1914-04-16 5 2 0 SENATE 50 0 Senate. 1914-04-16 The President took the chair at 3 p.m., and read prayers. 50 Questions 50 50 JXJ 0 0 NEEDHAM, Edward Senator NEEDHAM - I beg to ask the Vice-President of the Executive Council the following questions: - What is the present position in connexion with the industrial dispute at the Kalgoorlie end of the trans- Australian railway? Is he aware that the Right Honorable Sir John Forrest, when receiving a deputation from the men engaged on the construction of the line early this year, stated that the Government should he model employers? Does he think that the offer of the Government to pay 12s. 6d. minimum, as against 13s. 4d., which the men are asking for, and which is being paid by a private contractor, shows that the Federal Government in this instance is a model employer? Is the Government willing to meet representatives of the men with a view to bringing about a settlement of the dispute? 50 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I am not prepared to answer, without notice, all the questions of the honorable senator. But as this matter was brought up yesterday, I have obtained the following statement from the Department: - Negotiations have been proceeding between the Supervising Engineer and the representatives of the men. The latter desired some further information as to the scope of the Department's offer to increase the wages by10d. per day. The -particulars have recently been telegraphed to the Supervising Engineer to convey to the men, and it is hoped that a satisfactory arrangement will shortly be arrived at. 50 JU7 0 0 DE LARGIE, Hugh Senator DE LARGIE - Arising out of the answer, will the Minister say what the minimum would be under the offer he has just quoted? Would that10d. per day raise the wages to 13s. 4d., which the men are asking for, or would it be an increase of10d. per day on the11s. 8d. which they were working for prior to the strike? 50 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I am unable to answer the question. All the information I have in my possession I have already conveyed to the Senate. 50 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE - I desire to ask the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs the following questions: - Has a contract been let for portion of the clearing and earthworks of the Kalgoorlie end of the trans- Australian railway line? To whom was the contract let, and what are its terms? Were tenders called for such contract, and in what newspapers, and for what length of time? Will the Minister lay a copy of the contract on the table of the Senate? 50 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I shall be glad to get the information, and lay a copy of it on the table of the Senate, if I find that the Department has no objection, and the honorable senator will give notice of a question. 50 50 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator LONG - I wish to ask the Minister of Defence if he is able to supply some information that was sought last session, namely, has the Government appointed, or considered the appointment, of a manager of the Woollen Mill? 51 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I am under the impression that an appointment was made by my predecessor. 51 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator Long - It is a wonder, then, that my question made your colleague so ill last session. 51 51 K2D 0 0 READY, Rudolph Senator READY - Will the Minister representing the Minister of Trade and Customs lay on the table of the Senate all papers dealing with the seizure of thirty cases of butter from the Launceston and North-eastern Co-operative Dairy Company, Launceston ? 51 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I shall be glad to make inquiries into the matter, and if there is no objection to lay the papers on the table. 51 51 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - Is the Minister of Defence aware that a request was made by blacksmiths employed at the Cockatoo Island Dockyard for compensation for time lost during the partial closing down of the dockyard ? Is he aware that a departmental refusal of the demand has been made, and does he concur in such refusal ? 51 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I believe that the facts are as stated by the honorable senator. 51 51 KTF 0 0 MCGREGOR, Gregor Senator McGREGOR - In view of the report on the Commonwealth Bank, which was laid on the table of the Senate yesterday, does the Vice-President of the Executive Council adhere to the statement he made recently that the loss on the first year's transactions was £56,000, and that the position was likely to be worse ? 51 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - When I made that statement, it embodied the information I had to date; but since then there has been further information supplied. 51 KTF 0 0 MCGREGOR, Gregor Senator McGREGOR - Arising out of the answer, is not the Minister aware of the fact that, two days before he made the statement, the report was in the hands of the Treasurer? 51 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I am aware of the fact now, but I was not aware of it then. 51 KTF 0 0 MCGREGOR, Gregor Senator McGregor - Are you sorry for what you said? 51 51 K3E 0 0 RUSSELL, Edward Senator RUSSELL - I understand that on the last Estimates we voted a sum which approximately meant an increase of about £30 each to the salaries of the . Area Officers. I desire to know from the Minister of Defence whether it is the intention of the Department to make that increase payable during the present financial year ? 51 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I must speak from memory, and, therefore, if I am not absolutely correct, the honorable senator will exonerate me from any intention to mislead him. I am under the impression that approval has been given for the payment of the money as appropriated on the last Estimates. 51 51 KTD 0 0 MCDOUGALL, Allan Senator McDOUGALL - Will the Minister of Defence inform the Senate whether the foreign oats supplied to the Defence Forces at the Liverpool camp were supplied by a contractor, and, if so, whether the contract specified either Australian or foreign oats? 51 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - That question was brought before the Senate yesterday, and I have taken steps to immediately obtain a report on the whole of the circumstances surrounding the incident to which the honorable senator refers. 51 51 KSU 0 0 MAUGHAN, William Senator MAUGHAN - I ask the Minister representing the Minister of Trade and Customs whether any steps have been taken to prevent a recurrence of any such disaster as happened to the steamer St. Paul at Smith Rock, Moreton Bay? 51 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - At present I have not the information, but I will be glad to find out how the matter stands and inform the honorable senator. 51 51 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - Will the Minister representing the Prime Minister inform the Senate whether it is true that a number of disabilities, which were removed from Federal public servants by the previous Government, have been reimposed ? I am informed that an officer in the Postal Department was elected at the top of the poll to a position in a local governing body, and when that fact was brought under the notice of the departmental head the officer was immediately called upon to resign the office to which he had been elected, in order to retain his position in the Public Service. In view of those circumstances, will the Minister say whether it is the policy of the Government to remove that measure of freedom which the previous Government extended to officers in the Public Service ? 