For the sake of argument, lets assume that binding in non-cities is #1 on
the wishlist of melee/hybrid classes. If it isn't #1, then it is very high
on the list based on the uproar that arises everytime the issue is raised.
Lets also assume that Brad McQuaid was telling the truth that EQ will
continue to evolve as the game matures. Lets also assume that some of the
future changes that Verant will make is based on feedback from their
customers.
With these assumptions, IMO, it is not a waste of time to discuss the issue
of binding of melee/hybrid classes in non-cities (or giving hybrid classes
the ability to cast bind affinity). Just because Verant decided on the
current binding policy in beta doesn't mean that they will never change
their mind. Case in point: Origin recently stated new areas will be added
to UO that will be non-PVP. This is 180% to their long standing policy of UO
being 100% PVP (I read the UO infobit at Desslock's website). Intelligent
debate of any issue, in EQ or RL, IMO is always a good thing. Both sides,
if they are willing to listen and learn, both come out of the debate with a
better understanding of the issue involved. Only those people who are
unwilling to listen or change their views come out with nothing.
For those of you who say Verant will never budge on their binding policy, I
honestly don't understand how you know that to be etched in stone. The odds
may indicate that they will never change the policy, but there is always a
chance that they could change their minds. For me personally, I don't like
the current policy and hope they make a change sometime in the future. As
long as there is a chance that this may occur, I think that it is a
legitimate topic for discussion. With that said, of all the EQ forums out
there, this list may be the one best suited to come up with a new binding
policy that makes everyone happy.
One last question for those of you who are opposed to changing the binding
policy. Lets assume that someone creates a petition on this issue that is
well thought out and makes logical sense. If any petition on binding has a
chance of getting approved, this one is it. If you agree with me that there
is a possibility, however small, that Verant will change their minds on the
binding issue, would you vote in favor or against the petition? Remember
that if the petition is disapproved, the policy remains the same, the way
you think it should be. But if the petition is approved and the binding
policy is changed, a LOT of people will be happy plus you will also benefit
from the change. IMO, if you vote Yes for the petition its a win-win
situation for you.
Galtin of E'ci
> Despite what people seem to think at times, Verant has three years of 25
> or so
> people having worked on this game. Somewhere there is a Master Design
> Document that is probably around 1,000 pages long. If you believe that
> decisions like player binding weren't discussed for litterally hundreds of
> man-hours you're sorely mistaken and have no idea how much effort and time
> has
> gone into this game.
>
> NPCs will never be given the ability to bind. This would kill "Binding
> for
> donations at gates", and the sale of binds. Verant does not want to do
> this
> (In fact in the Policies and Procedures manual for Guides it forbids
> Guides
> from binding players because it would 'damage the economy of players
> selling
> binds'). NPCs binding would lower caster's value to the non-casters in
> Norrath and eliminate a point of player interaction, Verant doesn't want
> that
> either. I've got a 14th level Enchanter and I bind for free all the time
> even
> though I could use the cash. Why? Because I like that feeling I get when
> some 10th level player say "Hey, thanks a lot!!" when I turn down his 2gp
> that
> he's trying to donate. NPCs binding would eliminate that four thousands
> of
> players.
>
> Bind anywhere? Never happen. In fact, I think the casters are probably
> lucky
> to have gotten that ability, as it's potentially quite unbalancing when
> fighting uber-mobs like dragons. "Yeah, I lost a level dying 14 times
> while
> fighting Vox, but I would just spawn, mem my spells and nuke until I got
> killed." This is precicely why Ressurection effects have been made so
> horrendous. Probably casters being able to bind anywhere was to offset
> how
> fragile they are should the group get overrun by mobs. The casters are
> the
> least likely to make it to the zone alive in a bad situation.
>
> Also, there absolutely HAS to be a serious penalty for dying; it's a very
> important part of the game. Many people make the "game fun" or the "I can
> only play two hours a week" argument, but when you consider the impact
> that
> binding anywhere would have on group dynamics and strategy, you quickly
> see
> that it works best the way that it is. Verant has decided that getting to
> your corpse, in addition to the experience lost is what that penalty is.
> When
> there is a penalty for dying you coordinate your actions and fight with
> more
> strategy. Verant (and I) want this VERY much. Conversely, if there were
> little or no penalty for dying, sloppy unbalanced groups would just go
> into a
> place like Mistmoore with little or no regard of how the zone works.
> They'd
> just pull the castle and beat on stuff until everything was dead with the
> minor annoyance of having to loot their corpses. I wouldn't be addicted
> to
> that game.
>
> I have never had the problems that you describe getting a bind. Getting
> bound
> in Erudin can be tough, as that continent is currently underutilized.
