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Message ID: 5157
Date: Tue Aug 10 22:54:00 BST 1999
Author: Shadowmoon
Subject: Re: I'm dying I think, that is bored (OT)
>From: "Roop Dirump" <roop@...>if
>
>
>I know this is a long post, my friends, but it's probably my very last post
>to this group, so I appologize. I apologize in advance for the language,
>you are sensitive, stop now.what
>
>There is no death in EverQuest, except psychologically. And I'm dying, I
>think.
>I have loved this list like no other board've known in some years. It is
>highly intellectual, why I bother you with this damned heavy luggage.
>
>Bored. I'm bored. Thinking of quiting because of it. Boredom, I imagine,
>would be probably the worst reason a designer would fear someone would give
>up on their massive online game like this. Boredom, really, is almost the
>worst of an insult. Someone is angry, that's better. They feel something,
>they're emotional about it, a love-turned-to-hate kind of thing, acceptable
>and expected. But boredom? Boredom, apathy, that's a lack of everything
>good. That would be scarry, at least if I were a developer, and that's
>I am: not a developer but bored.fight,
>
>Ah well, but boredom has it's good sides. It's a slower kind of emotion,
>lets you think. When you're bored, you're less apt to just quit outright,
>and instead ponder why, in fact, you ARE bored. So I've thought on it, and
>it's off-topic but I couldn't give a rat's ass but I'm posting it here
>because this is the only discussion area I've found where maybe someone
>could say something, anything, though I somehow doubt it would help.
>
>* It runs deep, I think. There is no wandering. Everyone stays put.
>Camping is a problem, everyone says, and we have all these solutions
>suggested and implemented. But, mmmm, none will work! Camping is central
>to EverQuest! Everyone camps! Everywhere! Been to Unrest? How else do
>you survive there but "camp the wall?" These people aren't camping for
>items, but just to play. Folks camp every dungeon, every outdoor zone.
>I've been to West Karanas and watched folks pulling lions to the wall. And
>it's the same everywhere else. Was suggested by a friend, since I so
>loathed camping, to play the south Karanas. I am currently "camped" there
>now, because that's all anyone does in such an outdoor zone as well!
>
>I remember Brad McQuaid discussing this, and saying it's the path of least
>resistance. How he and his buddies would group up, and move through
>permafrost together, eventually reaching some deep section, then heading
>back to quit for the evening. This is an ideal, I wish I could be in THAT
>group, because I have NEVER ever ever ever been in a group like that. GOD
>YES I wish that was how Everquest REALLY worked the WAY he said!!! Seeing
>such a dungeon, I think he's bullshitting because it seems impossible!
>
>I've been in Everfrost, and it gets insanely more difficult the deeper you
>go. Like waves. If I'm in a level 20 average group in Everfrost, we will
>find things easy at first, then we'll find a few MOBs that are a good
>as we go on we Find some hard ones, then we are immedietly overwhelmed andanyway.
>dead. If our group is around level 30 in level, well, then maybe we have a
>chance: Yet we'd still get no experience for the early part, still get
>overwhelmed by wall bugs.
>
>So folks camp. They find the area where things give them experience, sit
>there for a few hours, and let one person bring the nasties to them. And
>the warriors are always healing, and the mages are always meditating
>So the game -requires- camping in this respect. We aren't choosing thehim.
>"path of least resistance" because I, for one, do not know what the hell
>McQuaid is talking about. I'd love to see him and his group play. Either
>your group can Handle the best of a dungeon, in which case they get no
>experience as they battle their way through it to the end, or they camp the
>area where they get it.
>
>Back to Unrest. A while back I was O so bored "camping the wall" as it
>were, and someone suggested we hit the Magi Room and camp that. I was
>actually Happy to be moving in a group, finally. We might not have been
>moving for long, but at least we were on the move. Most of the group were
>in the room and settled, but one fellow was lost. I went out and found
>No songs or spells, nothing fancy, we were just walking back up the stairs.it.
>At the edge of the stairs everything in the basement and attic attacked me
>at once. I had time to read the message, "HITS YOU" before death came
>lurking. Do NOT move about through dungeons, stay in one place and camp
>The bugs, not to mention class requirements, warrant it.and
>
>If McQuaid would like bands of adventurers to be heroically moving about
>adventuring, rather than sitting around like white trash in a JellyStonemages
>Park, why is it like this? O, fighters need time to sit and heal, and
>need time to replenish mana. The game encourages camping by all it'show
>downtime.
>
>I say it's perfectly ridiculous, actually. Especially warriors
>complaining!! "I broke my leg and it actually takes me 3 whole minutes to
>regenerate the wound! This is not fair!" Bah! It is all perfectly
>ridiculous. I had a friend in traction 10 months for an accident.