52 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - The policy of the present Government is to retain to the civil servants all the freedom and facilities they now enjoy, and to remove the disabilities placed upon them by our predecessors. If the honorable senator will give me particulars of the specific case to which he refers and privately furnish me with the name of the officer so as to facilitate inquiries, I will have the case looked into. 52 52 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE - I understand that Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice has recommended that a trial shaft be put down at Cockburn Sound for the purpose of determining the advisability of putting a graving dock there. Will the Minister of Defence inform the Senate whether that is correct, and, if so, whether it is proposed to put down similar shafts at James Point, Mangles Bay, and Careening Bay in Cockburn Sound; if not, why not? 52 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - It is quite correct that, following the recommendations of Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice, a shaft is now being sunk on the shores of Jervoise Bay. It is not proposed to sink similar shafts elsewhere in the waters of Cockburn Sound, firstly, because Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice has not recommended that course; and, secondly, because he has intimated that the character of the country about Cockburn Sound is so similar that one shaft will be sufficient to enable him to determine whether or not it is possible to place a floating dock there, or anywhere else in the bay. 52 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE - Is the Minister of Defence aware that Mangles Bay is 12. miles from Jervoise Bay, and that bores have; revealed that there is a difference in the strata in the various sections? I would further ask the Minister if the report and recommendations: of Sir Maurice: Fitzmaurice are dependent on the completion of that shaft at Jervoise Bay, and whether it is intended that no action shall be taken to commence work at Jervoise Bay until the shaft is completed, the data sent to England, and Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice's recommendation sent back to Australia? 52 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I am not aware of any trial bores which have been put down at various points in Jervoise Bay. I know that excavation work has taken place, but I am not conversant with the details of it. However, I do know that Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice has made a specific recommendation in regard to the sinking of this one test shaft, and, in view of that recommendation, I am not disposed to myself raise the question as to whether the information, which that authority declares to be sufficient, is so or not. I must accept the advice of the engineer. As to whether it is proposed to take no action until such time as the information now being collected is placed in Sir Maurice's hands, and his final report reaches here, I may say that so far as the major works are concerned no commencement will be made until that final and definite report is to hand ; but I am told that there is a good deal of work which can be proceeded with now in the light of information already in our possession, and I have given directions that steps shall be taken to proceed with work which can be safely undertaken, and which will bo necessary, no matter what may be the details of the recommendation submitted by Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice. 52 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE - At what portion of Cockburn Sound will that work be undertaken ? 52 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I am not in a position to say, because I am now asking the officers to report on the question. They have told me that there is work which can be proceeded with, and which will be necessary,, whatever may be the nature of Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice's final recommendation. I have asked them, therefore, to make plans and arrangements, with a view to putting before me details of such work as they say may be safely carried out. 52 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE - I must again ask the Minister where that work is to be done. Are the officers to whom he has referred to decide that point, or has that work also to wait until Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice recommends where it is to be undertaken ? 53 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - Until I receive the report of the officers I am not able to answer that question, but I am not prepared to sanction one single penny of expenditure there which is likely to be wasted if Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice's report shows it to be unnecessary. 53 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator Pearce - That means that the Government cannot go on with any work ? 53 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - That is the honorable senator's view, but my officers advise that there is a considerable amount of work which it will be necessary to carry out, no matter what Sir Maurice Fitzmaurice may finally recommend. So far as we can proceed with that work safely, having regard to the interests of the public, it will be proceeded with. 53 53 K3Q 0 0 BUZACOTT, Richard Senator BUZACOTT - I desire to ask the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs if he will Jay on the table of the Senate all papers in connexion with the resignation of Mr. Henry Deane, as Consulting Engineer-in-Chief of the Commonwealth Railways, and the appointment of his successor, Mr. Bell ? 53 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I will be glad if the honorable senator will move for the production of those papers. No objection will be taken to his doing so. 53 JU7 0 0 DE LARGIE, Hugh Senator DE LARGIE - I ask the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs whether the late Consulting Engineer-in-Chief of the Commonwealth Railways voluntarily resigned from his position, or whether he was given a hint by the Government to send in his resignation ? 53 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I am unable to answer the honorable senator's question offhand, but if he will give notice of it I will endeavor to get him the desired information. 53 53 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator LONG - I ask the Minister of Defence whether the friction which was known to exist last year amongst members of the Naval Board has been removed, and whether they are now working harmoniously together? 53 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - In connexion with the Naval Board, I am pleased to be able to say that matters are proceeding with an amount of smoothness and satisfaction which, I am sure, is as gratifying to the honorable senator as it is to myself. 