at all. I would suggest we not fuel the trolls fun
> any longer.
>
> Tszaaz E'Taurguin
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:11:11 -0600
> From: "Frank Hartmann" <FRANHART@...>
> Subject: Re: Binding in evil cities
>
> Oops. You're right. I hit a wrong note on that one. Invisibilty isn't a
viable means of escape within evil cities without the flute. However, it
does come in handy when in Feerrott or Innothule. Remember, those 5th level
lizardman scouts carry the scout fife almost all the time. You just whack
one of them hand to hand (easy to do), get their flute and now you can use
invisibility for the rest of the trip back.
>
> Keledal
> Bard of Erollisi Marr
>
> >>> "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4" <g4mntofcr@...> 09/23
11:47 AM >>>
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4" <g4mntofcr@...>
>
> I'd like to know how you are able to sing the invis song to get past the
> guards in evil cities. How do you get your spare flute (required to sing
> invis song) out of the bank? The only way I could see this scenario
working
> is if you were bound at the bank of the evil city and the banker/guards in
> the bank don't attack you on sight. I have always assumed this was not a
> viable option for non-evil races because the banker and guards in the bank
> would attack you on sight before you had a chance to get your flute.
>
> Galtin ofE'ci
>
> > We as bards have a much easier time being bound in evil cities. After we
> > die, we can invis past the guards, we can use our sneak ability (rogues
> > have it even easier because they can sneak and hide at the same time) or
> > with Selo's we can attempt to even just run right past them to the
nearest
> > zone (you might get whacked a time or two as you go speeding past
though).
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
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___
>
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___
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:24:08 -0400
> From: Zoie <valkry@...>
> Subject: Re: Petiton to replace level 14 song
>
> Elwyn,
>
> If you aren't the groom, you shouldn't be "gandering" the bride, and if
you
> are....Verant kindly left us many empty rooms to find (but how 'bout a
suite w/
> a hot tub?). Go off and have a nice cozy RP (but use /g or /t for your
evening
> please....we don't need the Norrath version of the Pam/Tommy video)
;)
>
> > I didn't mean to imply that *I* look like Pamela Lee, merely that I
enjoy to
> > gander certain members of the finer sex, and I don't find any problem
with
> > these resemblances <grins>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:30:26 -0600
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> Subject: RE: gandering and Tommy Lee was Petiton to replace level 14 song
>
> Oh that should make for some interesting conversations. Now we just need
a
> petition to replace some of the PvP zones with Adult zones.
>
> You walk into Hogcaller's third story...
>
> Warning, You have entered an Adult area if your Station is underage
> you will be booted in thirty seconds.
>
> To be followed with Loading...Please wait
> for anyone underage.
>
> And don't give me any guff about what if my kid is playing on my account
> stuff as that's a violation of the user agreement anyhow no matter how
> common it might be.
>
> Kitasi (Obviously bored at work)
>
> From: Zoie <valkry@...>
> If you aren't the groom, you shouldn't be "gandering" the bride, and if
you
> are....Verant kindly left us many empty rooms to find (but how 'bout a
suite
> w/
> a hot tub?). Go off and have a nice cozy RP (but use /g or /t for your
> evening
> please....we don't need the Norrath version of the Pam/Tommy video)
;)
>
> > I didn't mean to imply that *I* look like Pamela Lee, merely that I
enjoy
> to
> > gander certain members of the finer sex, and I don't find any problem
with
> > these resemblances <grins>
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:35:00 -0500
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> Here is a little trick you can maybe do to at least see inside locked huts
> or buildings:
>
> stand right up close to it - like you are pressing your nose against the
> wall
> then click sit
> when you go thru the sitting down animation - you will get quick glimpse
> into the building
>
> The only place I have done this is at Herman's House in SK. I kinda like
> his d´┐¢cor - Early Tunare Hut style <g>
>
> Sylly.