> There
> are only two types out there now. Newbie Erudite players that are trying
> to
> get up to level 4 or 6 or so before going to Qeynos where the real action
> is,
> and higher level Druid types running out to Kerra Isle for a questing
> reason
> that I won't disclose here. However, since nothing is really going on out
> there I never really need a bind out there. Paineel is due to open in the
> next few weeks. It is a higher level zone built off of Tox Forrest.
> Erudin
> is likely to get a lot busier soon, and when it does Kerra Isle will also
> probably start being used for its intended purpose (a teens level zone)
> instead of just having 6 high level druids in it. I would personally
> never
> sit for two hours waiting for a bind. I'd continue to solicit binds if
> people
> didn't show up within five or ten minutes. 11pm Mountain? I routinely
> play
> until 3am Central and I never have problems getting binds in the major
> cities.
>
> Jason A. Farque
> CDI at http://www.pigging.com/
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Kimes, Dean W. <Dean_Kimes@...>
> To: <eqbards@onelist.com>
> Sent: Thursday, September 30, 1999 12:06 PM
> Subject: RE: [eqbards] Hey this sounded interesting..
>
>
> > From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
> >
> > Actually I am more sick of hearing we won't get bind. You are right it
> > won't happen until people start leaving EQ in droves because they are
> either
> > A, a melee class that is sick of running to their bodies on Kunark from
> > Freeport, or B, they are a caster who is sick of constantly dying
> because
> > all the tanks have either quit or are an hour away in Freeport because
> the
> > lizard race is evil and they can't bind there. Verant needs to realize
> that
> > bind is not a class balance issue it is a game fun issue. I frankly
> > wouldn't care if we got bind if either everyone could be bound
> everywhere by
> > a caster, and or there were npc's to bind you in cities.
> >
> > I have quit playing 5 times in the last 2 weeks because I found myself
> in a
> > city waiting for over an hour trying to get bound. Adventuring on
> faydwyr
> > while bound in Freeport is pointless, as is adventuring on erud while
> bound
> > in Qeynos. I have never been able to get bound on Erud unless I brought
> my
> > own binder with me. I have sat in Kaladim for 2 hours waiting to get
> bound
> > after having been sent tells by three different casters in Butcherblock
> > saying hold on they would come bind me. None of them showed and they
> are
> > all on my ignore list now.
> >
> > The only 3 places I have been able to bind in regularly are Freeport,
> > Qeynos, and Rivervale and even in those places its nigh on impossible
> after
> > 11pm mst. I hae been bound in Halas for over a week without being able
> to
> > get a bind after trying in Kaladim, Freeport and Rivervale. last nite,
> > after 13 hours of play over the last week I was able to get bound in
> > Rivervale. For those of us who can't play in prime time and don't have
> a
> > regular group that gets online together on a consistent basis, binding
> is
> > currently a ridiculous situation.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Greg Gillan [mailto:GGillan@...]
> > Sent: Thursday, September 30, 1999 10:28 AM
> > To: 'eqbards@onelist.com'
> > Subject: RE: [eqbards] Hey this sounded interesting..
> >
> >
> > From: Greg Gillan <GGillan@...>
> >
> > We are not getting bind. We will never get bind and we have less need
> for
> > bind than any other class, considering the rate at which we run.
> > Talies, please KABONG this before this whole arguement starts up yet
> again.
> > I think most people are sick of hearing it by now
> >
> >
> > Elwyn Heartstring
> > Level 44 Bard
> > Erollisi Marr
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Lange, Stephen [mailto:SLANGE@...]
> > Sent: Thursday, September 30, 1999 12:21 PM
> > To: Eqbards (E-mail)
> > Subject: [eqbards] Hey this sounded interesting..
> >
> >
> > From: "Lange, Stephen" <SLANGE@...>
> >
> > This is a posting that was on alt.games.everquest that I think is
> > logical and something that may be considered for a petition.
> > Let me know what you think.
> >
> >
> > This is a suggestion for a bardic form of Bind Affinity. Bards are
> amongst
> > Norath's primary travellers, so it seems a little odd that, somewhere
> > amongst the song set, there is no bind song.
> >
> > In an effort to avoid the "Give us bind" syndrome, I have applied some
> > thought. If you are already thinking "No way, bind for casters only",
> please
> > read on - you might actually be pleasantly surprised.
> >
> > The great Songmistress Alenia discovered a song, sung by a bard in South
> > Karana, which strangely and uniquely affected her. She aquired the
> > instructions for the singing of the song, and returned with it to
> Freeport,
> > thinking nothing further of it until her arrival.