53 53 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - I desire to ask the Minister of Defence whether his attention has been called, as a private citizen, to the Tasmanian political crisis, and whether, when that crisis has ended, he will endeavour to secure a copy of the whole of the official despatches relating to the matter for the guidance of honorable senators, and of future Governors, in case a similar position should arise in any other part of the Commonwealth? 53 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - As a private citizen, as the representative of the Government, and as a politician, I am keenly interested, both in the nature of that dispute and in its final outcome. I shall have very much pleasure in seeing that steps are taken to place in the bands of honorable senators such official documents bearing on the point as may be available. 53 53 KTD 0 0 MCDOUGALL, Allan Senator McDOUGALL - Is the Minister of Defence aware that several condemned buildings at South Head are crawling with vermin, and have been used to store blankets and other materials which have been issued to the artillery men in camp without having been first fumigated and cleaned? 53 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I am not aware of the circumstances referred to by the honorable senator, and I take this opportunity of expressing some doubt as to whether the information conveyed by him is entirely accurate. I shall accept it as my duty to ascertain the true facts of the case. 53 53 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator LONG - I desire to ask the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs if permanent Divisional Returning Officers have yet been appointed ? 53 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The great majority of them have been appointed - indeed, all with the exception of twelve in. New South Wales, the nominations for which positions have not yet come to hand from the Public Service Commissioner. 54 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - Can the Minister say whether these officers are to be permanently appointed; and, if so, what is to be the amount of their annual salary ? 54 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - Their salary is to be £310 a year, and they will be constantly employed. 54 54 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I . ask the Minister of Defence whether it is a fact that the stocks for the rifles being manufactured at the Small Arms Factory, Lithgow, are made from imported timbers? Before the Senate meets again after the projected adjournment, will he instruct the manager of that establishment to have stocks made from Australian timbers, say, from spotted gum, from Tasmanian blackwood, and Queensland maple, and will he have those stocks here for examination by honorable senators when this Chamber re-assembles ? 54 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - It is impossible to give a definite assurance and to tie myself down to a particular moment in order to meet the rather emphatic request of my honorable friend. The matter of utilizing Australian timbers for rifle stocks was made the subject of tests during the period of my predecessor in office. I will ascertain what success attended those tests, and will be pleased to give any other information likely to assist the honorable member in arriving at a conclusion on this subject. 54 Horse Allowance 54 KTF 0 0 MCGREGOR, Gregor Senator McGREGOR - I ask the Minister of Defence whether he, is aware that the horse allowance hitherto made to sergeant major drill instructors of the Light Horse in South Australia has been stopped, and whether there is any possibility of securing redress in a matter of this description ? 54 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - I cannot say that I have any knowledge of the matter, but I would point out to the honorable senator that the drill instructors to whom he refers cannot be illegally deprived of anything which is legally theirs. However, if he will give me an opportunity during the next day or two of looking into the matter, I shall be able to furnish him with the information he desires. 54 papers MINISTERS laid upon the table the following papers: - Naval Defence - Memorandum by the Minister for Defence, together with speech of the First Lord of the Admiralty as reported in Australia. Ordered to be printed. Small Arms Factory, Lithgow - Report by Mr. G. Swinburne, Inter-State Commissioner, re dispute between the Management and the Amalgamated Society of Engineers. Defence: Army Medical Corps - Annual Report of the Director-General for year ending 30th June, 1913. Military College - Report on the Fourth Entrance Examination, October, 1913. Military Forces. - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1914, No. 31. Universal Training. - New Regulation - Statutory Rules 1914, No. 32. 54 Questions 54 54 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - Yesterday afternoon Senator Newland brought before the Senate the question of the infliction of some fines, which, in his opinion, were unduly heavy, on three persons in Adelaide for offences against the Electoral Act. I have made an inquiry into the matter, and have been furnished with the following information : - The Attorney-General is the only person who is authorized to deal with the reduction or remission of fines. Magistrates usually take into consideration all the facts when imposing penalties. I suggest to the honorable senator that a petition should be sent in to the Attorney-General, stating the facts, and asking for the exercise of some leniency. The matter does not come under my control at all. Senator O'Loghlin asked me a question yesterday with regard to an admission by a person before the Electoral Commission that, in direct contravention of the Electoral Act, while in one of the places provided for recording his vote, he directly removed the partition between that and another, and looked in to see what was being done there. I have been furnished by the Chief Electoral Officer with the following statement: - I am aware of the incident referred to by Senator O'Loghlin through the evidence given by the person concerned before the Royal Commission. The elector in question, hearing voices in an adjoining compartment, stated that he pulled aside the cloth screen sufficiently to enable him to see whether two persons were in the compartment. It has not been alleged that he interfered with any elector in regard to the marking of his vote. The act was injudicious and improper, but does not call for action under the law. The honorable senator also called my attention to an admission by another witness that, without a scrutineer's paper, he* was illegally within a polling booth. The information supplied to me with regard to that incident reads as follows: - The Presiding Officer is in charge of the booth, and has power to remove any person improperly in the booth. No report has been received that any person refused to leave a booth when directed to do so. 55 JXJ 0 0 NEEDHAM, Edward Senator NEEDHAM asked the Vice-President of the Executive Council, upon notice - Is it the duty of the Minister in charge of the Electoral Department to order that proceedings be taken against any person who is known to have committed a breach of the Commonwealth electoral law? If it is not the duty of the Minister, will he kindly inform the Senate on whom the responsibility rests of instituting such proceedings? 