>
> p.s. I tried one time to target him as I caught a glimpse of him but could
> not click fast enough
> p.s.s. yes, I know to use an AreaEffect on him
> p.s.s.s. I am half-elf - not sure if body size has anything to do with
> getting a view as you sit
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kimes, Dean W. [mailto:Dean_Kimes@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 1:58 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport
> song
>
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
>
> Curious, will the teleport work thru doors that have a crack
> around the
> opening? Might be a way into huts that are broken or
> locked. Might take
> forever to hit the crack, but who knows?
>
> Kitasi the ever curious
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4
> [mailto:g4mntofcr@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 12:53 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport song
>
>
> From: "Reece, Tom - 25IDL G4"
> <g4mntofcr@...>
>
> Thanks John. Since I'm gonna try my hat at soloing for a
> while, think I
> might start having this song memorized. Its too bad that it
> won't teleport
> the entire party to the same random location. Do you guys
> think this is
> something that we should ask Verant to consider changing
> somewhere down the
> road? Since it would help the entire party, and doesn't
> impact solo play at
> all, it shouldn't be a class balance issue.
>
> Galtin of E'ci
>
> > of the village. Since I won't get levitate for a long
> time, was
> > wondering
> > > if the teleport song would work in this situation. If I
> sing that song
> > > while at the top of the village (or any high altitude
> location), will I
> > > appear at the same altitude over the ground, and as a
> result take lots
> > of
> > > damage due to falling? Or will I end up on the ground
> wherever the song
> > > sends me to?
> >
> > 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> > Effect: Random teleport
> > Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> > Target: Party
> > Does not stack with: N/A
> > Taunt: ??
> >
> > Quantified: ??
> >
> > Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random
> distance in a
> > random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on
> level and whether
> > or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been
> marginally useful
> > as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group
> member to a
> > different random location. It will not teleport you
> through walls or
> > closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
> >
> >
>
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor
> ----------------------------
>
> ??? Computer Questions ==> Free Answers From Live Experts !
> ! !
> go to EXPERTCITY.COM
> <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/expertcity5
> ">Click Here</a>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:36:20 -0500
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> You might want that 1000pp Potion to gate out once you get trapped inside
> <g>
>
> Sylly.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kimes, Dean W. [mailto:Dean_Kimes@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 1:58 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport
> song
>
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
>
> Curious, will the teleport work thru doors that have a crack
> around the
> opening? Might be a way into huts that are broken or
> locked. Might take
> forever to hit the crack, but who knows?
>
> Kitasi the ever curious
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 19
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:36:36 -0600
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> Subject: RE: Question about the teleport song
>
> Not when it will gate me into that evil city I was convinced would be
safe!
> ;)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Schuldes [mailto:jgs@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 2:36 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport song
>
>
> From: James Schuldes <jgs@...>
>
> You might want that 1000pp Potion to gate out once you get trapped inside
> <g>
>
> Sylly.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kimes, Dean W. [mailto:Dean_Kimes@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 1:58 PM
> To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Question about the teleport
> song
>
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
>
> Curious, will the teleport work thru doors that have a crack
> around the
> opening? Might be a way into huts that are broken or
> locked. Might take
> forever to hit the crack, but who knows?
>
> Kitasi the ever curious
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:35:17 -0400
> From: Greg Gillan <GGillan@...>
> Subject: RE: Petiton to replace level 14 song
>
> Awwwwwww
>
>
> Elwyn hangs his head
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Zoie [mailto:valkry@...]
> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 4:24 PM
> To: eqbards@onelist.com
> Subject: Re: [eqbards] Petiton to replace level 14 song
>
>
> From: Zoie <valkry@...>
>
> Elwyn,
>
> If you aren't the groom, you shouldn't be "gandering" the bride, and if
you
> are....Verant kindly left us many empty rooms to find (but how 'bout a
suite
> w/
> a hot tub?). Go off and have a nice cozy RP (but use /g or /t for your
> evening
> please....we don't need the Norrath version of the Pam/Tommy video)
;)
>
> > I didn't mean to imply that *I* look like Pamela Lee, merely that I
enjoy
> to
> > gander certain members of the finer sex, and I don't find any problem
with
> > these resemblances <grins>
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 21
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 17:38:33 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Abraham Hardjana <ahardjan@...>
> Subject: Re: Question about the teleport song
>
> John,
>
> I have noticed a few things with this song that are not in your song
> description. The song can indeed be used to help people escape those
> darned vacuum gates in Perma and Paw, but I have for the most part found
> that it doesn't help. It appears to me that the song only teleports you
> to a place within it's range that you can see. This has been verifeid by
> me when I climbed the wizard spire in Greater Faydark and North Karana.