>
>:My solution: No natural regeration of wounds, for anyone. This is not
>wounds work, afterall. A warrior is wounded, make no natural regenerationcleric.
>but increase effect of bandages. They want healing, find a freaking
>but
>No regeneration of mana either. I know there's no real-world counter-part,
>which others would point out THIS IS A GAME anyway in the last argument,
>we're talking logic. Mana, where does it come from? The physics of mana?source
>Where is this pure energy coming from? Apparently Norrath does have
>gravity, and follows Einstein, so we must assume Energy cannot be just
>created out of thin air. It needs a source.... The soul I always assumed,
>but that can only supply so much. So I say any mana user must find a
>of their mana and cast a spell, a place where they take their mana from.spell.
>That UFO in Qeynos would be a good place. But at higher levels, I say
>better places to find where one can channel mana from. When one needs more
>mana, they must teleport there, at least in spirit, through a complex
>Enough with everyone sitting on their duffs. Burn mana in a battle, runand
>hope you're not chased to find a private spot to channel spirit spell toMOBs
>regain all your lost mana. I want the game to require people to be on THE
>MOVE and not encourage them to sit around like they're lazy.
>
>* AI lacking. In a massively multiplayer game it should be better,
>especially one that is so Player vs. Environment based. This is AI that
>was seen in Doom, if that. The wonder of AI that some folks are impressed
>by how it acts, when it's actions are not that complex. MUST be improved.
>When I fight this AI, it makes me bored.
>
>:I want to see a wandering band of orcs that act as a team. A leader, a
>cleric, and grunts. Grunts will break off when even less than half wounded
>to let others take the brunt, grunts will protect cleric, team will fall
>apart when leader dies. I want to see ALL MOBs not be so damn still. You
>get in a Duel and everyone moves, and tactics begin to come into play.
>use no tactics, they stand still and things get very boring. One MOB isworks
>like any other, just higher level and maybe with different spells.
>
>* Tradeskills are lacking. I have a feeling, given a year, this may work
>out.
>
>* Death. There is no death. I want to die. I cannot die. Who were the
>generation before this, the immortal generation? Totally ignored by the
>story of the game.
>
>* The story is too static. One of Brad McQuaid's problems with adding
>monsters that offer random cool items was that it wouldn't work in the
>story. I can understand this point perfectly, yet people would always be
>camping anyway because that's all they ever do. But back to the story.
>
>The story, is, rather interesting. But this is not the story for a
>massively online roleplaying game. This is the story for a single player
>game! Let's take, for example, the story of Crushbone.
>
>One can jump an orc courier a bit ways off from Crush. Eventually one
>their way to Crushbone, finding many interesting things going on, ananyone
>alliance with dark elves for instance. One fights their way through there,
>and eventually finds a one ambassador Dvinn! Ah HAH! And slay him.
>
>Problem. That courier is always delivering notes, ambassador Dvinn will
>always be undergoing negotiations. Kill him? No matter.
>
>It is like a moment locked in time, it never changes. No matter what
>does, the NPCs will always be locked in that moment, regardless what levelplayer
>the real folk have gotten to. The "plot" is unchanging. Join a massively
>online rolplaying game with an ongoing plot! There is no ongoing plot.
>Everything is the same. It always has been, always will. McQuaid wants
>people to appreciate where items come from plotwise, when they buy them or
>find them. Yet I'm afraid those subtlties are lost when it's always that
>same NPC in that same place, and they never change.
>
>:An ever evolving NPC plot, entirely dependent on PC action! How does the
>plot unfold? Almost like voting. The most PCs to do the most quests one
>way determine how a plot unfolds!
>
>Why is there a "Rescue the Princess" quest where the princess can never
>actually be rescued? Because she can't! She has to be around for the next
>guy to resuce her!! The story sucks, folks. It wants to be a single
>game, the story!!! This is not a plot for a massive role playing game,it's
>a scizophrenic single user plot.gamble.
>
>* Fix the damned NPC parser. Using Scott Adams Parser in 1999!!!! Infocom
>got it better in 1985!!!
>
>* To really encourage roleplaying and a community allow people access to an
>in-game print press. Where they can make their own newspapers or books.
>Allow people to own a deck of cards so they can play kings court and
>Make a Roulette Wheel when a PC spins it everyone can watch the text as itsquires
>clicks along.
>
>NAMELY
>
>GIVE folks options besides combat!!! I ask this, because the way combat
>works in EverQuest bores the living crap out of me. If it weren't for the
>way groups worked, "heroes" sitting around in some safe corner while
>hauled the monsters one at a time for them.... BAH!
>
>In Everquest, there's no option but combat, everything else sucks, and if
>you don't like the way combat works, well then you're fucked.
>
>Roop
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