55 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answers are - No. The Chief Electoral Officer, acting on the advice of the Crown Law Officers under the provisions of section 206ff of the Electoral Act. 55 55 JZ9 0 0 O'KEEFE, David Senator O'KEEFE asked the Minister representing the Postmaster-General, upon notice - Has the new contract for the carriage of mails between Tasmania and the mainland been signed by the Postmaster-General? If so, will the Minister lay a copy of the contract on the table of the Senate? 55 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answers are - Yes. Yes, as soon as copies are received from the Government Printer, in whose hands the manuscript is at present. 55 55 JZC 0 0 O'LOGHLIN, James Senator Lt Colonel O'LOGHLIN asked the Minister representing the Minister of Trade and Customs, upon notice - What are the particular reasons for the unseemly delay that has occurred in issuing the necessary proclamations to bring into effect the Navigation Act that has been passed by Parliament and received the King's assent? 55 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answer is - Before the Navigation Act can be proclaimed to come into operation, a great deal of preliminary work must be carried out. As the honorable senator is aware, the Act deals mainly with general principles, leaving the details to be dealt with by regulation. There are nearly 100 different matters requiring to be so dealt with, and the regulations are now being drafted. These and their accompanying instructions to officers will occupy many pages of printed matter. So far this work has been efficiently carried out by the Departmental Oflicer, who assisted at the passage of the Bill, with the necessary clerical assistance. Now, however, a staff of expert officers is being formed. As a first step a Director of Navigation is being appointed. The applications for the position close on the 18th instant, and an early appointment will be made. Expert nautical and engineering officers will then be appointed to deal with the technical work of their several departments. Apart from the above, a great mass of detail work has to be attended to in connexion with the questions of exemptions of foreign and other ships provided for in the Act, the formation of staffs in the ports throughout the Commonwealth, the taking over of the pilotage services and properties, and other matters too numerous to mention. There is no desire on the part of the Government to delay the operation of the Act. The preparatory work is being pushed on with, and so soon as such can safely be done, the proclamation bringing the Act into operation will be issued. 55 KPE 0 0 KEATING, John Senator KEATING - Arising out of the answer just given by the Minister, might I ask if, as the regulations, as indicated by him, are to be so extensive and comprehensive, a sufficient interval of time will be allowed by the Government to enable honorable members to obtain some acquaintance with them before the Act of which the regulations will form a part will come into operation? 55 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I shall bring before my colleague the suggestion that the honorable senator's request be complied with. 55 JXJ 0 0 NEEDHAM, Edward Senator NEEDHAM - Arising out of the answer given by the Vice-President of the Executive Council, which was very long and comprehensive, I ask whether the honorable senator can tell the Senate in plain language when the Act will be proclaimed. 55 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - No, I cannot. 56 56 KPE 0 0 KEATING, John Senator KEATING asked the Minister of Defence, upon notice - The number of riding schools in connexion with the Defence Department of the Commonwealth ? The location of each? The number of further riding schools projected? The location of these latter? 56 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - The answers are - 1 and 2. With the exception of a small manége at Victoria Barracks, Sydney, there is no properly-equipped riding school or manege belonging to the Defence Department. In Melbourne the riding school and manége occupied by the police are made use of for elementary instruction in riding. The remainder of the training is carried out in the country or in suitable open spaces in the vicinity of the drill halls. In other places the whole of the instruction is carried out in the open. 3 and 4. It is proposed to provide suitable manèges for the instruction of the mounted men of the citizen forces at all stations where more than one mounted unit, exclusive of light horse, exist. These stations, as the forces at present stand, will be Brisbane, Newcastle, Sydney, Melbourne, Ballarat, Adelaide, Perth, Launceston, Hobart. As the force expands, the number of localities will correspondingly increase. 56 Supply of Sleepers : Contract for Earthworks 56 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH asked the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs, upon notice - What is the intention of the Government in the matter of the cancellation of the karri sleeper contract? What is the estimated deficiency of sleepers at present? In what way does the Government propose to supply that deficiency? 56 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answers are - 1 to 3. The number of sleepers yet to be supplied is 1,100,000. The contract for powellised karri sleepers entered into with the Western Australian Government was cancelled. Arrangements arc being completed with the Western Australian Government for 500,000 powellised karri sleepers, and at the option of the Commonwealth 500,000 jarrah sleepers, which will only leave about 100,000 to be provided for should the Commonwealth decide to exercise in full the option to purchase the jarrah sleepers from the Western Australian Government. 56 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - Arising out of the answer to my question, I ask the Minister whether it is true that the Federal Government have loaded the contract referred to with conditions which the Western Australian Government will find it almost impossible to comply with? 56 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - I am not aware that such is the case. Motion (by Senator Lynch) agreed to - That all papers relating to the letting of the contract to Mr. Teesdale Smith for a section of the. earthworks on the transcontinental railway be laid on the table of the House. 56 JZC ALP 0 0 O'LOGHLIN, James Senator O'LOGHLIN asked the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs, upon notice - Is it a fact that during recess the construction of a section of the East-West Railway was let to a contractor without public competition? 