> While on the top of the spire I woul look down at the ground though I
> could not see it and the teleport drops me on the side of the spire.
>
> I will do some further testing when I get a chance, just to be 100% sure.
> But after some trials in Perma, I do believe the teleport locations are
> based on what you can you see.
>
> Treilanin Loreweaver
> Bard of Kelethin
> Honour Guard, Karana
>
> On Thu, 23 Sep 1999 kim@... wrote:
>
> > 21 - Mellifluous Motion
> > Effect: Random teleport
> > Instrument: Wind, enhances distance teleported(?)
> > Target: Party
> > Does not stack with: N/A
> > Taunt: ??
> >
> > Quantified: ??
> >
> > Comments: Teleports you and your party members a random distance in a
> > random direction. The distance seems to be dependent on level and
whether
> > or not you're using a wind instrument. It might've been marginally
useful
> > as a group escape tool, except it teleports each group member to a
> > different random location. It will not teleport you through walls or
> > closed doors. It will place you at ground level.
> >
> > Strategies:
> >
> > - Useful for instantly coming down from high places, like the top of
> > the Aviak Village, or the wizard teleport site spires.
> >
> > - This used to be useful if you got dragged up a portcullis (Paw and
> > Permafrost), but they changed it so it doesn't work through walls
> > anymore. Once you're dragged up, you have walls on both sides so
> > you won't teleport anywhere. Still, it's worth a shot, especially
> > if you're not completely pulled up inside the portcullis. Make sure
> > you disband from the rest of your party so they are not flung around.
> >
> > - It can function as a poor escape tool. It could teleport you far
> > enough from the mobs that you have enough time to run for the zone
> > without being hit from behind. Of course in the time it takes to
> > start this song, you could start Accelerando and accomplish the same
> > thing.
> >
> > Cautions:
> >
> > - A good way to get your party members pissed off at you, since everyone
> > teleports to different locations. Of course if that's your intent...
> >
> > - Generally a good way to get killed quickly. I've teleported right
> > into a full spawn of level 30ish goblins in Permafrost while trying
> > to get a friend unstuck.
> >
> > - The song will place you at ground level, which for bodies of water
> > means at the bottom. If it's dark and/or the water is murky, you can
> > easily become disoriented and drown before reaching the surface. So
> > make sure you consider this possibility if you're using it near water.
>
>
>
>
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___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 22
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 15:47:26 -0600
> From: "Frank Hartmann" <FRANHART@...>
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
> Sorry you think this topic was a troll. It was my first post to the list
and I thought I had a legitimate issue and was very happy to read the varied
opinions from the list members. Some of the opinions and play styles differ
from mine. That's cool. I can understand their motivations and now I am
better for it. Maybe my future party members may be better for it as well.
That doesn't sound much like a troll to me.
>
> Back to lurk mode where nobody knows your name.
>
> Keledal
> Bard of Erollisi Marr
>
>
> >>> "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...> 09/23 1:42 PM >>>
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
>
> >> the long run back. It's not the ONLY way. It just may be the
> >> only way for some individuals depending upon their danger
> >> tolerance level.
> >
> >At level 15 when I first entered Guk that *was* the only way.
> >There was absolutely no way for me to get past the Troll
> >guards outside of Grobb in order to be bound there. That's
> >not a tolerance level. That's a reality.
