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Message ID: 10111
Date: Mon Nov 15 18:49:07 GMT 1999
Author: Kyle Q
Subject: Re: RE: RE: Bellow song Damage
----- Original Message -----
From: Kimes, Dean W. <Dean_Kimes@...>
To: <eqbards@onelist.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 1999 1:08 PM
Subject: RE: [eqbards] RE: RE: Bellow song Damage
> From: "Kimes, Dean W." <Dean_Kimes@...>
>
> If you jump off a 10 story building you will fall. That is a fact.
> If you jump off a 10 story building you will die. That is not a fact.
>
> You are the only person I know who does not know the difference between a
> fact and an opinion.
>
> Maybe Bards eventually become better than Shamans in melee, but not at
level
> 17. Dual wield was not sufficient to prevent me from being pummeled due
to
> the numerous stuns I received. All shamans have slam. Sure it never goes
> up, but it is still sufficient to stun a 17th level bard.
>
> Bards are better than all hybrids in magical power? Under what microscope
> did you determine that? At lower levels its obviously true as the other
> hybrids have no magical power. Hmm lets examine them at higher levels.
> Paladin get Greater Heal, 400 hp that's 3 minutes worth of Hymn with a
lute
> and it takes them less time than that to meditate back the mana. They
also
> get Revive at their utmost level of spell use. Not to mention Lay Hands.
> Rangers probably have the weakest line of spells getting nothing above
Heal,
> though they do get Wolf Form, cool but not overly powerful. Shadowknights
> spells are fearsome. The Engulfing Darkness DoT line is devastating as it
> destroys our best defense, Acellerando and it stacks with their Heat
Blood.
> They also now have the lifetap series. All this aside their Harm Touch
> alone is a devastating if slow to recharge weapon. We do have a greater
> number of spells than the other hybrids do though. Are our abilities
> obviously better, I would not say so. Better in a full group of six
maybe,
> better in small groups, that's not apparent. Even if we were better it
> certainly would not be 5-6 times better and that's how the other hybrids
> relate to us in terms of melee skills.
>
> Now since I have stated that bards magical abilities might not be so much
> better than some of the other hybrids, rangers excluded as their spells
are
> truly weak, feel free to call me a liar. That will just be one more
> definition you will need to look up on Merriam-Webster Online, right after
> 'fact'.
>
> To further turn your argument around:
> Bards cannot beat any caster consistently in pure magical combat. (though
> I've come close with Maxell MR)
> Bards cannot beat any other hybrid or melee type consistently in pure
melee
> combat.
>
> Neither of those statements however true prove we are weaker than those
> classes any more than yours prove we are equal in power. In my opinion,
we
> are weaker than several of the other classes. The weakness is not
generally
> overbearing but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be corrected. To be honest
I
> think a realignment of our skills would suffice to bridge the gap without
> modifications to our spells other than including the missing ones and
fixing
> the broken ones. An added melee skill like Parry which succeeds more
often
> than Dodge, and some raised caps on skills that are currently of debatable
> usefulness would help as well. Most Jack-of-all-trades are seen as
> self-sufficient characters while we are definitely not designed to be very
> capable on our own. We do best in groups due to the nature of our spells.
> It is this very grouping nature that further undermines the usefulness of
> our other skills as there will often be present others in the group whose
> skill so far overshadows ours in those other areas that we might as well
not
> have the skill at all. There is no benefit to having Find Traps and Pick
> Locks when there is a rogue in the group with more than double your skill.
> If we were meant to be characters who could function on their own and do
> nearly everything, if not well, that would be different. However, we are
> not. We are meant to group and for every member we add to our group some
of
> our skills become superfluous just as our magical powers become more
potent.
>
> Kitasi
>
>
> From: "Wayne Sheppard" <mrwayne@...>
>
> 1. Bards are better than all Pure Casters and Priests in melee. (MAG, WIZ,
> ENC, NEC, CLR, SHA, DRU)
> 2. Bards are better than all hybrids in magical power. (PAL, RNG, SK)
>
> The above statements are facts and cannot be disputed. Every Bard should
> understand these facts.
>
> If someone tries to contradict one of the above statements, I will point
> them out as a liar. Especially to those Bards who have been on this list
> quite a while.
>
>
> As to the nature of my messages, in the past I have made some poor
choices.
> But I've tried to do better. I looked at my last five messages and saw
> nothing out of the ordinary. I'd be glad to discuss any of my posts with
> you or anyone else in private, not on the list.
>
>
> Wayne
>
>
> > From: "G.W. Willman, IV" <gww6e@...>
> > Subject: RE: RE: Bellow song Damage
> >
> > Wayne,
> >
> > Just curious, what server do you play on and do you play a bard?
The
> > reason I ask is because you emails are consistently sniping in nature
and
> > generally flamebait. I'll be the first to defend your right to free
> speech
> > however I would ask that you perhaps temper somewhat your future remarks
> > with the fact this is a public forum meant for discussion -- closing
doors
> > via naked accusations and bombastic proclamations offers little room for
> > such to take place on a mutually respectful level.
>
> Please send submissions for the eqbards newsletter to lol@...
> with the subject submissions.
>
> > Please send submissions for the eqbards newsletter to lol@...
with the subject submissions.
>