56 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answer is - The Engineer-in-Chief for Commonwealth railways represented that it was necessary that a suction of the earthworks on the railway line, where it crossed the tablelands, should be done immediately; that the contractor for an adjacent State railway was just finishing, and was ready with men and plant to take on the work at slightly lower rates than his contract with the State for similar work in similar country. He recommended that in view of the urgency of the matter and the report of the Supervising Engineer, that he could not do the work in the time, and the prices were justified, the opportunity of having the work clone immediately be seized, and a contract let to the State contractor at below State rates, which was done. 56 56 K2D 0 0 READY, Rudolph Senator READY asked the Minister representing the Prime Minister, upon notice - Has the Prime Minister had a consultation with the High Commissioner (Sir George Reid) with reference to the inquiry asked for by the Federal Fruit Commission to investigate the many grave statements made in evidence as to the conditions under which Australian fruit is marketed in Great Britain? Does the Government's refusal to send members of the Fruit Commission to London to make these investigations mean that no inquiry of any kind whatever is to be held on the methods of distribution in Great Britain? If not, what form does the Government intend that the inquiry should take, and who will be intrusted with its prosecution? 56 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - The answers are- Yes. No. Inquiries will be made through Governmental agencies, but I do not think it advisable to give particulars at present. 57 57 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE asked the Minister representing the Treasurer, upon notice - Is it true that the Ministry, at the recent Premiers' Conference, promised to aid in the locking of the Murray River by a contribution of £1,000,000? If so, under what conditions will the contribution be made, and what safeguards as to its proper expenditure will the Commonwealth provide? Is the payment to be provided for in the next Estimates, or will it be spread over a term of years? Is it intended to introduce legislation this session to give effect to the proposed grant? 57 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - In answer to the honorable senator's question, I beg to lay on the table of the Senate a copy of the agreement arrived at. 57 57 JXJ 0 0 NEEDHAM, Edward Senator NEEDHAM asked the Minister representing the Minister of Trade and Customs, upon notice - What further steps, if any, have been taken in connexion with the taking over of the lighthouses by the Commonwealth Government? Is anything being done to give improved accommodation to the lighthouse-keepers, and a more regular supply of stores, &c.? Is anything being done to give improved facilities for the education of the children of lighthouse-keepers? 57 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answers are - The Director of Lighthouses, inspecting officers, engineers, and clerical officers have been appointed. These officers have been engaged upon the necessary work preparatory to transfer, as well as proceeding with the work in connexion with the erection of new lights. With a view to preventing the imposition of two taxes for one service rendered to shipping, the States have been approached to remit light dues equivalent to the expenditure of which they will be relieved. and 3. These matters are being considered, but cannot be dealt with until the transfer has been effected. 57 57 K0F 0 0 PEARCE, George Senator PEARCE asked the Minister of Defence, upon notice - Are there two dredgers being constructed for the Defence Department? When were the contracts placed for these dredgers? With what firms? What time was given for completion and delivery? What arrangements have been made for putting together the dredger from England? 57 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - The answers are - Yes. and 3. (a) Poole and Steel, Balmain, Sydney. Contract placed 25th November, 1912 ; (6) Fleming and Ferguson, Paisley, Scotland. Contract placed 12th April, 1913. Poole and Steel's dredger was due for completion on 25th March, 1914, but an extension to 31st July, 1914, has been applied for. Fleming and Ferguson contracted to complete their dredger, and have it ready for shipment in eight months. It will be re-erected at Cockatoo Island Dockyard, Sydney. 57 57 K22 0 0 BLAKEY, Albert Senator BLAKEY asked the Minister representing the Postmaster-General, upon notice - Is it a fact that. a new postage stamp is intended to be issued bearing on the face thereof an alleged representation of a kookaburra? If so, will a portrait of the King's head be shown thereon also? 57 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - The answers are - Yes. No. The King's head will be on the twopenny stamp. 57 Suppression of Industrial Disturbances 57 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE asked the Minister of Defence, upon notice- - In view of the reported official statement that the British Minister for War has intimated to military officers and privates resident in Ulster that they will not be compelled to serve in any operations which may be necessary in that Province, will he provide for similar privileges being conceded to Australian citizen soldiers now liable to aid in the forcible suppression of industrial disturbances? 57 KUL LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - In answer to the honorable senator's question, I would remind him that the action of the British Minister for War, to which he refers, necessitated the retirement of that gentleman from the Ministry. I have no intention of following his example, nor desire to share his fate. 57 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - Arising out of the Minister's reply, I ask the honorable senator whether it is not a fact that the Imperial Government, and not the retired Minister for War, Colonel Seely, have issued an order or regulation to the effect indicated in my previous question ? 57 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN - As I read the cablegram, it is entirely to the contrary. 58 58 JXV ALP; NAT from 1917 0 0 NEWLANDS, John Senator NEWLANDS asked the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs, upon notice - Is the work of constructing conduits in Flinders and Franklin streets, Adelaide, being done departmentally and by day labour, or is the work being done by contract? If by contract, when were tenders called? What is the contract price per chain? 58 KQ4 LP 1 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McCOLL - Inquiry is being made, and a reply will be furnished as early as possible. 58 58 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - Yesterday I asked a question on a matter of pressing importance. I wanted to know from the Government what was their intention about improving the back stair approaches to the Ministerial offices. 58 10000 0 0 PRESIDENT, The The PRESIDENT - Order ! The honorable senator is not entitled to repeat the question now, but only to indicate its purport in a general way. 58 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - In asking this question, I wanted some information. 58 KLZ 0 0 GOULD, Albert Senator Lt Colonel Sir Albert Gould - The time for asking questions without notice has gone by. 58 10000 0 0 PRESIDENT, The The PRESIDENT - Order ! Let me hear what the honorable senator has to say. 58 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - I wanted some information about a matter which, at all events, appeared to me to be one of pressing public importance. I find, to my astonishment, that the question, although I have looked the notice-paper up and down, does not appear; and I should like to know from you, sir, who is responsible for its non-appearance - by what authority has it been eliminated from the notice-paper ? 