>
>
> This whole thing strikes me as a simple troll (hee!) post. Clearly good
> aligned characters being bound in evil cities is absurd. Monks could sneak
> it at one point great. All the danger tolerance level in the world doesn't
> make it s SMART thing to do (as outlined by John, the hours lost due to
> death don't make up for the running time). No amount of machismo makes the
> argument make any sense at all. I would suggest we not fuel the trolls fun
> any longer.
>
> Tszaaz E'Taurguin
>
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 23
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:56:34 -0500
> From: Mike.Langlois@...
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
>
>
> * SNIP *
>
> Sorry you think this topic was a troll. It was my first post to the list
and I
> thought I had a legitimate issue and was very happy to read the varied
opinions
> from the list members. Some of the opinions and play styles differ from
mine.
> That's cool. I can understand their motivations and now I am better for
it.
> Maybe my future party members may be better for it as well. That doesn't
sound
> much like a troll to me.
>
> Back to lurk mode where nobody knows your name.
>
> Keledal
> Bard of Erollisi Marr
>
> * SNIP *
>
> Hey! Don't do that! I started this thread, but I'm not the guy that said
troll
> (tho I believe he was just making a joke). This has been a great
discussion,
> and without you it would have been much less fun.
>
> You are willing to reason, and never resort to cheap shots. And as a huge
> bonus, you can admit when you may have made an error! Wow, talk about a
bonus
> on any discussion list.
>
> Golias, Solusek Ro
>
>
>
>
>
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___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 24
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:56:26 -0500
> From: "Elijah Meeker" <elijah@...>
> Subject: Re: RE: RE: Why do the melee classes keep wanting Bind?
>
>
> >Sorry you think this topic was a troll. It was my first post to the list
> and I thought I had a legitimate issue and was very happy to read the
varied
> opinions from the list members.
>
> Bleh, don't listen to me, I am too quick to see trolls. *laughs* If you DO
> come up with a good way for me to bind in Neriak I will be eternally
> grateful *laughs*
>
> Tszaaz E'Taurguin
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
____________________________________________________________________________
___
>
> Message: 25
> Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 18:18:41 -0500
> From: "Kyle Sibbald" <ksibbald@...>
> Subject: RE: Crysknife (OT) -- SPOILER
>
> 8)-----Original Message-----
> 8)From: Jason Osborne [mailto:jasono@...]
> 8)Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 9:52 AM
> 8)To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> 8)Subject: RE: [eqbards] Crysknife (OT) -- SPOILER
> 8)
> 8)
> 8)From: Jason Osborne <jasono@...>
> 8)
> 8)Spoiler Space for those who like it (And I apologize for the
> 8)OT answer, but
> 8)thought others might like to know)
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)11
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)11
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)11
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)1
> 8)I do not know if the Chrysknife can be looted in Paw, however
> 8)it is a RARE
> 8)drop of the Gnoll Embalmer from Lake Rathe. His common drop
> 8)is, of course,
> 8)the Skul of Jhen'Tra, but I looted a chrysknife from him a
> 8)couple of weeks
> 8)ago. Of course, I've probably killed him 3 dozen times, and
> 8)that's the only
> 8)knife I've ever seen. I was quite surprised. :-)
> 8)
> 8)-----Original Message-----
> 8)From: Benjamin Jerrad Segal [mailto:birdman@...]
> 8)Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 10:07 AM
> 8)To: eqbards@onelist.com
> 8)Subject: [eqbards] Crysknife (OT)
> 8)
> 8)A friend of mine has his heart set on getting one of these,
> 8)and I can't
> 8)for the life of me (literally, on occasion) find where in Paw it comes
> 8)from. If anyone has good, specific information on it, please email me
> 8)directly to keep offtopic discussion (mostly) off the list.
> 8)
> 8)TIA,
> 8)Athren Notechaser, chaining up a storm
> 8)
>
> The crysknife can indeed be found in Splitpaw. The gnoll necro, Ghanex
> Drah, occasionally carries it. I have also seen Zixx Nenix with a sticker
> but couldn't kill him so it may be that he carries it as well.
>
> Good Journey,
>
> Sineras Silverlyre (Cazic-Thule)
>
>
>
>
>
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