> >
> > During her travel, she was accosted by a creature which, when she came
> to
> > loot it, produced a lump of ore. She placed this in her backpack, and
> > continued to freeport.
> >
> > The following morning, she dug out her notes, and decided to rehearse
> this
> > new song, before bringing it before her guildmaster for review. As she
> sang,
> > she noticed that the strange sensation she had experienced previously
> was
> > lacking, infact, she was most of the way through the song before that
> > sensation returned. Then the unexpected happened.
> >
> > The lump of ore, which she had not yet sold, began to resonate with the
> > chords and notes. Her mind was filled with a passion for the rocks and
> > stones, the earth and grass that had been hewn, cut, shaped and grown
> into
> > the town of Freeport. Her soul filled with a passion for Freeport, and
> she
> > realised she had bonded with Freeport.
> >
> > Feeling suddenly drained, she ceased the song and sat. She had
> discovered
> > it! She recognised the drained sensation from tales her mother had told
> her,
> > and with a clap of joy she cried out "Mana!".
> >
> > --- The practical explanation ---
> >
> > Bard's Bind would have a lengthy casting time instead of the usual
> "3.0".
> > And it would use mana, and a component (a piece of ore, or maybe some
> other
> > item which would fuel a bit of economy).
> >
> > The mana would be, say, 200 units. However; bard's bind would ALSO be a
> > group effect, requiring, say, 100 or 150 units of mana per extra person
> > bound. During the bind, each of the targets must be seated.
> >
> > That means: Bard sings bind, 1 member of party (within radius) is not
> > sitting for the entire casting duration, bind fails.
> >
> > If the bard is grouped with, say, 4 people, he would need 200 + 4 x 100
> =
> > 600 units of mana.
> >
> > The numbers might need juggling so that a bard can bind a full party of
> 6 by
> > level 30.
> >
> > I would suggest that the song be implemented as level 20 or 21, and that
> the
> > songs be shuffled so that it effectively replaces the level 14 song (the
> > cataloging libretto).
> >
> > Implementing level 21 makes most sense, since you could then move
> Melanie's
> > Melifluous motion down to level 14.
> >
> > I don't, however, think that we bards should get bind early (e.g. level
> 14).
> > I think prior to that point, making sure you can get bound is a good
> > encouragement for people to learn to *play* their character *as* a bard,
> to
> > socialise and such.
> >
> > Kayfess,
> > 34th Bard of Bertoxxulous,
> > Servant of Bristlebane
> >
> > ------------------------
> > My Comments:
> >
> > Wow, I have to say that you really did think that out. I like the fact
> that
> > you have couples the song with mana and with a reagent. I go back and
> forth
> > with the group based bind. One one hand, it would provide the melee
> classes
> > with a way to avoid a 5 zone run back to their body, on the other hand
> it
> > would probally cause an influx of people playing bards just to get that
> > ability. On the plus side, the bard would be even more important to a
> > group. I think by giving this abilitiy later in life, at say 21 as you
> say
> > is a great idea. Its far enough in that the casual player wont play for
> 21
> > levels if they really dont like it. But not too far that its out of the
> > range of the committed bard.
> >
> > One addendum to that idea of yours, would be to put a singing
> restriction on
> > the bard bind similar or greater to the paladin lay of hands.
> >
> > If a restriction like that was put on it, I would have NO problem with
> it
> > being group based bind. In addition you might make getting the song be
> a
> > hard involved quest that someone who is 21 could do solo, but would take
> a
> > lot of time.
> >
> > So, to summarize:
> >
> > Song: Bardic Binding Bellow
> > Level: 21
> > Casting Req's: Mana, 200 (Self) + 100 Per group member, 800 Mana for
> full
> > group + Reagent (Enchanted electrum or something like that),
> > ore, etc. Possibly make a Zone Specific Reagent
> >
> > Stipulations: Can only be sung once per day, similar to Lay of Hands
> > Acquired: By multi-part quest, forcing the bard to travel to many zones
> > (thus preventing us from becoming Bind whores)
> > Possible addendum to this.. make two spells.. the first
> being
> > a Self-Only Bind that is bought at a merchant. Still
> > would use reagents, but would not have a casting
> restriction.
> >
> > The Second Bind spell would be a Quest. It would be
> group
> > bind, but would difficult AND have a casting delay built
> in
> > like lay of Hands, etc. If you did it this way, you
> could
> > even make the delay greater, say 2 days. This would
> enable
> > the
> > bard to be able to self-bind at any time, but only group
> bind
> > on a limited basis.
> >
> > I think this is an excellent idea.
> >
> > >
> >
>
>