58 10000 0 0 PRESIDENT, The The PRESIDENT - It was by my authority that the question was not inserted in the notice-paper. The honorable senator asked, without notice, yesterday a question of, I think, the Minister representing the Minister of Home Affairs. I have a copy of it here, and the Minister asked him to give notice. I am responsible for seeing that the business of the Senate is conducted in a proper fashion, and -in accordance with the rules and practice of Parliament. Questions are only permissible when they are asked for the purpose of eliciting information, and, in addition to that, they should be couched in proper parliamentary language. It was quite obvious to me that this question was not framed in such a way as to elicit information; it was framed for quite a different purpose; and for that reason I, in pursuance of the authority vested in me, accepted, the responsibility of refusing to allow it to be placed on the notice-paper. 58 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - I can only say that when I want to elicit information I am exercising a right which every individual member of the Chamber has, and ought to enjoy. 58 10000 0 0 PRESIDENT, The The PRESIDENT - Order! The honorable senator is not entitled to discuss my ruling unless he is prepared to move that it be disagreed with. 58 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator Lynch - I shall take advantage of the debate on the Address-in-Reply to ventilate this grievance. 58 leave of absence Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- That two months' leave of absence be granted to Senator Clemons on the ground of ill-health. Motion (by Senator Keating) agreed to- That two months' leave of absence be granted to Senator Bakhap on account of urgent private business. 58 miscellaneous Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- That the days of meeting of the Senate during the present session, unless otherwise ordered, be Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday of each week; and that the hour of meeting, unless otherwise ordered, be three o'clock in the afternoon of Wednesday and Thursday, and eleven o'clock in the forenoon of Friday. 58 miscellaneous Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- " That during the present session, unless otherwise ordered, the sittings of the Senate, or of a committee of the whole Senate, on sitting days other than Fridays, be suspended from 6.30 p.m. to 8 p.m., and on Fridays from 1 p.m. to 2.30 p.m. 59 miscellaneous Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- That during the present session, unless otherwise ordered, at Pour o'clock p.m. on Fridays the President shall put the question, That the Senate do now adjourn, which question shall not be open to debate; if the Senate be in Committee at that hour the Chairman shall in like manner put the question, That he do leave the chair and report to the Senate; and upon such report being made the President shall forthwith put the question, That the Senate do now adjourn, which question shall not be open to debate. Provided that if the Senate or the Committee be in division at the time named, the President or the Chairman shall not put the question referred to until the result of such division has been declared; and if the business under discussion shall not have been disposed of at such adjournment, it shall appear on the business paper for the next sitting day. 59 order of business Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- That on Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday during the present session, unless otherwise ordered, Government business take precedence of all other business on the notice-paper, except questions and formal motions, and except that private business take precedence of Government business on Thursday after 8 p.m. ; and that, unless otherwise ordered, private Orders of the Day take precedence of private notices of motion on alternate Thursdays. 59 miscellaneous The following Sessional Committees were appointed (on motion by Senator Millen) : - Standing Orders Committee The President, Chairman of Committees, Senators Clemons, Lieut.-Colonel Sir Albert Gould, Guthrie, McGregor, Pearce, Russell, and Turley, with power to act during the recess, and to confer or sit with a similar committee of the House of Representatives. The President, Senators Buzacott, de Largie, Lieut.-Colonel Sir Albert Gould, Keating, Lynch, and Stewart, with power to act during the recess, and to confer or sit as a joint committee with a similar committee of the House of Representatives. The President, Senators Bakhap, Long, McColl, McDougall, Needham, and Story, with power to act during the recess, and to confer or sit as a joint committee with a similar committee of the House of Representatives. Printing Committee Senators Barker, Blakey, Gardiner, Henderson, Oakes, Rae, and Ready, with power to confer or sit as a joint committee with a similar committee of the House of Representatives. > 59 bill Motion (by Senator Millen) agreed to- That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to amend the Defence Act 1903-1912. 59 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter paragraph 1 of section 51 of the Constitution. Bill presented and read a first time. 59 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter paragraph 20 of section 51 of the Constitution. Bill presented and read a first time. 59 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter the Constitution by empowering the Parliament to make laws with respect to trusts, combinations, and monopolies. Bill presented and read a first time. 59 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter paragraph 35 of section 51 of the Constitution. Bill presented and read a first time. 59 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter the Constitution by empowering the Parliament to make laws with respect to industrial disputes in relation to employment in State railway services. Bill presented and read a first time. 60 bill Motion (by Senator McGregor) agreed to - That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act to alter the Constitution by empowering the Parliament to make laws with respect to industries and businesses declared to be the subject of a monopoly. Bill presented and read a first time. 60 miscellaneous Motion (by Senator Keating) agreed to- That there be placed upon the table of the Senate copies of - "The general knowledge" paper set for candidates for entrance to the Royal Military College at the examinations held in October last. The examiners' comments on the work sent in by the candidates in response to such paper; also a statement of the number of candidates for whom such paper was set, and the range of their ages. 60 miscellaneous Motion (by Senator Keating) agreed to - That there be laid upon the table of the Library all correspondence and documents In possession or control of the Government relative to the acquisition for the Commonwealth of the Australian patent rights in respect to the Brennan mono-rail. 60 special adjournment 60 KUL New South Wales LP 1 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator MILLEN . - I move - That the Senate, at its rising, adjourn until Wednesday, 29th April. With a knowledge of what is transpiring elsewhere, honorable senators will understand the reason for taking this step, which is entirely usual under the circumstances. I am not wedded to the date mentioned in the motion. I see no particular virtue in the 29th, or any other date in the calendar month; but I bring this proposal forward as being the usual, and certainly an extremely moderate, adjournment. At the same time, I am entirely in the hands of the Senate. 60 KRZ Western Australia 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH . - I suppose we must take notice of coming . events, and an adjournment such as this is what usually occurs about this time, but in fixing on the. 29th as the date for re-assembling little consideration is shown for those senators who represent distant States, particularly those from Western Australia. I would suggest three weeks as a fair adjournment, and if the Minister will propose to adjourn for that period, I am prepared to second his motion. I would point out that it takes a week for Western Australian senators to return to their own State, and another week for them to get back to Melbourne, and if the adjournment is merely for a fortnight, they will be precluded from visiting their constituencies. In that respect their position is entirely different from that of senators representing other States. 60 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator Rae - You have been away from your State for only about five minutes. 60 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator LYNCH - Even five minutes is too long to be absent from a good thing. If we return here on the 29th inst., we may then find that there is no work for us to proceed with. In these circumstances, I would suggest to the Leader of the Senate the reasonableness of amending his motion so as to make the 6th May the date of our reassembling. 60 K1Z New South Wales 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE . - I disagree with the motion which has been submitted by the Minister of Defence, but for entirely different reasons from those put forward by Senator Lynch. I am of opinion that we have no right to run away from our work immediately we have commenced it. 60 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - This is a reversal of form. 60 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - It is a reversal of form by the Minister. When, last session, the Opposition desired an adjournment of the Senate from day to day, until a certain motion was disposed of in another place, he refused that adjournment, and he did so in defiance of what he himself pronounced to be the universal practice. Personally, I fail to see why we should play second fiddle to the other Chamber by acting in this way. But, in accordance with what the Minister declared to be the usual practice when a motion of censure was submitted in another place- 60 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - What the Government accept as a motion of censure. 61 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - The fact remains that the Minister is proposing an inconsistent and anomalous course by reversing the form which he exhibited last session. I wish to point out that if we decided to adjourn from day to day, we would then be in a position to resume the consideration of business the moment that the censure motion in the other Chamber was disposed of. What right have we to assume that the debate upon that motion will occupy two or three weeks ? 61 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator Long - We want work. 61 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - While I do not profess to want work, when there is work to be done I want to see it done. 61 K1I 0 0 BARKER, Stephen Senator Barker - There is no work on the business paper. 61 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - I wish honorable senators would not talk before they understand the position. 61 K1I 0 0 BARKER, Stephen Senator Barker - We understand it. 61 K1Z 0 0 RAE, Arthur Senator RAE - The honorable senator does not. All the referenda Bills which have been introduced by his leader appear upon the business paper, and if the honorable senator does not say that their consideration involves work, he does not know what work means. This Chamber should meet as early as possible to consider those proposals, in order that they may receive that amount of attention which their importance merits. Of course, it may be urged that we shall have an opportunity of dealing with them at a later stage, but I am one of those who desire to give full consideration to all Government measures which may be brought forward. For that reason, I say that we ought to remain here, and as we cannot possibly say how long the motion of censure will be pending, we ought to be in ,a position to resume work the moment it is disposed of. I enter my emphatic protest against the proposed adjournment. 61 KKZ New South Wales 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER . - I think that the fortnight's adjournment proposed by the Minister of Defence is a reasonable ons, but, at the same time, he would be extending more considerate treatment to the representatives of Western Australia if he acquiesced 'in the request of Senator Lynch. I ask the Leader of the Government in this -Chamber to alter the date of his motion from the 29th April to 6th May.. 61 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - I have moved the motion ; let the honorable senator propose to amend it. 61 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I do not wish to take the control of business out of the hands of the Government any more than .is necessary. Although I think that our presence will be required here before a fortnight has elapsed, I would like the convenience of the representatives of distant States to be considered to the extent suggested by Senator Lynch. 61 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - If the honorable senator will move a,n amendment in that direction, I will accept it. 61 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I have already said that I .have no desire to take the control of business out of the hands of the Government. 61 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - And I do not wish to thrust my views upon anybody. 61 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I did nob rise to cross the Minister in any way. If there is one thing more than another which is calculated to weaken the Government it is the willingness of the Opposition to conduct its business for it. I am anxious to support the Minister of Defence all that I can, within the brief period that is at our disposal. As the honorable gentleman and his colleagues understand what business they have to transact, it might, perhaps, be just as well to accept the motion which he has submitted. But when a request is made for an adjournment for a week longer, it is for the Minister to say whether or not he will go a little out of his way to accede to it. The date upon which we shall reassemble in this Chamber is a matter of absolute indifference to me. I will not use the forms of the Senate to criticise the Minister in any way. 61 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - Let the honorable senator use the forms of the Senate to give expression to his views. 61 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I have no desire to do that. I merely ask the Minister to accept the suggestion which has been put forward by Senator Lynch. Whether the adjournment is for a week, a fortnight, or three weeks, is a matter of indifference to me, I shall be here on whatever date is fixed for the resumption of business, and I merely rose to ascertain whether the Leader of the Government in this Chamber is prepared to acquiesce in the view which has been expressed by Senator Lynch. 62 KUL 0 0 MILLEN, Edward Senator Millen - Put it in the form of an amendment. 62 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - I did that on a previous occasion, and found myself beaten by my own party. I am not going to incur the risk again. Not being in the councils of leaders of my party, or of the Government, I have not the slightest desire to endeavor to bump the combined forces of the Government and the Opposition. 62 JU7 0 0 DE LARGIE, Hugh Senator De Largie - What about the division of opinion in the honorable senator's own party? 62 KKZ 0 0 GARDINER, Albert Senator GARDINER - The leader of my party, Senator Stewart, may move an amendment if he chooses, and if he does I will support him. Personally, I am not concerned as to the date upon which we reassemble, but I see no reason why the Minister should not accede to the request of Senator Lynch. If, however, he refuses to do so; I shall be perfectly satisfied. 62 KRX Tasmania 0 0 LONG, James Senator LONG .- I desire to support the request of Senator Lynch for a three weeks' adjournment, in lieu of a fortnight, in order that Queensland and Western Australian senators may have the same opportunity that is enjoyed by Tasmanian and South Australian senators of returning to their homes. We know that a certain motion has been submitted in another place, and I venture to say that it will take the Leader of the Opposition and his party there quite three weeks to say all that they have to say of the Government and their works. Even then they will have omitted a great deal which ought to be said. Seeing that it is proposed that the Senate should adjourn for a fortnight, we might as well go the whole hog and extend reasonable consideration to the representatives of distant States in this Chamber. The Minister will be well advised if he accedes to the request of Senator Lynch. 62 KRZ 0 0 LYNCH, Patrick Senator Lynch - The Senate will grant him leave to amend his motion. 62 KRX 0 0 LONG, James Senator LONG - There is no doubt about that. But the honorable gentleman appears to be troubled with that little bit of irritableness which often characterizes his conduct of business here. I do hope that he will grant the request which has been preferred by Senator Lynch. 62 KTD New South Wales 0 0 MCDOUGALL, Allan Senator McDOUGALL . - Like Senator Rae, my comrade from New South Wales, I do not believe in any adjournment at all. I think the Senate should meet again next Wednesday, and if the. Minister of Defence will accept an amendment to that effect, I am prepared to move it. There was a time in the history of the Senate, and it was only about twelve months ago, when I should have liked very much to have an adjournment for three weeks or six weeks, because a battle was pending in New South Wales at the time. Senator Oakes was equally willing to have an adjournment at that time, and he took it. However, that battle is over, and I am confident that Senator Oakes is so satisfied with the result that he does not want any more holidays like that. The second ballots are all over in New South Wales, and we are quite contented. I repeat that I do not wish to have any adjournment at this stage, and should like to see the Senate meet again next Wednesday. 62 K7D Queensland 0 0 STEWART, James Senator STEWART . - This appears to be a very important question, and is receiving a considerable amount of discussion. I have always been opposed to these adjournments. I have thought it most desirable that the Senate should continue to transact its business, even though a vote of no-confidence in the Government may have been moved in another place. But the force of other opinions has become too strong for me, and I am now, I suppose, a convert to this old-fashioned idea. In any case those of us who opposed these adjournments hitherto have not been able to make any impression upon members generally. The question to-day is between an adjournment for two weeks as proposed by Senator Millen and an adjournment for three weeks as suggested by Senator Lynch and other honorable senators. Probably Senator Millen has inside information as to how long the debate in another place is to be allowed to continue. Probably the Government have come to some conclusion that honorable members in another place are to be allowed to blow off steam for about two weeks, and then the play is to end. We have no information on that point. If at the close of an adjournment for two weeks we are summoned back here and find the other House still hammering. away at the no-confidence motion, we shall be among the unemployed once more, with this difference, fortunately for us, that our pay will be going on all the time. I think there is a good deal in the statements of Senator Lynch and other honorable senators that a two weeks' adjournment is of no use to honorable senators from Western Australia and Queensland. Honorable senators from New South Wales, South Australia and Tasmania are almost at home when attending this Parliament. They go home every weekend, and sometimes stay at home over the following week. It seems to me that they are altogether too near their homes, and very often put other members of the Senate to a great deal of inconvenience. I favour a three weeks' adjournment. I am sure that honorable senators from Western Australia desire to go home. Seeing that a double dissolution is pending, they want to interview their supporters. I am sure, also, that honorable senators from Queensland think in very much the same way. I should like very much to go to Queensland, but two weeks is too short a time to enable me to do so. I do not know why Senator Lynch did not move an amendment to give effect to his suggestion, or why Senator Gardiner, who was so anxious to support a three weeks' adjournment, did not move such an amendment. There may be some reason for their unwillingness that does not appear on the surface. It is certainly not evident to me. When I think that a thing is right, and I want it, I am prepared to move to get it. I therefore move: - That the words "29th April" be left out, with a view to insert in lieu thereof the words "6th May." Question - That the words proposed to be left out be left out - put. The Senate divided. 16 12 Majority ... ... 4 AYES NOES Question so resolved in the affirmative. Amendment agreed to. Question as amended resolved in the affirmative. 63 adjournment 63 Motion (by Senator Millen) proposed - That the Senate do now adjourn. 63 JXJ Western Australia 0 0 NEEDHAM, Edward Senator NEEDHAM . - I desire to ask the Vice-President of the Executive Council if between now and the resumption of the sittings of the Senate he will obtain the information for which I have sought in connexion with the industrial difficulty at the Kalgoorlie end of the transcontinental railway, and also in connexion with the undergrounding of telephone wires in Perth. 63 KQ4 0 0 MCCOLL, James Senator McColl - I shall be very glad to obtain the information. Question resolved in the affirmative. 63 16:37:00 Senate adjourned at 4.37 p.m.